Small UAS / Drones and related general thread - NOT Swarming ones.

Ugly said:
...UAVs as a core part of a modern Western land force.


the Autors must drink poison for this.
Core part of modern warfare is an reconnaissance and strike contour, which has only a part of the UAV.
Without artillery, aviation, tanks and comunication troops your core part is shit


P.S. Admin, you'd better get back from repression to the subject area. :)
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Tanks? The Russians and Ukrainians seem to prefer "tank". Singular.

Like it or not but the proliferation of FOG-type munitions with integrated killer-ISR capabilities means armored vehicles are less survivable in numbers and more survivable in singletons. At least it might make presently anemic Western tank fleets more impactful since acquisition of relevant tank defense systems should be easier in small batches.

shin_getter said:
There is no reason to concentrate infantry when infantry firepower is not important. It appears to me that troops are forward mostly to dig and occupy defensive fortification and a highly dispersed approach is fine.
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"Highly dispersed" is relative. A five to seven man assault section against a two man foxhole is a very serious attack these days.

Drones only work in fair weather and without EW. This is hard in the defense but easy in the attack. Artillery doesn't care for weather. Polaris golf cart doesn't care for splinter protection.
 
Kat Tsun said:
"Highly dispersed" is relative. A five to seven man assault section against a two man foxhole is a very serious attack these days.
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You don't need an assault section against a foxhole. There is enough videos of drone bombing against foxholes and trenches to show that it is not really defensible in the long term.

A viable defensive position is a trench network with top cover, a set of concealed bunkers or a settlement with a number of basements. Drones can not easily access or attack underground positions.

So how do you attack such positions? First have your own forces interdict, suppress and destroy strongpoints so that the enemy have limited fpv and drone sorties out of frontline positions. With short ranges of evtols, rear areas can offer little support and an advance rate faster than enemy sortie rate enables one to close. Enemy direct and indirect fires can also be suppressed via drone enabled fires.

So you close with such positions. When clearing such a position width of the effective battlefront is one men wide so in theory you only need one men. You could be flanked in a trench by opponents going over the top, but your own drone force can cover that threat. The limited range of drones mean your own drone teams may have to advance to maintain persistent cover but dispersion can be far greater than forces limited by LOS firearms.

Now, if the opponent have no artillery you could send in more men at higher concentration, as drone overwatch is unreliable due to bandwidth, surprise enemy EW action, and drone supply issues. That said if the opponent do have plentiful artillery than attacking in forces of one might result in the lowest casualty for men lost, if the morale holds up, which it simply might not as isolated humans are generally not aggressive an tend to flee.

There is a reason why motorcycles is considered viable transport for ops. If all you need is someone to throw grenade across that L-shaped trench with a roof, why do you need a fireteam?
 
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shin_getter said:
So how do you attack such positions?
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The same as always: a lot of artillery, some infantrymen with grit and bayonets, and a tank or two in support.

If you lack this, you simply don't attack, because you can't.
 
www.defensenews.com

Teledyne unveils Rogue 1 exploding drone sought by Marine Corps

Should the Rogue 1 drone not explode or be recalled, it can be disarmed and reused thanks to a mechanical disconnect.
www.defensenews.com www.defensenews.com

1715092061640.png

https://twitter.com/x/status/1787849770033172484
View: https://x.com/TotherChris/status/1787849770033172484

www.twz.com

Rogue 1 Is One Of The Marine Corps' Newest Kamikaze Drone

Rogue 1 is being procured alongside two other types that are competing to give the USMC more robust man-portable loitering munitions.
www.twz.com www.twz.com

https://twitter.com/x/status/1788509460257788107
View: https://x.com/AirPowerNEW1/status/1788509460257788107
 
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Sineva said:
One really has to wonder just what the cost of one of these bespoke military spec quadcopters will be compared to an off the shelf mavic....
5x,10x,20x?
I suspect this will probably only be purchased in very small numbers [if at all].
But it does raise the question of how western militaries are going to equip themselves with something like a mavic when buying off the shelf chinese drones is likely a total non starter both for political and technological/security reasons.
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As always it depends on how many you make.

Other news:

www.defensenews.com

Airbus acquires small drone maker Aerovel, eyes Replicator business

Aerovel's Flexrotor drone, which Airbus now owns, can take off and land vertically as well as fly for long periods while it conducts recon missions.
www.defensenews.com www.defensenews.com

https://twitter.com/x/status/1788270653096829114
View: https://x.com/defense_news/status/1788270653096829114
 
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Kat Tsun said:
Tanks? The Russians and Ukrainians seem to prefer "tank". Singular.

Like it or not but the proliferation of FOG-type munitions with integrated killer-ISR capabilities means armored vehicles are less survivable in numbers and more survivable in singletons. At least it might make presently anemic Western tank fleets more impactful since acquisition of relevant tank defense systems should be easier in small batches.
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Hi!

