Graugrun
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Picture taken at SAAF Toothrock Test Range circa 1987. Only one build but never went into production.sa_bushwar said:Does anyone know what happened with the Mini Valkiri 5?
As mentioned by JFC Fuller, I've not heard of it since it was unveiled about 20 years ago.
It was a lightened, shortened version of the Valkiri, firing shortened missiles. It's compromises were to ensure its suitability for paratroopers and special forces. I guess for the parabats, it would be easily towed by the Ferret prime mover or even the Jakkals light jeep.
I guess it fell by the wayside with the reduction in tensions and attendant military budget cuts?
Below is the same pic in colour, with brief description, and without the ink stamp.
Can you tell me how to get to Jane's old magazines? I need itFollow up to the above post - this is now 3 years later, where the turret has been more fully developed and place on a Challenger 1 tank for testing. The article is from Janes IDR - May 2005.
Do you have any photos of the KADDB development project for the Al Hussein Hybrid tank development tank for the British Challenger 1 ?
link to those of them, pages from which I was able to photograph so far at Russian State Library, was posted in another topic:Can you tell me how to get to Jane's old magazines? I need it
Was the Olifant Mk 2 design made in the 1980s and where they already working on a MK 3.
Thanks for the short recap.In a nutshell:
The redesigned Mk1b was designed in the 1980's.
The TTD/loggim design was started in the 1980's as a new tank.
The Olifant MK2 (and further developed Olifant designs) dates from the 1990's when the TTD/Loggim was cancelled.
That is a Zebra I believe.
The Zebra was a very early vehicle, from 1973, and was not based on the SAMIL, but on Bedford mechanicals.
Used by the army and police, designed as cargo carriers, with a recovery variant too.
About 100 were built.
These, as said, were early vehicles and days in the MPV field.
The Bedford by this stage did not have a long future ahead in the inventory with the SAMIL on the horizon.
There was a factory assembling Magirus Deutz trucks in South Africa in the 60's already, from imported components. The army had already begun trials for a new truck in 70's, with a new factory for manufacturing the winner, modified ruggedized locally built Magirus Deutz trucks to be known as SAMILS in place by the 70's.
Most of that is realistic, with the exception of the Bismark.I have this vision in my head of an all wheeled armoured force running on airless tires, with AC-200s replacing Buffel and Casspir in the APC and logistics roles, Rooikat scouts, Rooikat derived IFVs and ATGM, SPAAG/M and other variant AFVs possibly including the G-7 turret, G-6 artillery (although I'd prefer 8x8 so a mine blast to a front wheel doesn't leave it immobile), and something along the lines of a Bismark operating as a wheeled MBT. Is that at all realistic?
Sorry for the late answer; I haven't looked at this thread for quite a while. The Urutu was acquired from Brazil, specifically for the SA Ratel trials. The vehicle was a relatively early version, fitted with a 174 hp Mercedes diesel and a manual gearbox. SA testers did not like it much. It was also too small to mount a two-man turret and carry and eight man infantry section. This was a requirement for the Ratel. The vehicle is currently inside the base of the 1st South Africal infantry battalion in Bloemfontein.Abraham Gubler said:Herman said:I did see several interesting vehicles inside the camp however, amongst them the Brazilian Urutu APC that was also trialled during the development of the Ratel.
I thought the Brazilians even under their Military Dictatorship were quite anti RSA/Apartheid. Maybe it could have been an Urutu captured from Angola or Mozambique? Lusophone connection and all that.
Here is the Urutu in question. From its general pristine condition - no bundu bashing - or battle damage, I assume it was specifically acquired for the Ratel trials. From where and through which channels I do not know.
Where is that vehicle?
Given the terrain, the absence of anything resembling a road, 3 months worth of bundu bashing in thick sand and bush, to and fro endlessly, and this whilst permanently in low range,with diff locks and 6 x 6 engaged, prob hugely overloaded initially,so none of this comes as a surprise. Pity that they didn't keep track of the drastically reduced lifespan of the off road tyres and how many of those were used up.I have recently started reading "Ratel: The Making of a Legend". For those of us on this forum, who were involved in the discussions about the development of the Ratel, a few years ago, this is an extremely interesting read. A side issue which comes out of the book, and something I had read rumors about, is how poorly the SAMIL trucks fared in the bush, especially the big SAMIL 100 and its Kwêvoël derivative. On page 467, discussing the development and final non-adoption of the Ratel Log variant, a report is presented on the performance of the SAMIL 100 trucks over a period of 3 months, during Operations Modular, Hooper and Packer.
As we know, the SAMIL 100 is purportedly a 10-ton truck, i.e one with a maximum useful load of 10 metric tons. In the cross-country mode however, the load was limited to 6400 kg for the standard truck and only 5100 kg for the Kwêvoël, and even 1100 kg less for the variants fitted with a crane. Despite these limitations, the following items were replaced at 101 Workshop, at Grootfontein: 80 engines, 99 main gearboxes, 344 clutch plates, 360 pressure plates, 93 front axles, 67 middle axles, 32 rear axles, and 130 transfer boxes. It is also interesting to note that the V-10, Deutz engine, at that time, cost about R20.000 and a main gearbox was R7000. A front axle was however R40.000, a middle axle R49.000 and a rear axle was R38.000, and even a transfer case was R12.500.
I'm sure it's a universal theme, equipment being criticised for supposed lack of performance and then unfairly and retrospectively compared to some sexy piece of equipment that didn't make it past prototype stage. Huge difference between "lab testing in simulated conditions" vs actual combat enviroments that were not even factored into design briefs, even though it still meets and,or exceeds the up to then normal operational requirement.
Also,if it's all you have you have to make it work despite what the "manual" says.
To be fair, needs must when the Devil rides, as the old saying goes.Doing things that never crossed the designers' minds during their worst drunken nightmares.
So i am a bit of a Lurker here and i have been trying to find some info on the Suspension that the Olifant Mk.1b and Mk.2 use. I have read that it is a torsion bar system but have not been able to find any concrete evidence of that and was wondering if somebody here who knows more then i do could help?
Pictures are also nice as well
Kaiserbill, I believe I ordered my set from Bushwar Books. I find them an extremely interesting read.