Dassault Rafale NEWS ONLY

[TomcatViP]

New?

 

[Lascaris]

New?

No idea at the moment.

 

[Deltafan]

Breaking news. Greek prime minister just publicly announced expanding the Greek Rafale order from 18 to 24.

For the moment only found on Twitter.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1436774596422819841

View: https://twitter.com/MakisHellas1/status/1436774596422819841

https://twitter.com/x/status/1436757207996059657

View: https://twitter.com/defencegreece_m/status/1436757207996059657

https://twitter.com/x/status/1436748047602667525

View: https://twitter.com/omadaalithias/status/1436748047602667525?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1436749570575421446%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es3_&ref_url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.air-defense.net%2Fforum%2Findex.php%3Fapp%3Dcoremodule%3Dsystemcontroller%3Dembedurl%3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2Ftop_force%2Fstatus%2F1436749570575421446%3Fs%3D19

Mitsotakis at TIF (?): 24 and not 18 the Rafale that will fly in the Greek skies

 

[Lascaris]

Breaking news. Greek prime minister just publicly announced expanding the Greek Rafale order from 18 to 24.

For the moment only found on Twitter.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1436774596422819841

View: https://twitter.com/MakisHellas1/status/1436774596422819841

https://twitter.com/x/status/1436757207996059657

View: https://twitter.com/defencegreece_m/status/1436757207996059657

https://twitter.com/x/status/1436748047602667525

View: https://twitter.com/omadaalithias/status/1436748047602667525?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1436749570575421446%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es3_&ref_url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.air-defense.net%2Fforum%2Findex.php%3Fapp%3Dcoremodule%3Dsystemcontroller%3Dembedurl%3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2Ftop_force%2Fstatus%2F1436749570575421446%3Fs%3D19

Mitsotakis at TIF (?): 24 and not 18 the Rafale that will fly in the Greek skies

He said it live on national TV in his speech in the international fair of Thessaloniki, traditionally the annual speech there every September is one of the imost mportant political events of the year covering the government progress up to then and used to announced new measures as well, that's where the initial order of 18 machines was announced last year. Exact turn of phrase was "here I announced last year the purchase of 18 Rafales, which will soon become 24".

I was waiting to see if he'd announce a winner for the frigate program... got official confirmation for the rumors already around for more Rafales instead. Bad news for DCN good for Dassault and HAF. Sooner or later I expect another 12...

 

[Deltafan]

Thanks Lascaris.

First article (from India) that I found :

Greece increases the number of Rafale type warplanes to 24

Mitsotakis spoke at the opening of the International Thessaloniki Fair, where the Prime Minister traditionally evaluates the previous year and announces the

morningexpress.in

Mitsotakis spoke at the opening of the International Thessaloniki Fair, where the Prime Minister traditionally evaluates the previous year and announces the economic plan for the next year.

Arguing that Athens carried out an active diplomacy and increased its defense power against the national problems encountered last year, Prime Minister Mitsotakis reminded that he announced that 18 Rafale-type fighter jets will be purchased last year, and noted that this number will increase to 24 in the near future.

 

[Lascaris]

Thanks Lascaris.

First article (from India) that I found :

Greece increases the number of Rafale type warplanes to 24

Mitsotakis spoke at the opening of the International Thessaloniki Fair, where the Prime Minister traditionally evaluates the previous year and announces the

morningexpress.in

Mitsotakis spoke at the opening of the International Thessaloniki Fair, where the Prime Minister traditionally evaluates the previous year and announces the economic plan for the next year.

Arguing that Athens carried out an active diplomacy and increased its defense power against the national problems encountered last year, Prime Minister Mitsotakis reminded that he announced that 18 Rafale-type fighter jets will be purchased last year, and noted that this number will increase to 24 in the near future.

