Boeing Starliner

[NCQ]

So SpaceX for the return home failing the Starliner, not good PR for Boeing that is for sure.

At the moment there's no indication that Butch and Suni won't be returning on Starliner. NASA has not talked about them coming down on anything but Starliner, and thus far has maintained that they believe it is safe for them to do so.

 

[bob225]

At the moment there's no indication that Butch and Suni won't be returning on Starliner. NASA has not talked about them coming down on anything but Starliner, and thus far has maintained that they believe it is safe for them to do so.

At least in public.....

i imagine that this is being looked at in great depth by engineers, managers, lawyers and marketing types.

No one wants to see an apollo 1 / challenger issue or coffins draped in flags, thats going to have massive impact on artemis and nasa, not forgetting boeing.

i think that they'll go for re-entry, as we've discussed at lot of this is probably being blown well out of proportion.

 

[FighterJock]

Same here bob225, but I would think that NASA will have thought long and hard about it before giving the final order to go for re-entry.

 

[bob225]

Same here bob225, but I would think that NASA will have thought long and hard about it before giving the final order to go for re-entry.

Probably not yet 100% decided.

i think the phrase is "an abundance of caution" you have to be very brave and sure to sign on the dotted line and give to "go"

 

[FighterJock]

That is what I am currently thinking too not yet 100% but possibly nearer 95% before giving the final order.

 

[Flyaway]

NASA indefinitely delays return of Starliner to review propulsion data

However, this vehicle is only rated for a 45-day stay at the space station, and that clock began ticking on June 6.

NASA indefinitely delays return of Starliner to review propulsion data

“We are letting the data drive our decision."

arstechnica.com

 

[FighterJock]

Oh dear it is not looking too good for Starliner now? What will Boeing do now when the time runs out on the 45-day stay at the station then?

 

[aim9xray]

Better get that XRV on the pad, pronto.

 

[aim9xray]

And seriously, who the **** in NASA allowed Boeing and SpaceX to use incompatible space suits in their respective vehicles? (Did we not learn from the Lithium Hydroxide filters, oh, 50+ years ago?)

 

[Flyaway]

Oh dear it is not looking too good for Starliner now? What will Boeing do now when the time runs out on the 45-day stay at the station then?

I suppose if all else fails they could risk leaving it longer, after all when in operational use it will be able to stay up to 210 days.

 

[FighterJock]

So theoretically speaking Boeing could risk keeping Starliner at the station for over 50 plus days give or take, that is if they are willing to do such a thing considering that it is not in operational use currently.

 

[Archibald]

Oh, crap. Well by this point I'd rather have Suni and Butch returning to Earth by Dragon or Soyuz, and Starliner reentering unmanned. And if the damn thing wants to go Marooned ("I can't reenter !") or burn to cinder, then : let it burn.

But - Boeing, really: WHAT'S WRONG WITH YOU ??!!!!

By the way, no panic: ISS has tons of margins to support two more astronauts for a few weeks, if needed. That's the beauty of redundancy: Dragon-2, then Soyuz, then Starliner.
It will just play havoc with crew rotations and related flight experiments. But that's no lethal threat.

As for Starliner expiration date
1-It does nothing bad just staying docked to ISS. It's like another BEAM module.
2-Once the expiration date passed, it will just undock and get dumped: as done with ISS trash (hopefully not like the pallet that ended destroying the roof of that Florida house !)

 

[FighterJock]

Thanks Archibald, I was wondering about what happens next with the future of Starliner.

 

[Byeman]

Oh dear it is not looking too good for Starliner now? What will Boeing do now when the time runs out on the 45-day stay at the station then?

Not so. Keeping it in space is the only way to collect data. The SM burns up during entry. Starliner could return at anytime if needed to.

 

[Nik]

Could the 'Starliner' return autonomously ??

If so, could a re-supply mission ferry up replacement space-suits ? Or suit adaptors ?
That 'scrubber connector' issue is definitely one of the Apollo#13 lessons...
( The other being do not run excessive voltage through cryo-tank heater ?? )

 

[Byeman]

And seriously, who the **** in NASA allowed Boeing and SpaceX to use incompatible space suits in their respective vehicles? (Did we not learn from the Lithium Hydroxide filters, oh, 50+ years ago?)

not an issue like the "incompatible" LiOH canisters weren't.*
Any rescue vehicle could bring up compatible suits.

* the fix after Apollo 13 for the "incompatible" LiOH canisters was to include a diagram of the Apollo 13 adapter.

 

[Byeman]

If so, could a re-supply mission ferry up replacement space-suits ?

Just have the rescue vehicle bring them up.

That 'scrubber connector' issue is definitely one of the Apollo#13 lessons...

Not true.

 

[Nik]

"Not true."

Please, why ??

 

[Byeman]

"Not true."

Please, why ??

See post before. And the LM and PLSS canisters were interchangeable. The issue was storage. Additional ones were stored outside the LM and would be brought in during the first EVA.

 

[aim9xray]

Starliner could return at anytime if needed to.

Serious question. Does Starliner (CM) have sufficient deltaV capability to deorbit sans SM?

 

[Byeman]

Serious question. Does Starliner (CM) have sufficient deltaV capability to deorbit sans SM?

no, it doesn't even have the proper thruster alignment to do it.

 

[NMaude]

The Space Bucket has put out a video concerning the indefinite undocking of the Starliner from the ISS:

What was originally planned to be around a week-long stay at the ISS has now been pushed back to an indefinite date. Late last night the agency made the decision to move off the June 26th departure date and are now working to figure out a possible return opportunity. Specifically, they want more time to review data related to the Helium leaks and thruster failures that occurred earlier in the mission.

