Dassault Rafale NEWS ONLY

Funny how that echoes the 50's... and SNECMA atempt at a "Super Atar" also with 12 tons of thrust. To power early sketches of the Mirage IV - called Mirage IVC, they were single engine and thus somewhat a French F-105. Soon they become two-engines heavy fighter (Phantom like) before freezing out at Vigilante light-bomber level: the Mirage IVA was born...
 
This last order is huge in therm of significance. I hope that it will open a new era for Dassault: that of an absolute serenity and a return to the normal.

Obviously, having a more politically correct nation for customer would have been way better, but let's admit that Egypt, with or without Sissi needs those planes today.

Sadly however, India might have taken a punch in the face.

I am wondering if all the plane ordered are F3R or is there some options left for future upgraded verdion.
 
Sissi
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Romy you were so beautiful... how we miss your astonishing beauty...

Romy-Schneider-cinepassion34.jpg
 
So far there is no intentions to augment production capacities. Hence it's all the program that would move somehow on the right.
At 2 airframe produced per month, the expected delay will be 15 months. It remains to be seen what service will be impacted.

Edit:
Delivery should start in 2024, meaning that production slots would have to be made available in 2022. Wasn't that the supposed production start of the 12 airframes for the AdlAE to replace the ones bound to Greece?

Edit2:
Production of replacement airframe for France should have occcured starting in 2023 (delivered by 2025). Now delivery should start in 2026 at best (2024 and 2025 assumed as fully devoted to the Egyptian orders).
Obviously there is some variation to be considered since at this stage we don't know the exact contracted delivery end-date for Egypt or if anything firm was mandated for the France re-order.
 
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If / when Dassault wins Switzerland, production capacity could be a real problem. That would be 30-40 jets to be delivered from 2025 to 2030...
 
It's 9 airframe in more or less 30 days, 4 time the average production output. I wonder if that is made of the early production airframe used for training in South West of France.
Has anyone registered the s/n?
 
AFAIK, there were 7 indian Rafale used for training in France.
 
According to this article the 7 training indian Rafale stay in France, and 4 more Rafale arrive today or tomorrow in India.

www.globaldefensecorp.com

Indian Air Force Rebuilds “101 Squadron” At Hashimara Base

At the end of May, the Air Force will have 24 Rafale fighter jets in India, with another seven kept for training purposes in France and only five more to be handed over before the two squadrons are…
www.globaldefensecorp.com www.globaldefensecorp.com
 
To be confirmed, or not, as usual:

Indonesia would be very close to placing an order for Rafale

L'Indonésie très, très proche de monter à bord du Rafale

Le contrat portant sur l'acquisition de Rafale attend un décret présidentiel, qui permettra d'abonder des lignes budgétaires du ministère de la Défense pour financer cet achat.
www.latribune.fr www.latribune.fr

According to corroborating sources, the contract has already been initialed by the Indonesian Minister of Defense, Prabowo Subianto, who has wanted to offer the Rafale to his air force for several months.
However, the minister still has to wait for a decisive presidential decree from Joko Widodo to add budget lines to the Ministry of Defense and thus ensure the financing of the contract before being able to make it effective. The president and his defense minister had been rivals in the last two presidential elections.
(...)
According to a source familiar with the matter, the Indonesian Defense Minister should meet in "the coming weeks" his counterpart, Florence Parly, who mentioned last December an order for 36 Rafale by Jakarta. For his part, Dassault Aviation CEO Eric Trappier mentioned last January an order of between 24 and 40 aircraft.
(...)
The ball is therefore in Joko Widodo's court. And everyone is now waiting for the engagement authorization, which must be given by the Indonesian president.
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stealthflanker said:
Regarding latest news tho... I would suggest following Alman Helvas Ali. He is former Janes contributor for our country

Click to expand...
https://twitter.com/x/status/1392191526529245184
View: https://twitter.com/AHelvas/status/1392191526529245184

Somebody (Stealthflanker ?) knows what is "PSP" ?
 
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Deltafan said:
stealthflanker said:
Regarding latest news tho... I would suggest following Alman Helvas Ali. He is former Janes contributor for our country

Click to expand...
https://twitter.com/x/status/1392191526529245184
View: https://twitter.com/AHelvas/status/1392191526529245184

Somebody (Stealthflanker ?) knows what is "PSP" ?
Click to expand...