Here from the very reliable Greek Flight & Space magazine, in Greek of course

ÎÎΤÎÎΤÎ: ΣÏν 6 Rafale για Ïην Î Î, Ïο εÏιβεβαίÏÏε ο ÎηÏÏοÏÎ¬ÎºÎ·Ï ÏÏη ÎÎÎ - Î ÏήÏη

Την ενίÏÏÏÏη ÏÎ·Ï Î Î¿Î»ÎµÎ¼Î¹ÎºÎ®Ï ÎεÏοÏοÏÎ¯Î±Ï Î¼Îµ εÏιÏλÎον 6 μαÏηÏικά Rafale, ÏÏοανήγγειλε αÏÏ Ïο βήμα ÏÎ·Ï ÎÎÎ ÏÏιν λίγα λεÏÏά ο ÏÏÏθÏÏοÏÏγÏÏ ÎÏÏÎ¹Î¬ÎºÎ¿Ï ÎηÏÏοÏάκηÏ. ÎÏÏÏ Î¿ Î¯Î´Î¹Î¿Ï ÏÏνιÏε ÏαÏακÏηÏιÏÏικά Ïα 18 Rafale, Ïα...

www.ptisidiastima.com

You'll note that the older article linked at the end of the present one, written back in late May was talking about Greece being close to ordering 6 new Rafale F4 and discussing participation in FCAS program as well. Which if it happens, likely with 5-10% from the Greek point of view will be even bigger news and makes absolute sense, Greece has bought 3 generations of French fighters so far, it is the way to bet that when SCAF comes around it will be bought too so why not look ahead and get into its development? We should had done this with Rafale from 1985, not to mention taken up Dassault in 1972 on their proposal for a 20% share in Mirage F1 industrial work.

 

[TomcatViP]

Would be great to have an air force such as the Greek's join the FCAS program. That could only injects more operationally minded momentum in the project.

Last but not least, regarding the "used" Rafale and the incredible bargain that this has proved to be, as said by the Greeks themselves, it might strike more the minds:

First of all, in terms of the used 12 aircraft that we have already bought, as well as the 6 new ones, if you remember, we were the first to write that everything will be at the F3R level. For those who believed in various nonsense about obsolete fighters, we will say that the Rafale F3R has just acquired Initial Operational Capability. This means that our French friends handed over to us within 6 months the top fighter aircraft of their country. Since this move by France, the air balance in the Aegean has changed in favor of Greece.

(translated from the link above)

 

[Archibald]

Thanks Lascaris.

First article (from India) that I found :

Greece increases the number of Rafale type warplanes to 24

Mitsotakis spoke at the opening of the International Thessaloniki Fair, where the Prime Minister traditionally evaluates the previous year and announces the

morningexpress.in

Mitsotakis spoke at the opening of the International Thessaloniki Fair, where the Prime Minister traditionally evaluates the previous year and announces the economic plan for the next year.

Arguing that Athens carried out an active diplomacy and increased its defense power against the national problems encountered last year, Prime Minister Mitsotakis reminded that he announced that 18 Rafale-type fighter jets will be purchased last year, and noted that this number will increase to 24 in the near future.

Here from the very reliable Greek Flight & Space magazine, in Greek of course

ÎÎΤÎÎΤÎ: ΣÏν 6 Rafale για Ïην Î Î, Ïο εÏιβεβαίÏÏε ο ÎηÏÏοÏÎ¬ÎºÎ·Ï ÏÏη ÎÎÎ - Î ÏήÏη

Την ενίÏÏÏÏη ÏÎ·Ï Î Î¿Î»ÎµÎ¼Î¹ÎºÎ®Ï ÎεÏοÏοÏÎ¯Î±Ï Î¼Îµ εÏιÏλÎον 6 μαÏηÏικά Rafale, ÏÏοανήγγειλε αÏÏ Ïο βήμα ÏÎ·Ï ÎÎÎ ÏÏιν λίγα λεÏÏά ο ÏÏÏθÏÏοÏÏγÏÏ ÎÏÏÎ¹Î¬ÎºÎ¿Ï ÎηÏÏοÏάκηÏ. ÎÏÏÏ Î¿ Î¯Î´Î¹Î¿Ï ÏÏνιÏε ÏαÏακÏηÏιÏÏικά Ïα 18 Rafale, Ïα...

www.ptisidiastima.com

You'll note that the older article linked at the end of the present one, written back in late May was talking about Greece being close to ordering 6 new Rafale F4 and discussing participation in FCAS program as well. Which if it happens, likely with 5-10% from the Greek point of view will be even bigger news and makes absolute sense, Greece has bought 3 generations of French fighters so far, it is the way to bet that when SCAF comes around it will be bought too so why not look ahead and get into its development? We should had done this with Rafale from 1985, not to mention taken up Dassault in 1972 on their proposal for a 20% share in Mirage F1 industrial work.