My English is terrible, so the online translator gives preference to the tank. Sorry for this.

And my comment concerned the authors' erroneous conclusion that UAVs are the core part of modern warfare. It's not like that!

They are only a part of it, and most importantly, not decisive. Which does not negate what you said. Indeed, the development of technology has allowed the UAV to declare itself as a serious weapon. Whereas previously the military treated them with prejudice.

If we highlight interesting solutions in the Ukrainian conflict from both sides, then I would start with the Lancet and the Orlan (30,10) from the Russian Federation and unmanned naval drones from Ukraine. Let's see where this path leads us =)
 
Ugly said:
Hi!

My English is terrible, so the online translator gives preference to the tank. Sorry for this.

And my comment concerned the authors' erroneous conclusion that UAVs are the core part of modern warfare. It's not like that!

They are only a part of it, and most importantly, not decisive. Which does not negate what you said. Indeed, the development of technology has allowed the UAV to declare itself as a serious weapon. Whereas previously the military treated them with prejudice.

If we highlight interesting solutions in the Ukrainian conflict from both sides, then I would start with the Lancet and the Orlan (30,10) from the Russian Federation and unmanned naval drones from Ukraine. Let's see where this path leads us =)
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Sure, they can't replace other important weapons.

On the other hand, they seem to be "decisive" and "a core part" in the sense that if you don't use them then you aren't going to make much headway against guys who do. UAVs provide massive advantages over conventional/"traditional" forms of aerial reconnaissance and firepower in response time. That seems to be their niche at the moment: giving platoons and companies what divisions and corps had 30 years ago.

All the authors are saying is "ignore UAVs at your peril".

No one is suggesting to replace howitzers or MBTs with UAVs. But UAVs are sufficiently deadly, either by themselves or when combined with artillery, that they've more or less halted large scale tank attacks like were seen in the 1980's training exercises. So tanks and artillery will need to disperse to survive under semi-constant aerial surveillance.
 
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Mohajer and Orion are larger vehicles more akin to the TB-2. They fly at altitudes that make them vulnerable to medium range SAMs and they are expensive enough to be hard to replace compared to the prolific Orlan 10.
 
Sineva said:
Confirmed 3rd example of a russian operated mohajer 6,how many more are there I wonder?
https://twitter.com/x/status/1794679950613872933
These are clearly being used to hunt for targets but I dont recall ever seeing any footage from these in russian military vids,mind you I dont recall much if any video footage from the orion either.
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en.wikipedia.org

Qods Mohajer-6 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
an Iranian single-engine multirole ISTAR[3] UAV capable of carrying a multispectral surveillance payload
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...but not finding downed presidents.
 
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www.defensenews.com

Small drones will soon lose combat advantage, French Army chief says

He cited the example of the Bayraktar drone, “the king of the war” at the start of the conflict in Ukraine, that is no longer being used.
www.defensenews.com www.defensenews.com

www.twz.com

Sale Of Over 1,000 Kamikaze Drones To Taiwan Points To Grand "Hellscape" Counter-China Plans

Masses of loitering munitions could engage approaching Chinese landing craft, as well as targets ashore, and overwhelm vessels in the Taiwan Strait.
www.twz.com www.twz.com

breakingdefense.sites.breakingmedia.com

Red Cat unveils low-cost 'family' of small ISR, strike drones - Breaking Defense

The company revealed a new drone dubbed FANG and is championing a separate system the company is acquiring by buying manufacturer FlightWave Aerospace Systems.
breakingdefense.sites.breakingmedia.com breakingdefense.sites.breakingmedia.com
 
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I’m a big fan of the ALTIUS series. The switchblade, less so, but guess it has a hot production line where as Anduril seems to need to expand to meet demand.
 
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Atash drones are obviously not jet powered if the pictures above and elsewhere are representative of the type.

iu
 
www.defensenews.com

Pentagon to identify next Replicator capability set this summer

Deputy Defense Secretary Kathleen Hicks said the Pentagon plans to propose Replicator 2.0 funding in its fiscal 2026 budget.
www.defensenews.com www.defensenews.com

breakingdefense.com

Skynode S: Auterion autonomy kit lets attack drones fly through jamming - Breaking Defense

Just announced on Thursday but already quietly combat-tested in Ukraine, the palm-sized Skynode S card makes small drones much less dependent on an uninterrupted wireless link to a human remote controller.
breakingdefense.com breakingdefense.com
 
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www.forbes.com

Ukraine Fields FPV Interceptor Drones At Speed

Ukraine has adapted its FPV kamikazes to knock down Russian reconnaissance drones, just weeks after launching a program for interceptors.
www.forbes.com www.forbes.com

Electric propulsion lowering minimal cost of aircraft + cheap electronics lowering the control costs means its air power at a lower price and range bracket.
 

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