TAI TF-X / Milli Muharip Uçak MMU Kaan

[snne]

Some fan photoshops. Gotta admit, it looks much better with a paint job.




Wait I just realized something, why does it look on the 3rd pic like as if it is flying in the Exosphere?

 

[Canardzz]

Some fan photoshops. Gotta admit, it looks much better with a paint job.

View attachment 690810View attachment 690811View attachment 690812


Wait I just realized something, why does it look on the 3rd pic like as if it is flying in the Exosphere?

Shhhhh secret feature

 

[Combat-Master]

 

[Canardzz]

NEWLY OBTAINED INFO

TF-X's engines were planned to be integrated in 2 days. It took TAI 2 hours to get it done.

Yep... we have some noice technicians.

 

[snne]

CEO Temel Kotil

"The National Combat Aircraft will fly in 2023. We planned the flight for 2025, but we revised the date."

"National Combat Aircraft has 2 F-16 engines."

"The National Combat Aircraft will be a documentary. The videos are being shot, you will cry if you see it."

"We're checking the fuel tanks and the hydraulics. We'll fuel up in the next days and then start the engines."

"5th generation planes can destroy air and ground targets from hundreds of kilometers away. So there is no need to go near the target."

"A miniaturized model of ANKA-3 unmanned warplane developed by TAI was flown, and the larger model will be revealed in the coming months."

"The flight will take place in March or April."

"It will be able to accompany TF-X, HÜRJET and other air platforms."

Here's the same statements, but with a source.

Google's translation is very rough but it is comprehensible enough.

 

[Canardzz]

UPDATE

-TAI team has started the engines of the MMU/TF-X. The ceremony date is to be decided by the presidency.
-A lighter, more agile Hürkuş, the so called Hürkuş-II, is on its way.
-The static Hürjet is currently undergoing tests, whereas the flying prototype is currently on her landing gears.
-ATAK-2 attack heli will be on her landing gears very soon.
-ANKA-3 will be massive, albeit being a little smaller than Aksungur. She will appear in the coming months.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1612729603591659521

View: https://twitter.com/M5Dergi/status/1612729603591659521?s=20&t=eYm4nKFgee28XPu9QqK6mw

 

[snne]

UPDATE

-TAI team has started the engines of the MMU/TF-X. The ceremony date is to be decided by the presidency.
-A lighter, more agile Hürkuş, the so called Hürkuş-II, is on its way.
-The static Hürjet is currently undergoing tests, whereas the flying prototype is currently on her landing gears.
-ATAK-2 attack heli will be on her landing gears very soon.
-ANKA-3 will be massive, albeit being a little smaller than Aksungur. She will appear in the coming months.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1612729603591659521

View: https://twitter.com/M5Dergi/status/1612729603591659521?s=20&t=eYm4nKFgee28XPu9QqK6mw

Some of the above are Canardzz's comments though.

Here's a direct translation of the tweet

The National Combat Aircraft started the engine

New design HÜRKUŞ is coming

T929 ATAK-2's airframe is almost finished

HÜRJET is on its landing gears, preparing for flight

ANKA-3 will appear very soon
@TUSAS_TR

@Temel_Kotil

 

[snne]

One of the engineers who work on the project shared this:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1612561082555551760

View: https://twitter.com/omrkrtt97/status/1612561082555551760?t=E2UNfrn_tLXSZP6woF_I_g&s=19

 

[Canardzz]

UPDATE

-TAI team has started the engines of the MMU/TF-X. The ceremony date is to be decided by the presidency.
-A lighter, more agile Hürkuş, the so called Hürkuş-II, is on its way.
-The static Hürjet is currently undergoing tests, whereas the flying prototype is currently on her landing gears.
-ATAK-2 attack heli will be on her landing gears very soon.
-ANKA-3 will be massive, albeit being a little smaller than Aksungur. She will appear in the coming months.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1612729603591659521

View: https://twitter.com/M5Dergi/status/1612729603591659521?s=20&t=eYm4nKFgee28XPu9QqK6mw

Some of the above are Canardzz's comments though.

Here's a direct translation of the tweet

The National Combat Aircraft started the engine

New design HÜRKUŞ is coming

T929 ATAK-2's airframe is almost finished

HÜRJET is on its landing gears, preparing for flight

ANKA-3 will appear very soon
@TUSAS_TR

@Temel_Kotil

I paraphrased the stuff that was on the article. So yeah it isn't a direct translation of the tweet.

 

[Canardzz]

TF-X's engines have not yet been powered up. Temel Kotil was misquoted. TAI is prepping the aircraft for an engine start.