Did the Greeks ever considered the Mirage III ? Just being curious...

 

[Flyaway]

Would be great to have an air force such as the Greek's join the FCAS program. That could only injects more operationally minded momentum in the project.

Last but not least, regarding the "used" Rafale and the incredible bargain that this has proved to be, as said by the Greeks themselves, it might strike more the minds:

First of all, in terms of the used 12 aircraft that we have already bought, as well as the 6 new ones, if you remember, we were the first to write that everything will be at the F3R level. For those who believed in various nonsense about obsolete fighters, we will say that the Rafale F3R has just acquired Initial Operational Capability. This means that our French friends handed over to us within 6 months the top fighter aircraft of their country. Since this move by France, the air balance in the Aegean has changed in favor of Greece.

(translated from the link above)

I imagine Team Tempest would be looking at additional partners as the same place as FCAS would.

 

[Lascaris]

You'll note that the older article linked at the end of the present one, written back in late May was talking about Greece being close to ordering 6 new Rafale F4 and discussing participation in FCAS program as well. Which if it happens, likely with 5-10% from the Greek point of view will be even bigger news and makes absolute sense, Greece has bought 3 generations of French fighters so far, it is the way to bet that when SCAF comes around it will be bought too so why not look ahead and get into its development? We should had done this with Rafale from 1985, not to mention taken up Dassault in 1972 on their proposal for a 20% share in Mirage F1 industrial work.

Did the Greeks ever considered the Mirage III ? Just being curious...

Actually... yes. The sent a team to test fly Mirage IIIE in 1968 and apparently came close to buying a pair of squadrons, at least 30 machines, afterwards. Some delays were incurred, Nixon in the meantime made available F-4E and Dassault also switched his sale pitch to Mirage F1 by 1971-72 he was offering the 20% industrial share mentioned to get the Greeks to sign. Which IMO the colonels were stupid to refuse... when they did buy Mirage F1 two years later anyway. Not least if the order had come in 1972 the first squadron would be available over the Aegean in July 1974... and by every account Mirage F1 was the best interceptor in the area till F-16 and Mirage 2000 showed up and even against them it remained very dangerous in a dogfight.

 

[TomcatViP]

The Mirage F1 was not superior to the F-4E.

 

[Lascaris]

The Mirage F1 was not superior to the F-4E.

Overall no. In a dogfight on the other hand...

 

[Archibald]

The F1 wasn't a missile truck and avionics-wise, France lagged behind the USA. But the Phantom manoeuvered like a led brick.

 

[H_K]

The Mirage F1 was not superior to the F-4E.

That statement deserves to be qualified. In the pure air superiority role (fighter vs fighter) the Mirage F1 had many advantages over the F-4E, including superior weapons (Magic 1 vs. Aim-9B, 30mm Defa gun vs 20mm Vulcan, later Super 530F vs Aim-7F) and maneuverability, also being much harder to spot visually etc. It would probably come ahead in any head-to-head engagement or against contemporary Migs.

In the early 70s for example the Israelis were perfectly comfortable leaving air superiority and fighter escort to their Mirage IIIs while their F-4Es focused on bombing. The F1 was a step up from the MIII so…

Not to mention the F1 being a lot more affordable and easy to maintain than the F-4E.

The F-4E however was better as a multi-role fighter bomber and as a bomber interceptor, where larger payload and a sophisticated 2-crew weapons system would come in handy.

 

[Deltafan]

French Defense Minister confirms 6 more Rafale:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1437019538726469638

View: https://twitter.com/florence_parly/status/1437019538726469638

 

[Deltafan]

Maybe 36 more Rafale (F4) for India.

Mega deals 2022 : 36 Rafale, 6 P-8,C-130J and 2 ISTAR for IAF n Navy – Indian Defence Research Wing

idrw.org

As usual: to be confirmed.