PSP or "Penetapan Sumber Pembiayaan" (roughly "Approval of Financing Source") Is a dispatch from our Minister of Treasury which approve the financing scheme of a program to proceed. So let's say we want to buy a plane... the financing for the deal would come from soft loan from appointed bank (e.g BNP Paribas) This financing scheme must be reviewed and approved by the ministry of treasury. Should the financing scheme got approved then PSP is issued.

so in short if i want to buy candy, my mother will review the way i would pay and how much and then if she say yes, then i can go buy that candy with the amount of money given to me by mother.

There is however bit of a thing. That the amount of the approved budget may not necessarily the same as what was previously planned. e.g MoD wants 36 Rafale but our Ministry of Finance only budget for 8. Which apparently what is happening. As far as i heard the budget allocated for Rafale was only about 1.1 B USD. Which well not 36 Rafale but more like 8 or maybe 5. While French would love if we signed for 36 as offered.
 
stealthflanker said:
Deltafan said:
stealthflanker said:
Regarding latest news tho... I would suggest following Alman Helvas Ali. He is former Janes contributor for our country

Click to expand...
https://twitter.com/x/status/1392191526529245184
View: https://twitter.com/AHelvas/status/1392191526529245184

Somebody (Stealthflanker ?) knows what is "PSP" ?
Click to expand...


PSP or "Penetapan Sumber Pembiayaan" (roughly "Approval of Financing Source") Is a dispatch from our Minister of Treasury which approve the financing scheme of a program to proceed. So let's say we want to buy a plane... the financing for the deal would come from soft loan from appointed bank (e.g BNP Paribas) This financing scheme must be reviewed and approved by the ministry of treasury. Should the financing scheme got approved then PSP is issued.

so in short if i want to buy candy, my mother will review the way i would pay and how much and then if she say yes, then i can go buy that candy with the amount of money given to me by mother.

There is however bit of a thing. That the amount of the approved budget may not necessarily the same as what was previously planned. e.g MoD wants 36 Rafale but our Ministry of Finance only budget for 8. Which apparently what is happening. As far as i heard the budget allocated for Rafale was only about 1.1 B USD. Which well not 36 Rafale but more like 8 or maybe 5. While French would love if we signed for 36 as offered.
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Thanks a lot Stealthflanker :)
 
stealthflanker said:
There is however bit of a thing. That the amount of the approved budget may not necessarily the same as what was previously planned. e.g MoD wants 36 Rafale but our Ministry of Finance only budget for 8. Which apparently what is happening. As far as i heard the budget allocated for Rafale was only about 1.1 B USD. Which well not 36 Rafale but more like 8 or maybe 5.
Click to expand...
That seems to me like a budget similar in size to the older Sukhoi acquisition program which has been binned. I've thought that this budget was going to be used for F-15EX procurement, no?
 
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Maro.Kyo said:
stealthflanker said:
There is however bit of a thing. That the amount of the approved budget may not necessarily the same as what was previously planned. e.g MoD wants 36 Rafale but our Ministry of Finance only budget for 8. Which apparently what is happening. As far as i heard the budget allocated for Rafale was only about 1.1 B USD. Which well not 36 Rafale but more like 8 or maybe 5.
Click to expand...
That seems to me like a budget dimilar in size to the older Sukhoi acquisition program which has been binned. I've thought that this budget was going to be used for F-15EX procurement, no?
Click to expand...
Well same budget but not necessarily the same lender.

The Su-35 deal were supposed to be financed through loan from BNP Paribas. I dont know tho if this potential Rafale deal would use the same bank.
 
To be confirmed on 28 May : Rafale WOULD be winner in Croatia :

www.jutarnji.hr

Jutarnji doznaje: Hrvatska kupuje francuske borbene avione Rafale, evo koliko će koštati

Ukoliko bi ugovor bio potpisan ove godine, Francuska bi prvih šest aviona isporučila 2024. godine
www.jutarnji.hr www.jutarnji.hr

The Croatian government has decided to purchase 12 second-hand French F3R Rafale fighter jets, Jutarnji list learned from well-informed unofficial sources.

The decision is expected to be made by the government for Armed Forces Day [May 28]. It is a twin-engine combat aircraft, of which the oldest example delivered to Croatia is said to be 10 years old. According to the information available, Croatia would pay just under € 1 billion for the entire contract, which includes planes, training and weapons.

At today's Defense Council session, support was given to the government for the purchase of a fighter plane.

President Zoran Milanovic (...) declared a little later that the government had not received a recommendation on the type of plane to buy, but hoped "that he and the Prime Minister understood each other well". When asked if he knew which plane we were buying, he replied "No comment".

