Lockheed Martin F-35 Lightning II Joint Strike Fighter (JSF)

in regards to the recent Finnish HX competition where the F-35 was selected,
was the full evaluation ever released? So far I can only find the F-35 points, but not for the other aircraft.
 
Josh_TN said:
I'm pretty sure this particular stretch of road is not in use and was previously used to train Harriers the same way, if it is the same recent exercise I'm thinking of.
Click to expand...
Looks like a RR access road, which means it doesn't get used very often, basically only by RR maintenance of way vehicles.
 
Scott Kenny said:
Looks like a RR access road, which means it doesn't get used very often, basically only by RR maintenance of way vehicles.
Click to expand...

It's the Old Pacific Coast Highway near I-5. From what I can see, it is still an active road, but it was also used periodically (as noted above) for Harrier training.

www.thedrive.com

F-35B Just Touched Down On The Old Pacific Coast Highway

The USMC is developing a playbook to use its F-35Bs from improvised areas and to work with other services to better fight at the forward edge.
www.thedrive.com www.thedrive.com
 
Interesting to see the F-35Bs testing road landings, wonder how long the road tar will last under these conditions giving the fact the heat generated by the F-35B engine on landing and taking off.
 
FighterJock said:
Interesting to see the F-35Bs testing road landings, wonder how long the road tar will last under these conditions giving the fact the heat generated by the F-35B engine on landing and taking off.
Click to expand...

Looks like concrete, not asphalt. Should hold up fine for occasional ops.
 
If anyone wants to check it out on a map, it's here:

wikimapia.org

STOL 101 - Wikimapia

Designed to support vertical takeoff fixed wing aircraft operations. The STOL 101 is an actual strip of roadway. These facilities are open to rotary wing operations as well.
wikimapia.org

It actually does look like this bit is closed to vehicles, part of a roads-to-trails conversion. There's about 3000 feet of concrete road here, perhaps deliberately laid as a Harrier strip at one point.
 
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helmutkohl said:
in regards to the recent Finnish HX competition where the F-35 was selected,
was the full evaluation ever released? So far I can only find the F-35 points, but not for the other aircraft.
Click to expand...
Not to my knowledge. At least I haven't seen anything about it in any Finnish mass media (either in Finnish or Swedish). The Finnish Defence Forces have a tradition of being rather secretive when it comes to procurement practices and the size of their weapons inventory (the FDF has, for example, moved quite an amount of its field artillery pieces from the army to the navy in the past, as the number of artillery pieces in the navy need not be disclosed, unlike the number of guns in the army).
 
TomS said:
If anyone wants to check it out on a map, it's here:

wikimapia.org

STOL 101 - Wikimapia

Designed to support vertical takeoff fixed wing aircraft operations. The STOL 101 is an actual strip of roadway. These facilities are open to rotary wing operations as well.
wikimapia.org

It actually does look like this bit is closed to vehicles, part of a roads-to-trails conversion. There's about 3000 feet of concrete road here, perhaps deliberately laid as a Harrier strip at one point.
Click to expand...
Looks to be an old part of US101, the Pacific Coast Highway. Parts of that have been closed off and bypassed.
 
TomS said:
It's the Old Pacific Coast Highway near I-5. From what I can see, it is still an active road, but it was also used periodically (as noted above) for Harrier training.

www.thedrive.com

F-35B Just Touched Down On The Old Pacific Coast Highway

The USMC is developing a playbook to use its F-35Bs from improvised areas and to work with other services to better fight at the forward edge.
www.thedrive.com www.thedrive.com
Click to expand...
Specifically, this stretch was annexed by MCB Camp Pendleton... I used to drive between MCAS El Toro and NAS Miramar via I-5 frequently in 1987-91, and that road section is inside the base perimeter fence (the fence having been moved after I-5 was built).

I-5 is a narrow corridor through the base land there - fences on both sides, and Marines using the beach area for training as well.


STOL 101 Camp Pendleton.jpg

Assault Craft Unit Five is the LCAC base, and they train regularly on the beach within sight of traffic on I-5.

STOL 101 Camp Pendleton large.jpg
 
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So the million dollar question. When will F-35 low rate initial production end and full rate production begin?
 
I'm not sure that matters, because the maintenance issue still hasn't been solved. Ramping up production of airplanes that run into a maintenance wall doesn't seem like the wisest decision.

I noticed the number of highway operations pictures, both F-35 and Eurofighter. Is there any sign that is anything more than a gimmic? That highway operations can be done anywhere beyond 1 or 2 test ranges?
 
FighterJock said:
So the million dollar question. When will F-35 low rate initial production end and full rate production begin?
Click to expand...

It probably doesn't really matter. It's only technically in LRIP now because it hasn't fulfilled all the Milestone C criteria, but the actual construction rate is already near the 150-per-year target for full-rate production anyway.
 
Is it normal for F-35B to do a conventional landing with the lift fan door open?