 

[TomcatViP]

3 more delivered on the 13th of October:

Rafale Fighter Jets: Three more Rafale fighters touch down at Jamnagar airbase | India News - Times of India

India News: Three more French-origin Rafale fighters touched down at the Jamnagar airbase in India, after mid-air refueling by tankers of France and UAE, on Wedne

timesofindia.indiatimes.com

 

[aonestudio]

Eye on mega deal with Navy, Dassault will fly Rafale Marine to India in 2022 for showcase trip

Dassault Aviation had been in talks with Navy for the naval version of Rafale even before the French giant signed the contract for 36 air force fighters in 2016.

theprint.in

 

[helmutkohl]

Eye on mega deal with Navy, Dassault will fly Rafale Marine to India in 2022 for showcase trip

Dassault Aviation had been in talks with Navy for the naval version of Rafale even before the French giant signed the contract for 36 air force fighters in 2016.

theprint.in

unfortunately the part I want to know.. they couldnt mention in the article. Quite personally I really would like to see the Rafale fly off the Indian carriers.. but I really have no idea how they will resolve the elevator issue. It still boggles me how tiny they made the elevators. I can understand the Vikramaditya since its original design was a destroyer.. but the new Vikrant was a clean sheet design.

Sources in the defence establishment sought to allay fears expressed in some quarters that the lift of the indigenous aircraft carrier was small and would not be able to accommodate either the Rafale M or the F/A-18. While the Boeing fighter comes with foldable wings, Rafale does not.


“The mere fact that both companies are eager to offer their aircraft means that they have taken into account various measurements,” a source said, refusing to get into the specifics.

 

[Bhurki]

Eye on mega deal with Navy, Dassault will fly Rafale Marine to India in 2022 for showcase trip

Dassault Aviation had been in talks with Navy for the naval version of Rafale even before the French giant signed the contract for 36 air force fighters in 2016.

theprint.in

unfortunately the part I want to know.. they couldnt mention in the article. Quite personally I really would like to see the Rafale fly off the Indian carriers.. but I really have no idea how they will resolve the elevator issue. It still boggles me how tiny they made the elevators. I can understand the Vikramaditya since its original design was a destroyer.. but the new Vikrant was a clean sheet design.

Sources in the defence establishment sought to allay fears expressed in some quarters that the lift of the indigenous aircraft carrier was small and would not be able to accommodate either the Rafale M or the F/A-18. While the Boeing fighter comes with foldable wings, Rafale does not.


“The mere fact that both companies are eager to offer their aircraft means that they have taken into account various measurements,” a source said, refusing to get into the specifics.

If they decide to spend some $5-6B on 36 Rafales, I'm sure they'll find a fraction more to modify the lifts.

 

[starviking]

unfortunately the part I want to know.. they couldnt mention in the article. Quite personally I really would like to see the Rafale fly off the Indian carriers.. but I really have no idea how they will resolve the elevator issue. It still boggles me how tiny they made the elevators. I can understand the Vikramaditya since its original design was a destroyer.. but the new Vikrant was a clean sheet design.

Maybe the lift size was limited to protect the LCA programme? “Yes Minister, the LCA has run into problems, but we simply MUST have it for our new carrier - nothing else will do.”

 

[Archibald]

The idiocy is also on the French side, TBH - for the sake of commonality with the AdA, no folding wintips.
Had the Aéronavale been allowed to buy Hornets... but politics would never, ever allow it.

 

[helmutkohl]

The idiocy is also on the French side, TBH - for the sake of commonality with the AdA, no folding wintips.
Had the Aéronavale been allowed to buy Hornets... but politics would never, ever allow it.

i'm glad I'm not the only one who felt so.

I've said it often.. France should have skipped over the Rafale. the Navy could make do with the Hornets as the Crusader and entendard replacement.

Its not that I dislike the Rafale (its probably my favorite of the Eurocanards).. but the M2K was and still is a mighty good plane.
but to me I didnt like the idea of a 4th gen -> 4.5 gen -> and now 6th gen? acquisition process
the M2K first flew in 78, and then the Rafale A demo first flew just 8 years later. the M2K still has a lot of design life left to last to the 2030s. Resources could have went to a 5th gen aircraft instead, so the timeline would have been
M2K -> 5th gen

the M2K has done certainly well in the Aegean, Himalayas, and North Africa theaters.

 

[Archibald]

I have mixed feelings. Dassault needed to replace the 2000 to survive into the 21th century. The 2000 itself was already a letdown, from the 4000: Giscard logical choice in 1975, after the oil shock.

Now, was the Rafale the optimal solution ? From the point of foreign export orders (coming after 1400 Mirage III, 700+ Mirage F1s, and 600+ Mirage 2000s) NO.