After the government's official decision to accept the French offer, contract negotiations will ensue. If the contract was signed this year, France would deliver the first six planes in 2024 and the other six a year later. President Milanović, for his part, said the planes had to be in Croatia by 2024 at the latest.
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Deltafan said:
To be confirmed on 28 May : Rafale WOULD be winner in Croatia :

www.jutarnji.hr

Jutarnji doznaje: Hrvatska kupuje francuske borbene avione Rafale, evo koliko će koštati

Ukoliko bi ugovor bio potpisan ove godine, Francuska bi prvih šest aviona isporučila 2024. godine
www.jutarnji.hr www.jutarnji.hr

The Croatian government has decided to purchase 12 second-hand French F3R Rafale fighter jets, Jutarnji list learned from well-informed unofficial sources.

The decision is expected to be made by the government for Armed Forces Day [May 28]. It is a twin-engine combat aircraft, of which the oldest example delivered to Croatia is said to be 10 years old. According to the information available, Croatia would pay just under € 1 billion for the entire contract, which includes planes, training and weapons.

At today's Defense Council session, support was given to the government for the purchase of a fighter plane.

President Zoran Milanovic (...) declared a little later that the government had not received a recommendation on the type of plane to buy, but hoped "that he and the Prime Minister understood each other well". When asked if he knew which plane we were buying, he replied "No comment".

After the government's official decision to accept the French offer, contract negotiations will ensue. If the contract was signed this year, France would deliver the first six planes in 2024 and the other six a year later. President Milanović, for his part, said the planes had to be in Croatia by 2024 at the latest.
Click to expand...
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congrats to Croatia

pic via Brit modeler
49810266046_0b28417fbd_b.jpg
 
According to newspapers from Hrvatska
www.jutarnji.hr

Jutarnji doznaje: Hrvatska kupuje francuske borbene avione Rafale, evo koliko će koštati

Ukoliko bi ugovor bio potpisan ove godine, Francuska bi prvih šest aviona isporučila 2024. godine
www.jutarnji.hr www.jutarnji.hr

Deliveries start in 2024
oldest aircraft is only 10 years old
they are ex French Rafale F3R

I remember in 2010, there were all these articles asking.. Why cant the Rafale secure one export? will it end up being like the Viggen.
As the Typhoon took all the exports in 2000 - 2010s
now its reversed, 2010s -20s its Rafales!

except Qatar.. they buying everything.. Rafales, typhoons, eagles, just waiting for the F-35 and Gripens now
 
More details concerning Rafale offer to Croatia:
- 930M€ for 12 airframe (around 60M€ per airframe if we deduce from that amount 200M€ for the weapons: a 50% bargain from the selling price (poor India)).
- 9000hr service life from 2024 onward (that's the entire Rafale guaranteed life! Not bad for a used airframe).
- delivered in two batches: 6 in 2024 and 6 in 2025
- Competing bid from LM confirmed as being a 1.5B€ for 12 brand new and better equipped F-16V

www.air-cosmos.com

La Croatie devient le 5e client export du Rafale

Ce nouveau succès ne surprendra pas les lecteurs d'Air&Cosmos. Car dés le mois de février nous annoncions que l'offre française avait la faveur des autorités Croates.
www.air-cosmos.com www.air-cosmos.com
 
To be confirmed once more again (and even more than the other things to be confirmed for the Rafale orders, as it's for some years...)

breakingdefense.com

Egyptian Deal For Rafale Fighters Boosts Data Sharing - Breaking Defense

Egyptian sources tell Breaking Defense that this may not be the last Rafale purchase. Egypt is now eying the Rafale F4. “We are looking to increase the (overall) number to 72 or 100 units, depending on Egypt’s financial capacity.”
breakingdefense.com breakingdefense.com
 
TomcatViP said:
More details concerning Rafale offer to Croatia:
- 930M€ for 12 airframe (around 60M€ per airframe if we deduce from that amount 200M€ for the weapons: a 50% bargain from the selling price (poor India)).
Click to expand...
I would imagine that's because India got a new more advanced version?
Croatia got old ones.

back to the F4s are there any visual differences between them and the older variants?
 