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rzAmHurRhg0


"29 September 2023 at Tampere-Pirkkala airport (EFTP), Finland, during Finnish Defence Forces Ruska 23 exercise. The fighter called "fuel left for 9 minutes" before approaching the airfield"
 
What is the advantage of a rolling landing vice a vertical one? Less erosion of the landing surface?
 
When will the RAF/RN start to practice the Rolling Vertical Landing? I do wish that they would hurry up and start to demonstrate the technique soon, that was one of the highlights of the whole F-35B program for me at least for the RAF/RN.
 
NMaude said:
I wonder if the F-35B is capable of VIFFing like the Harrier was?
Click to expand...

Pretty sure it's not. The F-35B's system is set up differently from the Harrier. The rear nozzle can only swivel to a straight down position. Edit: That's not quite true -- you can move the rear nozzle part way for a rolling STO. But the rest remains true.

There's no way to get a corresponding thrust forward of the CG except to open the fan door (effectively a monster air brake) and engage the lift fan. Swiveling the rear nozzle without the lift fan would create a nasty pitch-down moment that is not likely to be useful at all. I suspect it's not even possible in the flight control system because it would tend to make the plane uncontrollable.

And VIFF in the Harrier was kind of a stunt, not something used in real combat. Much like the Cobra, the ability to slow down really fast is impressive but borders on suicidal in any fight that isn't a 1v1.
 
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NMaude said:
It means greater bring back capability for unexpended stores.
Click to expand...

I doubt that’s a major consideration for internal stores. It would have advantages recovering with a lot of fuel, but I would not think ~5000 lbs is breaking the bank bring back wise, and that would be the heaviest possible internal configuration.
 
I actually seen a video of the F35 viffing.

And I have it, wonder if i can attach it.

And I cant so thats annoying, maybe imgur...
https://imgur.com/a/mkK94Ac
View: https://imgur.com/a/mkK94Ac

Let see if that works.

Also heard that the RN been doing Rolling vertical landing since week 3 of their new carrier ops. Like it switch from OH NEW to eyeah this is the normal its boring now.
 
There is no way that's real. One give away is the shape of the nose. Another is the speed and range of motion of the upper door over the lift fan. But mostly it's just because it makes no sense. VIFFing on the Harrier didn't do much as far as adding airframe drag. On the F-35 you're opening a giant airbrake, right at your six, when someone is behind you. And that door almost certainly has relatively low airspeed limits.
 
TomS said:
Pretty sure it's not. The F-35B's system is set up differently from the Harrier. The rear nozzle can only swivel to a straight down position. Edit: That's not quite true -- you can move the rear nozzle part way for a rolling STO. But the rest remains true.
Click to expand...

The rear nozzle can deflect the exhaust flow through 95 degrees in the pitch axis and ±12.25 degrees in the yaw axis.
The lift fan's guide vanes can move from 41.75 to 104 degrees.
This allows the jet to fly backwards.
But yeah VIFFing like the Harrier demonstrated is not possible.
Here's a video showing the rear nozzle in action:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRgcC9eqEJg


Josh_TN said:
I doubt that’s a major consideration for internal stores. It would have advantages recovering with a lot of fuel, but I would not think ~5000 lbs is breaking the bank bring back wise, and that would be the heaviest possible internal configuration.
Click to expand...

The bring back requirement was for a vertical landing with 2 1000lbs bombs and 2 AIM-120. That's about 2700lbs.
Hot weather, more stores, more fuel and weight growth are all concerns so a rolling landing definitely helps even with internal weapons only. Nevermind external stores incl. the gun pod or the 2 SRAMs, both not included in the original requirements.
 
eagle said:
No. But that is not a conventional landing, it's doing a short landing. You can see all the STOVL doors are open and the rear nozzle is pointed downwards. Plus it's obviously way too slow for a conventional landing.
Click to expand...
Why would he do it, on a big runway and short of fuel?
 
eagle said:
The rear nozzle can deflect the exhaust flow through 95 degrees in the pitch axis and ±12.25 degrees in the yaw axis.
The lift fan's guide vanes can move from 41.75 to 104 degrees.
This allows the jet to fly backwards.
But yeah VIFFing like the Harrier demonstrated is not possible.
Here's a video showing the rear nozzle in action:
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iRgcC9eqEJg




The bring back requirement was for a vertical landing with 2 1000lbs bombs and 2 AIM-120. That's about 2700lbs.
Hot weather, more stores, more fuel and weight growth are all concerns so a rolling landing definitely helps even with internal weapons only. Nevermind external stores incl. the gun pod or the 2 SRAMs, both not included in the original requirements.
Click to expand...

While you are absolutely correct, I also forgot that the B version can not do mk84 sized loads anyway. So mk83 ish with a pair of AIM-120, worst case.

I doubt that the payload is limiting the envelope. I’m going to stick with my original guess and say a roll stop on asphalt or concrete involves a lot less landscaping.
 

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