It is a matter of politics and history, the AdA wanted a twin-jet since 1958, but Phantom (= Mirage IVC) F-111 ( = AFVG, G4, G8) and F-15 (= ACF, 4000) were always unaffordable to France finances.

By 1978 Hornet (and MiG-29) provided a new twin-jet template: smaller and cheaper thanks to smaller turbofan (F404).
Typhoon and Rafale, thanks to EJ200 and M88, were seen as "Euro-Hornets" rather than "Euro F-111" (Tornado, barely affordable by 3 countries) or "Euro F-15" (ACF, Mirage 4000, unaffordable to France alone).

Novi Avion is a fascinating glimpse at what a post-2000, single-engine alt-Rafale might have been.

But the AdA by 1985 already had a crapload of single-engine, redundant types.
Fundamentally, in the second-half of the 80's Mirage F1C-200 with Super 530F and early Mirage 2000 RDM/ RDI (with Super 530D) overlapped in the interceptor role.

In stark contrast, when France fought GW1 in January 1991, its strike force was largely obsolete: Mirage IIIE, Mirage V, and Jaguars. Mirage 2000N was only for nuclear strike; Mirage 2000D come too late, in 1993.
As a result only Jaguars fought, and the first missions were... scary (Al-Jaber, January 17 1991 nearly ended in disaster).

SEPECAT Jaguar - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

First time French Jaguar pilots got a GPS in their cockpits, it was a civilian kit strapped with tape. I kid you not.

The AdA had plenty enough single-engine interceptors and did not wanted yet another one.
Mirage IV and Jaguar replacement drove the Rafale toward 2 engines.

 

[TomcatViP]

Slight rectification: Mirage F1 (ground & reco) and M2K (air dominance) participated to the french air operations during GW1. Some of the operations had to be restricted due to the presence of identical Mirages among the Iraqi AF.

 

[Archibald]

The strike F1 was the CT and came (like the 2000D) too late in 1992 93. French GW1 F1s were CR and indeed the risk of friendly fire was used against them. The GW1 2000s were RDI and interceptor only. Just like the USN Tomcats and Tornado ADV they were told only F-15s would get the kills, including RSAF ones.

So strikes fell on the Jaguar force.

 

[Manuducati]

Rafale to be tested from ski jump in 2022.

Le Rafale M au tremplin

Début 2022, Dassault Aviation devrait démontrer à la marine nationale indienne les capacités du Rafale M à décoller d'un tremplin d'un type similaire à celui qui équipe notamment le porte-avions indien Vikramaditya. A la différence de Boeing, Dassault a selon toute vraisemblance fait le choix de...

air-cosmos.com

 

[Deltafan]

As usual, to be confirmed:

https://twitter.com/x/status/1457588696593489922

View: https://twitter.com/DefenseDtb/status/1457588696593489922?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1457588696593489922%7Ctwgr%5E%7Ctwcon%5Es1_c10&ref_url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.air-defense.net%2Fforum%2Findex.php%3Fapp%3Dcoremodule%3Dsystemcontroller%3Dembedurl%3Dhttps%3A%2F%2Ftwitter.com%2Fdefensedtb%2Fstatus%2F1457588696593489922%3Fs%3D21

 

[Archibald]

If that true, then Pakistan will fee a little "squeezed" between two "Rafale air forces".
Time for them to drop those truly antiquated Mirage IIIs (even the ROSE ones), jump two generations (F1 and 2000) and land a Rafale order...

 

[Deltafan]

If that true, then Pakistan will fee a little "squeezed" between two "Rafale air forces".
Time for them to drop those truly antiquated Mirage IIIs (even the ROSE ones), jump two generations (F1 and 2000) and land a Rafale order...

Mmmh, I think Pakistan is in a bad mood to become a Rafale customer for a while ...

France turns the screws on Imran Khan, declines upgrade for Mirage, subs and more

Foreign secretary Harsh Vardhan Shringla was told about the French government’s decisions vis-a-vis Pakistan when he visited Paris on October 29.

www.hindustantimes.com

 

[GTX]

If that true, then Pakistan will fee a little "squeezed" between two "Rafale air forces".

Really? How?

