I swear, I haven't forgotten this. I've just been very busy with a new job.Obviously we are going to have to chain you a lap top .
No pressure but I need my fix.
I know the feeling, gone from between jobs to literally working in a bunker with no reception, to having to relocate across the country. It doesn't even leave you with time to read other people posts, let alone write your own.I swear, I haven't forgotten this. I've just been very busy with a new job.Obviously we are going to have to chain you a lap top .
No pressure but I need my fix.
Well that is good, ore maybe you should not do so good.I swear, I haven't forgotten this. I've just been very busy with a new job.Obviously we are going to have to chain you a lap top .
No pressure but I need my fix.
However, we are very glad that he and others here like him, are indeed that good.Well that is good, ore maybe you should not do so good.I swear, I haven't forgotten this. I've just been very busy with a new job.Obviously we are going to have to chain you a lap top .
No pressure but I need my fix.
That is true, i can wait, i am waiting for other TLs to restarts, so this one can join them.However, we are very glad that he and others here like him, are indeed that good.Well that is good, ore maybe you should not do so good.I swear, I haven't forgotten this. I've just been very busy with a new job.Obviously we are going to have to chain you a lap top .
No pressure but I need my fix.
MiG-17s actually. The Shenyang F-5 is a license built MiG-17. So on paper, a match for the Hawker Hunter. I tried showing that the Dutch were the better trained force and they had the advantage of a radar guided intercept. But they were still outnumbered 3:1 by fighters and the Indonesians were trained enough that they weren't helpless in the air. But the Dutch still managed a 2:1 kill ratioMig-15s vs Meteors - with the Dutch putting a valiant fight if not desperate. I loved every single word of it !
In the end however: Indonesia - Netherlands: 3 - 0
BRING THE HAWKER HUNTERS !!! And those pesky MiG-15s will suffer accordingly.
They actually did really well all things considered. As a rule, the Dutch pilots were better trained with a lot more time in the air, both in total and in type. But they were so heavily outnumbered, and some of the Indonesian pilots were every bit as good as them that, even though they shot down 18 aircraft, they still lost every last one of their operational fighters.Mig-17s vs Meteors... I feel bad for the Dutch pilots.
That will take time, time the Netherlands does not have.Mig-15s vs Meteors - with the Dutch putting a valiant fight if not desperate. I loved every single word of it !
In the end however: Indonesia - Netherlands: 3 - 0
BRING THE HAWKER HUNTERS !!! And those pesky MiG-15s will suffer accordingly.
Maybe they will need to call upon regional allies...That will take time, time the Netherlands does not have.Mig-15s vs Meteors - with the Dutch putting a valiant fight if not desperate. I loved every single word of it !
In the end however: Indonesia - Netherlands: 3 - 0
BRING THE HAWKER HUNTERS !!! And those pesky MiG-15s will suffer accordingly.
Their allies don't have much in the way of combat power themselves. Australia is the best equipped, but they only have Sabres, though given the model they have, they are roughly at parity with the MiG-17. The FAA is nearly as obsolete as 322 Squadron was. The UK has the most combat power available in the immediate area, though the US is sending an entire Air Wing to the Philippines (honestly its more of a, "we're close enough to show we're interested, but far enough away to make sure we don't actually have to do anything" type deployment). A lot of firepower can be brought to bear. But does anyone actually have the will to do it?Maybe they will need to call upon regional allies...That will take time, time the Netherlands does not have.Mig-15s vs Meteors - with the Dutch putting a valiant fight if not desperate. I loved every single word of it !
In the end however: Indonesia - Netherlands: 3 - 0
BRING THE HAWKER HUNTERS !!! And those pesky MiG-15s will suffer accordingly.
The Doorman is still in the Netherlands, having recently completed her modernization. And yes, they still got their sidewinders.The question is: how far is the Karel Doorman, and does its sea hawks have sidewinders like they had at this time in our timeline?
Both Victorious and Ark Royal could be sent in relatively short order if needed to supplement Albion. There's also a couple of Venom fighter/bomber squadrons in the area along with a couple squadrons of Hawker Hunter fighters. They're also transferring an additional Hunter squadron into the theater. Of course, this was all before the air battle.The Menzies and Macmillan governments in Canberra and London in this period would have been seriously responding by building up forces in 1959.
RAF Javelins and Valiants to Singapore. Eagle, Ark or Hermes with Scimitars and Sea Vixens. Vulcans and Victors too.
At this moment Indonesia is picking on the weaker of the countries that have holding surrounding them, can they go head to head with the British and would the Soviets back them in it.The Menzies and Macmillan governments in Canberra and London in this period would have been seriously responding by building up forces in 1959.
RAF Javelins and Valiants to Singapore. Eagle, Ark or Hermes with Scimitars and Sea Vixens. Vulcans and Victors too.