While this helps teams gather data, Starliner only is rated for a total of 45 days docked to the station. That means that within the next few weeks, they either gather necessary data, deem the spacecraft safe, and send crew back to Earth on Starliner, or other options would be needed. As of right now, the agency is adamant that Starliner is safe and will soon bring the astronauts back home. Here I will go more in-depth into the new delay, what data the agency and Boeing are looking at, future departure opportunities, and more.

For more space-related content check out - https://thespacebucket.com/https://www.youtube.com/redirect?ev...w&q=https://thespacebucket.com/&v=NeRoPcFB-_c

Credit:

SpaceX - https://www.youtube.com/c/SpaceXhttps://www.youtube.com/c/SpaceX

NASA - https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLA_...https://www.youtube.com/channel/UCLA_DiR1FfKNvjuUpBHmylQ

Boeing - https://www.youtube.com/@Boeinghttps://www.youtube.com/@Boeing

Chapters:

0:00 - Intro

0:46 - Unknown Return Date

 

[Michel Van]

NASA push the undocking of the Starliner to July
for further test on Service Module
because the SM is throw away on each mission, they need to test that dam thing dock on ISS.

on July is launch of Polaris Mission for EVA suit testing.
follow mid August with Crew-9 mission to ISS by SpaceX.
why do i have this suspicion that those become rescue mission for Starliner Crew ?

 

[FighterJock]

I have had that suspicion as well Michel Van. It won't look good for Boeing if that is the case.

 

[martinbayer]

NASA push the undocking of the Starliner to July

July of which year?

 

[FighterJock]

Quite right martinbayer.

 

[Flyaway]

July of which year?

3024.

 

[Archibald]

They should bring back Suni and Butch via Dragon-2, and dump that rickety bucket of bolts into the atmosphere, sooner rather than later. They could load some ISS trash inside, and Boeing would still get additional reentry experience. Sounds like a win-win.

 

[FighterJock]

Someone has obviously put a curse on the Starliner, I connot explain why so much has gone wrong with it ever since the capsule was built.

 

[bob225]

Here's an idea:

Send up Crew Dragon to bring back Butch and SunI.

In Crew Dragon are The head of starliner production and the head of boeing who get to ride starliner back to prove it's "safe"

Win win, astronauts safe, and the boeing execs make sure starliner is safe if they have the boss on board (or perhaps not)

 

[Dilandu]

They should bring back Suni and Butch via Dragon-2, and dump that rickety bucket of bolts into the atmosphere, sooner rather than later. They could load some ISS trash inside, and Boeing would still get additional reentry experience. Sounds like a win-win.

That's looks like an optimal solution.

Someone has obviously put a curse on the Starliner, I connot explain why so much has gone wrong with it ever since the capsule was built.

It was essentially build from scratch by the company, that not only have no experience building manned spacecraft (I doubt that anyone from Rockwell team that worked on Space Shuttle is still here), but also tried to build a completely new spacecraft from scratch. Instead of working from existing design - for example, making a manned version of X-37 - they decided to develope everything from zero point. And their design works were managed by remote managers who have absolutely zero understanding of engineering.

 

[martinbayer]

Someone has obviously put a curse on the Starliner, I connot explain why so much has gone wrong with it ever since the capsule was built.

Perhaps it should be more aptly renamed as Star-Crossed Liner.

 

[Byeman]

It was essentially build from scratch by the company, that not only have no experience building manned spacecraft (I doubt that anyone from Rockwell team that worked on Space Shuttle is still here), but also tried to build a completely new spacecraft from scratch. Instead of working from existing design - for example, making a manned version of X-37 - they decided to develope everything from zero point. And their design works were managed by remote managers who have absolutely zero understanding of engineering.

No, it is basically the same as the OSP model proposed in the early 2000's.

 

[aim9xray]

Here's an idea:

Send up Crew Dragon to bring back Butch and SunI. In Crew Dragon are The head of starliner production and the head of boeing who get to ride starliner back to prove it's "safe".

I would be inclined to nominate Messers Stonecipher and Calhoun as replacement Starliner crewmembers in honour of their years of draining the company of its' financial and engineering capital. Perhaps they should be accompanied by the ashes of Jack Welch.

 

[Byeman]

They should bring back Suni and Butch via Dragon-2, and dump that rickety bucket of bolts into the atmosphere, sooner rather than later. They could load some ISS trash inside, and Boeing would still get additional reentry experience. Sounds like a win-win.

there is no need for that. the vehicle is cleared for emergency return. they want to keep it in space for more troubleshooting.

 

[Byeman]

I would be inclined to nominate Messers Stonecipher and Calhoun as replacement Starliner crewmembers in honour of their years of draining the company of its' financial and engineering capital. Perhaps they should be accompanied by the ashes of Jack Welch.

the crew would not be in any more risk than a nominal mission.

 

[aim9xray]

the crew would not be in any more risk than a nominal mission.

Not the point.

 

[Byeman]

Not the point.

then there is no point to your post in nominating Stonecipher and Calhoun as replacement Starliner crewmembers if they are at no increased risk

 

[aim9xray]

Why, they should jump at the chance if there is no increased risk. It's called "having skin in the game". Like having Boeing HQ in Seattle. Like forbidding Calhoun from telecommuting from his lakeside home, and having him show up at the office every day. Or having him travel via commercial MAX rather than BBJ. Like having his pay tied to Zero-Defect, on-time deliveries rather than stock price.

 

[publiusr]

The Boeing Executives I would give a choice--return on Starliner--or get disappeared to Cormoros