 

[Deltafan]

36-6=30 delivered, I guess

Seventh batch of QEAF Rafales delivered

Seventh batch of QEAF Rafales delivered The seventh batch of Al-Quwwat Al-Jawiyyah Al-Amiriyyah Al-Qatariyyah (QEAF, Qatar Emiri Air Force) Dassault Rafales departed Bordeaux/Méri...

www.scramble.nl

 

[AN/AWW-14(V)]

Egypt's contract with France for a further 30 Dassault Rafale combat aircraft came into force on 15 November.

The manufacturer announced that the contract signed on 4 May to bring Egypt's total Rafale fleet from 24 up to 54 aircraft has now been activated.

As announced earlier in the year, Egypt is to acquire the additional Rafales for EUR3.8 billion (USD4.6 billion) via a 10-year loan.

Egypt signed for its first 24 Rafales (16 Rafale B/DM two-seaters and eight Rafale C/EM single-seaters) in early 2015, with deliveries commencing later the same year and running through to late 2017. Neither the composition of this latest order nor its delivery timeline have yet been revealed.

Although not noted in the announcement by the Egyptian MoD, the country's new Rafales are likely to be built to the latest F3-R standard that has recently been declared fully operational by the French armed forces.

Egypt activates Rafale contract

Egypt's contract with France for a further 30 Dassault Rafale combat aircraft came into force on 15 November.

www.janes.com

 

[TomcatViP]

Amazing how the cost is over that of a higher nbr of F-35 as recently bought by the SwAF.
At least, it's less than what India had to pay...

Interestingly however it shows how the simple Rafale, when marketed as such and not has a superlative fighter, has a market reminiscent of the Mirage III or V.

But then, what would happen to the FrAF allocated lots? We still have to see how this will be impacted as how, obviously, payments for earlier deals with Egypt have been going.

 

[Archibald]

Well if the Rafale pulls out a Mirage III against a F-35 that proves to be the Phantom - why not ?

Mirage III, F1 and 2000 together built and sold 1400+700+600 = 2400 airframes.
Out of this, the AdA got 450, 250 and 315 so an average 3*350 = a bit more than 1000.

Meaning the rest (1300 and counting) was exported.

A very honorable success in a world dominated, first, by the F-104 / F-4 / F-5 trio (5200+2200+2200 = 9600) and then by the F-16 (4500) and a few others (F-18).

The Typhoon and Grippen are presently mostly out of the game (a few sales there and here) so Rafale, without their peculiar issues (smallish Sweden with US engine; scattered European partners) sells rather well in the small niche between F-35 and Russian / Chinese types.

Rafale's present luck is
- F-16 is done (at least !)
- Typhoon and Grippen are stalled
- Superbug and F-22 are essentially done, too
- The Russians and Chinese are a bit stalled, too (Su-27 is growing old, Checkmate is only beginning, Chinese jets do not export a lot so far)
- F-35 is a mass-produced steamroller (makes no mistake) but has some rigid rules attached to its sales (networked, stealth, expensive and sophisticated, Turkey S-400 affair...)
- Yet not all countries forbidden of F-35 for varied reasons, wants F-16V or second-hand F-16s, even dirt cheap.

When you look that way, Rafale even if not stealth to the level of F-35, remains an honest-to-God alternative... even more since Dassault and France have no qualms selling their most advanced weaponry and sensors (unlike some troubling restrictions with the F-35).

 

[TMA1]

The rafale is extremely capable and frankly offers certain benefits that even f-35 does not offer. French truly make amazing kit.

 

[Archibald]

It is, for Dassault, a matter of survival...

 

[H_K]

Amazing how the cost is over that of a higher nbr of F-35 as recently bought by the SwAF.

Not quite true. The 36 F-35s for Switzerland cost CHF 5.07B, so about €134M each.

The 30 Rafale cost €3.8B, so €127M each.

So Rafale is cheaper by a hair. Hard to say more without knowing what is included in the package (weapons, spares, logistics etc). The Swiss package was very limited… almost no spares or weapons included according to the FMS approval.

 

[GTX]

and frankly offers certain benefits that even f-35 does not offer

Such as?

 

[H_K]

and frankly offers certain benefits that even f-35 does not offer

Such as?

If you’re Egypt, the ability to bomb Libya, Yemen, Israel etc without US pre-approval. Plus some weapons that the US may not be willing to sell.