Probably not, to both questions. The UK has a carrier strike group in theater, plus far more numerous assets than anyone else. And they can relatively quickly reinforce if needed. I mentioned it up thread, but the UK has up to 4 carriers all available to be sent if the need is grave enough (5 if they cancel Eagle's modernization and send her "as is"). That's a lot more firepower than the Dutch could ever hope to send. The most the Dutch can send is one carrier with an obsolete air wing (Sea Hawks for air defense and freaking TBM Avengers for strike), maybe a squadron of Hawker Hunters and a battalion of Marines for ground forces. Maybe up to a Regiment from the Army if they dip into their forces earmarked for NATO. Escalating to a general attack on British/Commonwealth forces would bring in the UK, AUS and NZ. And very likely the US would send forces into the theater as well.At this moment Indonesia is picking on the weaker of the countries that have holding surrounding them, can they go head to head with the British and would the Soviets back them in it.The Menzies and Macmillan governments in Canberra and London in this period would have been seriously responding by building up forces in 1959.
RAF Javelins and Valiants to Singapore. Eagle, Ark or Hermes with Scimitars and Sea Vixens. Vulcans and Victors too.
And even that will take time, especially if Egypt decides to feel sympathetic to the Indonesian cause and denies the Dutch passages to the Suez Canal.The most the Dutch can send is one carrier with an obsolete air wing (Sea Hawks for air defense and freaking TBM Avengers for strike), maybe a squadron of Hawker Hunters and a battalion of Marines for ground forces. Maybe up to a Regiment from the Army if they dip into their forces earmarked for NATO.At this moment Indonesia is picking on the weaker of the countries that have holding surrounding them, can they go head to head with the British and would the Soviets back them in it.The Menzies and Macmillan governments in Canberra and London in this period would have been seriously responding by building up forces in 1959.
RAF Javelins and Valiants to Singapore. Eagle, Ark or Hermes with Scimitars and Sea Vixens. Vulcans and Victors too.
Which, historically, they were prepared to. But the Dutch figured they would, so they never even bothered asking and just sent their ships around the Cape of Good Hope instead.And even that will take time, especially if Egypt decides to feel sympathetic to the Indonesian cause and denies the Dutch passages to the Suez Canal.
That's a lot more firepower than the Dutch could ever hope to send. The most the Dutch can send is one carrier with an obsolete air wing (Sea Hawks for air defense and freaking TBM Avengers for strike), maybe a squadron of Hawker Hunters and a battalion of Marines for ground forces.
Yeah, it was honestly embarrassing. Dutch Naval Aviation was, to put it mildly, a joke. The Sea Hawks at least have Sidewinders to give them some kind of advantage, but yeah, TBF Avengers in 1959 as a front line strike option is ridiculous. Even Skyraiders would be a massive upgrade, with Skyhawks being better still.That's a lot more firepower than the Dutch could ever hope to send. The most the Dutch can send is one carrier with an obsolete air wing (Sea Hawks for air defense and freaking TBM Avengers for strike), maybe a squadron of Hawker Hunters and a battalion of Marines for ground forces.
Dear God. To think a lot of European countries took a lot of critics post-1991 for massive cuts to their forces, leaving them with obsolete stuff in scarce quantity.
This is equally bad.
1959 Netherlands ! Wow.
Were they aware a Cold War was raging in ? Did they learned their lessons from the horrors of May 1940 ?
This is from a Dutch site about the Royal Netherlands Navy, you can see it going up and then going down.That's a lot more firepower than the Dutch could ever hope to send. The most the Dutch can send is one carrier with an obsolete air wing (Sea Hawks for air defense and freaking TBM Avengers for strike), maybe a squadron of Hawker Hunters and a battalion of Marines for ground forces.
Dear God. To think a lot of European countries took a lot of critics post-1991 for massive cuts to their forces, leaving them with obsolete stuff in scarce quantity.
This is equally bad.
1959 Netherlands ! Wow.
Were they aware a Cold War was raging in ? Did they learned their lessons from the horrors of May 1940 ?
Yeah, it was honestly embarrassing. Dutch Naval Aviation was, to put it mildly, a joke. The Sea Hawks at least have Sidewinders to give them some kind of advantage, but yeah, TBF Avengers in 1959 as a front line strike option is ridiculous. Even Skyraiders would be a massive upgrade, with Skyhawks being better still.That's a lot more firepower than the Dutch could ever hope to send. The most the Dutch can send is one carrier with an obsolete air wing (Sea Hawks for air defense and freaking TBM Avengers for strike), maybe a squadron of Hawker Hunters and a battalion of Marines for ground forces.
Dear God. To think a lot of European countries took a lot of critics post-1991 for massive cuts to their forces, leaving them with obsolete stuff in scarce quantity.
This is equally bad.
1959 Netherlands ! Wow.
Were they aware a Cold War was raging in ? Did they learned their lessons from the horrors of May 1940 ?
Timely release?