On 18 May 2021, the first Rafale B with serial 101 for the Elliniki Polemiki Aeroporia (HAF, Hellenic Air Force) was photographed whilst flying from Base Aérienne 125 (BA 125) Istres-Le Tubé in the south of France.
Click to expand...
Greece_Rafale_A.Gonzales_480.jpg

www.scramble.nl

First Greek Rafale B

First Greek Rafale B On 18 May 2021, the first Rafale B with serial 401 for the Elliniki Polemiki Aeroporia (HAF, Hellenic Air Force) was photographed whilst flying from Base Aérie...
www.scramble.nl www.scramble.nl

And as Air forces gathered around Dassault for fresh supplies, Mr Macron broke the Rafale in pieces and all air forces went their own way satiated... (nearly)
 
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TomcatViP said:
On 18 May 2021, the first Rafale B with serial 101 for the Elliniki Polemiki Aeroporia (HAF, Hellenic Air Force) was photographed whilst flying from Base Aérienne 125 (BA 125) Istres-Le Tubé in the south of France.
Click to expand...
Greece_Rafale_A.Gonzales_480.jpg

www.scramble.nl

First Greek Rafale B

First Greek Rafale B On 18 May 2021, the first Rafale B with serial 401 for the Elliniki Polemiki Aeroporia (HAF, Hellenic Air Force) was photographed whilst flying from Base Aérie...
www.scramble.nl www.scramble.nl

And as Air forces gathered around Dassault for fresh supplies, Macron broke the Rafale in pieces and all air forces went their own way satiated... (nearly)
Click to expand...
And another view

1621780433900.png

Now on to the additional order. :cool:
 
stealthflanker said:

The Su-35 deal were supposed to be financed through loan from BNP Paribas. I dont know tho if this potential Rafale deal would use the same bank.
Click to expand...
Almost true, but contract was signed in 2018, but after the news about CAATSA and little pressure from the third site Indonesia started to delay this project. Russia made new proposal with the usage of new bank, not BNP Paribas. Because BNP didn't want to be involved in connections with Russian companies. But unfortunately the things aren't moving.
 
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It has been exactly 20 years to the day since the first Rafale F1 entered service with the Aéronavale onboard CdG.

Flotille 12F - May 18, 2001. Only 18 months before they were still flying Crusaders. And nearly four decades earlier, Crusaders had replaced vintage WWII F4U Corsair !

La 12F sur réacteur – Album 4 - Escadrilles

Flottille 12F : 2001-2007 La 12F Rafale – période F1 L’Aéronautique Navale s’était retrouvée orpheline de ses intercepteurs et de ses porte-avions pendant l’année 2000. Avec l’admission au service actif du porte-avions R91 Charles de Gaulle et la re-création de la flottille 12F sur Rafale F1, le...
www.escadrilles.org www.escadrilles.org
 
Exercice Atlantic Trident 21, the plane spotters perspective (in Fr):

www.francebleu.fr

VIDÉO - Passionnés et curieux guettent les avions de chasse de l'exercice "Atlantic Trident" à Mont-de-Marsan - France Bleu

Des avions de chasse par dizaines dans le ciel de Mont-de-Marsan : l'exercice Atlantic Trident, qui réunit depuis le 17 mai les armées de l'Air française, britannique et américaine, attire tout autour de la base aérienne curieux et passionnés, particulièrement impressionnés par les F-35 américains.
www.francebleu.fr www.francebleu.fr
 
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4 shades of gray:

Atlantic_Trident_21_640.jpg


Armée de l'Air et de l'Espace (French Air and Space Force)
8x Rafale from EC-30 at BA118 Mont-de-Marsan *)
4x Rafale from EC-4 at BA113 Saint Dizier/Robinson *)
2x Mirage 2000D from EC-3 at BA133 Nancy/Ochey
4x Mirage 2000-5 from EC01.002 Cigognes at BA116 Luxeuil/St.Sauveur
2x Mirage 2000C RDI from EC02.005 Île de France at BA115 Orange/Caritat
4x Alphat Jet E from EC-8 at BA120 Cazaux
2x PC-21 from EAC-315 at BA709 Cognac/Châteaubernard
2x EC725R2 from EH01.067 Pyrénées at BA120 Cazaux
1x A400M from ET01.061 Touraine at BA123 Orléans/Bricy
2x C-130H from ET-61 at BA123 Orléans/Bricy
1x E-3F from EDCA-36 at BA702 Avord
1x C-135FR or A330MRTT from ERV-31 at BA125 Istres/Le Tubé
Marine National (French Navy)
4x Rafale M from 12F at Landivisiau.
Royal Air Force (RAF)
4x Typhoon FRG4 fro XI(F) Squadron at RAF Coningsby
2x Voyager KC2/KC3 from 10/101 Squadron at RAF Brize Norton
1x Sentry AEW1 from 8 Squadron at RAF Waddington
US Air Force
2x KC 135R from 351st ARS at RAF Mildenhall
12x F-35A from 388th Fighter Wing ('HL') at Hill AFB (UT)
Operating from HMS Queen Elizabeth
4x F-35B from 617 Squadron Dambusters
4x F-35B from VMFA-211 The Wake Island Avengers ('CF')