 

[snne]

(Fan-made)

 

[Trident]

That looks reasonably accurate to me. Perhaps the flying surfaces should have more LE and especially less TE sweep, and the fins roots should be closer to the CL (more atop the engine nacelles). Also the tail booms look more like the old config mock-up, there does not seem to be a parallel section next to the nozzles. But it's not bad!

 

[Combat-Master]

https://twitter.com/x/status/1612731000424988672

View: https://twitter.com/gdhdefence/status/1612731000424988672?s=20

HQ image previously posted;

Engines Installed ?

 

[snne]

A close-up of the cockpit.

 

[snne]

"The stated plan has been to use Pratt & Whitney F110 engines"

this part got me

In my opinion the folks @ the Drive are generally sloppy with their reporting. I often find their articles empty, y'know what I mean? They just copy paste most of the stuff.

Anyway, here's the link for the curious.

https://www.thedrive.com/the-war-zone/unique-sensor-setup-emerges-on-turkeys-stealthy-new-fighter

 

[Canardzz]

TF-X in an early FAL stage

 

[snne]

TAI TF-X everybody. Hydraulic tests will commence at 17.00 today. Engine integration was done in 2 hours like aforementioned. Fuel system tests were also successful.

 

[Canardzz]

TAI TF-X everybody. Hydraulic tests will commence at 17.00 today. Engine integration was done in 2 hours like aforementioned. Fuel system tests were also successful.View attachment 690882

Was gonna quote myself. But it looks you've done it for me instead

 

[Canardzz]

BREAKING

TF-X will be able to autonomously return to base in case the pilot faints.

 

[Canardzz]

TF-X's CDR will be completed before the maiden flight.

 

[Nart]

BREAKING

TF-X will be able to autonomously return to base in case the pilot faints.

I get his excitement, but Mr. Kotil really needs to chill down a bit He's talking about Auto GCAS. TAI is, in fact, working on autonomous RTB, but it will probably be implemented in later blocks.

BTW, I heard they postponed the roll-out to April to focus on the maiden flight. Is it true?

 

[Canardzz]

BREAKING

TF-X will be able to autonomously return to base in case the pilot faints.

I get his excitement, but Mr. Kotil really needs to chill down a bit He's talking about Auto GCAS. TAI is, in fact, working on autonomous RTB, but it will probably be implemented in later blocks.

BTW, I heard they postponed the roll-out to April to focus on the maiden flight. Is it true?

Seems to be the case. The rollout date was postponed slightly.

 

[Canardzz]

A foreign country has requested to join the TF-X program!

Agreements will be signed if all goes well.

 

[snne]

A foreign country has requested to join the TF-X program!

Agreements will be signed if all goes well.

Hopefully not a small country. We need our own Indonesia in the programme.

 

[Canardzz]

A foreign country has requested to join the TF-X program!

Agreements will be signed if all goes well.

Hopefully not a small country. We need our own Indonesia in the programme.

We will see

 

[snne]

A foreign country has requested to join the TF-X program!

Agreements will be signed if all goes well.

Hopefully not a small country. We need our own Indonesia in the programme.

I think it might be the KSA. A while ago there were rumors that a delegation visited the prototype assembly building. It was the day we got the first leak of the completed prototype.

 

[MadRat]

I'm guessing it would be a gulf state partner that is interested. Smaller countries that are cash rich have every incentive to buy in across multiple sources for future potential buys.

 

[snne]

In the statement made by Kotil:
“There are demands. They also have engineers working with us. But it's a government-to-government (G2G) deal that needs to be made. There is no agreement announced by the state at this time.”

According to the statement made by Temel Kotil:
The engineers of the country who want to participate in the National Combat Aircraft Program are currently working on TAI projects.
This brings to mind countries such as Pakistan, Malaysia and Indonesia, which have close relations with TAI and have aviation industries.

https://www.savunmasanayist.com/milli-muharip-ucaka-yurt-disindan-ilk-talep-geldi/

 

[red admiral]

TF-X's CDR will be completed before the maiden flight.

How has CDR not already happened? You need to have the design review before starting to build the parts

 

[Canardzz]

TF-X's CDR will be completed before the maiden flight.

How has CDR not already happened? You need to have the design review before starting to build the parts

TAI disagrees with you They do it differently.

 

[snne]

Aselsan's patent application for RAM radar absorber material
https://www.sumobrain.com/patents/wipo/Radar-absorber/WO2016209181A1.html

 

[red admiral]

TAI disagrees with you They do it differently.

Its obviously not a Critical Design Review then

Design comes before build

 

[Canardzz]

TAI disagrees with you They do it differently.

Its obviously not a Critical Design Review then

Design comes before build

TAI started producing parts for the TF-X when major design activities were still ongoing

 

[NCQ]

TAI disagrees with you They do it differently.

Its obviously not a Critical Design Review then

Design comes before build

TAI started producing parts for the TF-X when major design activities were still ongoing

That seems like a bad idea to me, and very likely to cost them time and money down the line.

 

[snne]

TAI disagrees with you They do it differently.

Its obviously not a Critical Design Review then

Design comes before build

They work in a model which they call as "Cold War development cycle". So from a classical 21st century western aircraft development point of view it may not make sense but since Turkey has put itself in a tight corner, they are trying to accelerate it as much as possible.

All the infos that we've received today came from a press visit and I've just watched one of the reporters who visited TAI. According to him, when they were visiting the MMU assembly facility, one senior personnel said to him that there were instances where he worked 72 hours straight without ever leaving the facility. Now imagine how many hours a technician or an engineer must be doing.


I hope that I've answered all of your questions.

 

[Canardzz]

TAI disagrees with you They do it differently.

Its obviously not a Critical Design Review then

Design comes before build

TAI started producing parts for the TF-X when major design activities were still ongoing

That seems like a bad idea to me, and very likely to cost them time and money down the line.

Program managers over at TAI are pretty confident with what they've come up with. It's worth mentioning that TAI uses Siemens and Dassault softwares at the same time (just to give an example of their unorthodox techniques).

 

[NCQ]

TAI disagrees with you They do it differently.

Its obviously not a Critical Design Review then

Design comes before build

TAI started producing parts for the TF-X when major design activities were still ongoing

That seems like a bad idea to me, and very likely to cost them time and money down the line.

Program managers over at TAI are pretty confident with what they've come up with. It's worth mentioning that TAI uses Siemens and Dassault softwares at the same time (just to give an example of their unorthodox techniques).

I'm sure they are confident, they wouldn't be doing it otherwise. But that doesn't mean it's the smart thing to do, at least from my point of view. If you don't finish major design before you start making prototypes you risk making the prototypes unrepresentative of the final product. You might still be able to get some valuable data from these prototypes but it also means you'll need to make entirely new prototypes that  are representative of the final product and you'll have to redo tests with these new prototypes.

There's a reason, for example, the B-21 program has emphasized getting its prototypes as production representative as possible. It reduces risk when shifting to actual production aircraft. And it seems to have really worked for them. I think TAI is really risking having to increase the development period to deal with major design changes made after prototypes were produced, or running into major issues when shifting to production aircraft, or ending up with issues sort of like the concurrency issues the F-35 had but with even greater changes between aircraft.

 

[red admiral]

TAI started producing parts for the TF-X when major design activities were still ongoing

That is a normal programme. You can further split things up by having graduated PDRs CDRs etc. For more rapid programmes. But it comes with risk of downstream changes having significant cost/time impacts. Aiming for right first time as per B-21 / Hawk is generally a quicker and cheaper way of getting to the final product.

Is this actually defining CDR as something like 100% parts sign off? And e.g. there's a few cockpit buttons that haven't been done yet...

Using software from multiple providers is also business as usual

 

[Radonislav]

TAI started producing parts for the TF-X when major design activities were still ongoing

That is a normal programme. You can further split things up by having graduated PDRs CDRs etc. For more rapid programmes. But it comes with risk of downstream changes having significant cost/time impacts. Aiming for right first time as per B-21 / Hawk is generally a quicker and cheaper way of getting to the final product.

Is this actually defining CDR as something like 100% parts sign off? And e.g. there's a few cockpit buttons that haven't been done yet...

Using software from multiple providers is also business as usual

That's a thing to talk, when we are talking about CDR, are we talking about the screw supplier or who buy the buttons from? Or the airframe design.

But airframe itself was in a frozen state when it got into production, so different levels of readiness. But we can expect small changes after flight tests

 

[Maro.Kyo]

That's a thing to talk, when we are talking about CDR, are we talking about the screw supplier or who buy the buttons from? Or the airframe design.

But airframe itself was in a frozen state when it got into production, so different levels of readiness. But we can expect small changes after flight tests

When we talk about CDR we obviously are talking about the whole system, ie the aircraft, including the airframe. If the airframe itself is in a frozen state as you're saying then that must be that the critical design is complete, which obviously is not the case here when CDR is not completed yet.