*) EC-30 and EC-4 participated with more aircraft than officially reported. The following Rafales were seen at Mont-de-Marsan:

EC-30 Rafale C: 104/30-HH, 108/30-HS, 112/30-IQ, 113/30-IR, 121/30-IZ, 126/30-GE, 129/30-GH, 131/30-GJ and 134/30-GM
EC-30 Rafale B: 329/30-ID and 354/30-FU
EC-4 Rafale C: 111/4-IP
EC-4 Rafale B: 308/4-HA, 323/4-HT, 325/4-HX, 334/4-II, 335/4-IJ, 346/4-FM and 353/4-FS
Click to expand...
www.scramble.nl

Atlantic Trident 21

Atlantic Trident 21 The trilateral exercise Atlantic Trident results from a strategic partnership called Trilateral Strategic Initiative (TSI), established in 2010 between the US A...
www.scramble.nl www.scramble.nl
 
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wow among the 4 contenders, Gripen, used israeli F-16b30s, F-16 (unknown block?) and Rafales

they narrowed it down to the F-16 and Rafale. Gripen didnt even make it to the finalist :confused:
 
The 12 Rafale sold to Greece must be replaced:

www.latribune.fr

Après la Grèce, la France s'offre à son tour une commande de Rafale

Florence Parly a annoncé vendredi matin la commande de 12 Rafale supplémentaires pour remplacer les appareils de l'armée de l'Air, qui vont être transférés à la Grèce. L'armée de l'air grecque s'est dotée de 18 Rafale, dont 12 d'occasion.
www.latribune.fr www.latribune.fr

Not the 12 for Croatia:

Après la Croatie, pas de nouvelle commande de Rafale pour la France

Selon nos informations, le ministère des Armées ne souhaite pas commander de nouveaux appareils mais préfère privilégier la qualité du parc à la quantité. Les Rafale auront de nouveaux équipements de mission supplémentaires (radar AESA, pod Talios, moteur M88) achetés grâce au produit de cession...
www.latribune.fr www.latribune.fr

After Croatia, no new Rafale order for France

According to our information, the Ministry of the Armed Forces does not wish to order new devices but prefers to focus on the quality of the fleet over quantity. The Rafales will have new additional mission equipment (AESA radar, Talios pod, M88 engine) purchased using the proceeds from the sale of the used Rafale.

The future Croatian order will have an impact on the Air Force Rafale fleet. The target of 171 Rafale (including 129 for the Air Force) provided for at the end of the Military Programming Law (LPM) will ultimately not be reached, according to our information. The Ministry of the Armed Forces does not wish to order new devices but prefers to focus on the quality of the fleet over quantity. Thus, with the proceeds from the sale of the Air Force Rafales to Croatia (more than 999 million euros), the ministry wants to buy mission equipment, which is currently lacking in the Rafale in service.

To improve operational readiness as well as Rafale missions, the Directorate General of Armaments (DGA) will in particular order additional AESA radars (Thales), which are gradually replacing the RBE2, Talios designation pods (Thales) and M88 engines (Safran). This will allow all the different standards of Rafale in service to be erased more quickly (currently the last standard is the F3R). These purchases therefore go beyond the forecasts included in the 2019-2025 LPM. Above all, this equipment will improve the performance of the Rafale. Typically, the Meteor air-to-air missile expresses its full performance with an AESA radar.

Rafale production line saved

Compared to Greece, the Ministry of the Armed Forces has changed its mind. This decision is clearly different from that taken after the Rafale contract in Greece (18 aircraft sold, including 12 used): the ministry then wanted to replace the 12 used Rafale sold in Athens with 12 new Rafale for the army of the air. As part of the Ravel program, he also planned to put 10 Rafale back in flight, which were parked by the Air Force and cannibalized in order to serve as spare parts for planes leaving on mission or in training. In theory, the Air Force will therefore benefit in the long term from 22 additional "in service" aircraft.

Finally, export contracts in Egypt and then in Greece as well as national orders have made it possible to restore visibility for several years to the Rafale assembly line of Dassault Aviation. There is no longer any urgency concerning the industrial production line of the tricolor combat aircraft, which sustains a network of 500 French companies.
Click to expand...
 
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