Covid-19 Vaccine - Where, How & Costs

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If you have a passport, you already need vaccine documentation anyway. I understand the issue with airlines is more for people who can travel without the need for a passport (Within country, for instance).

Having said that, there was a gentleman in the UK who it turns out is immune to every version of the Covid-19 virus, so far. Hopefully they can figure that out and make a booster based off of the results.
 
The sputnik vaccine...

My understanding is there are multiple (>3) varieties of this. The Russians are spitting feathers that the Slovaks have dared to notice the type they've received is not the one they ordered. And the data for this variety is lacking. And Slovaks have had the temerity to do some tests there-on, which seem to have come up short...

So, decry as fake news, sling mud, claim contract violation, demand return ASAP...
 
The problems basically are the U.K. is a small densely populated country so too many virus hotspots is an issue. The test and trace system still doesn’t work effectively, and too many people don’t isolate when they are meant to, often for economic factors. Finally, young people have been spooked about vaccination by the blood clotting issue in the AZ vaccine, especially as it seems to impact the young more.

www.theguardian.com

Virus hotspots could lead to third Covid wave in UK, scientists warn

Boris Johnson accused of dropping pledge to ‘follow data not dates’ and urged to wait for more vaccinations before easing restrictions
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com
 
Ignore the somewhat excitable headline.

www.reuters.com

South African variant may 'break through' Pfizer vaccine protection, but vaccine highly effective, Israeli study says

The coronavirus variant discovered in South Africa can break through the protection provided by Pfizer Inc and BioNTech's COVID-19 vaccine to some extent, a real-world data study in Israel found. However, the variant's prevalence in Israel is very low and the vaccine remains highly effective.
www.reuters.com www.reuters.com

As with the story about the actual article paints a more complicated story than the headline would suggest.

m.huffingtonpost.co.uk

Nearly 40% Of Marines Have Declined COVID-19 Vaccinations

It's still unclear why so many have not received the vaccine.
m.huffingtonpost.co.uk m.huffingtonpost.co.uk
 
Our top stats guys on the risks of the clotting issue: "So what else has roughly a one in 100,000 chance for a young adult? We could choose from the risk of dying when under general anaesthesia, or in a skydiving jump, or, on the positive side, winning the Lotto jackpot if you bought 450 tickets, or guessing the last five digits of someone’s mobile phone number."

www.theguardian.com

How big are the blood-clot risks of the AstraZeneca jab? | David Spiegelhalter and Anthony Masters

Young people have as much chance of winning the lottery as of getting serious blood clots from the AstraZeneca vaccine
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com

I do like the guess the digits one as it's scaleable to other risks.
 
It's been two weeks since my second shot of inactivated vaccine (Coronavac by Sinovac).

Very mild upper arm discomfort after the first shot, comparable to a usual flu vaccine.

Effectiveness against mild disease is low, yes, but my East Asian jurisdiction has very low COVID rates, and effectiveness against severe disease is still in the 80%+ range, so the milder side effect profile is worth it.

Edit: People I know who got the Pfizer vaccine complain of severe shoulder and upper arm pain for a day or two, and flu like symptoms seem common after vaccination. That means it's working, but such is the cost benefit calculus.
 
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A virologist explains all about virus and its many variants. Really we aren’t taking on the virus so much but evolution. Shakes fist at Charles Darwin!!!

theconversation.com

How worried should you be about coronavirus variants? A virologist explains his concerns

As the US vaccinates millions more people each day, the novel coronavirus works to survive. It does this by mutating. So far, several variants are worrisome. A virologist explains what they are.
theconversation.com theconversation.com
 
DWG said:
Our top stats guys on the risks of the clotting issue: "So what else has roughly a one in 100,000 chance for a young adult? We could choose from the risk of dying when under general anaesthesia, or in a skydiving jump, or, on the positive side, winning the Lotto jackpot if you bought 450 tickets, or guessing the last five digits of someone’s mobile phone number."

www.theguardian.com

How big are the blood-clot risks of the AstraZeneca jab? | David Spiegelhalter and Anthony Masters

Young people have as much chance of winning the lottery as of getting serious blood clots from the AstraZeneca vaccine
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com

I do like the guess the digits one as it's scaleable to other risks.
Click to expand...
This is very true in terms of human perceptions of risk (thought I don't intend to go skydiving so my risk there is 0!).

The 1 per 100,000 in 'young' people is rather higher than the 1 in 250,000 figure the MRHA were broadcasting as the overall figure in the main media headlines last week. Analysis and discovery of new cases may well change these figures again, they may scale upwards or downwards depending on trends. Its the chop and change that will ultimately make people unsure, vaccination policy globally seems to be a moving target and always will be - we just have to accept that we don't know all the answers.

As to the Science link DWG posted, I seem to remember around December that the AZ vaccine was found slightly less effective in trials than the Pfizer vaccine and there had been talk that the doses in the trials may have been too low. I suspect that after that, the main production batches have been more concentrated doses to compensate - at the time effectiveness was the main concern for governments and health authorities before they parted with hard cash. Sadly that's probably led to untoward side-effects like this PF4 issue.
 
Grey Havoc said:
www.reuters.com

Australia abandons COVID-19 vaccination targets after new advice on AstraZeneca shots

Australia has abandoned a goal to vaccinate nearly all of its 26 million population by the end of 2021 following advice that people under the age of 50 take Pfizer's (PFE.N) COVID-19 vaccine rather than AstraZeneca's (AZN.L) shot.
www.reuters.com www.reuters.com
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Australia has very low case numbers, so it doesn't really make sense to go full steam ahead on AZ when it can just buy Moderna a few months down the road. Down Under, you'd kill quite a few more people with the vaccine than would have died from COVID.
 
TomcatViP said:
Shouldn't those in charge does it with the idea that they are not hermetically sealed from the possibility of a sudden outbreak?
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They're not totally sealed (non Aussie citizens can't enter, though, and they need to test and quarantine), but outbreaks take time to ramp up, and they can always lockdown again later. In the long run, it's going to be more expensive, but killing say fifty young people with AZ is just unwise when you are at 10 cases a day, mostly imports, nationwide. And the worst part is that you can buy Moderna or Pfizer. Why not do that? No rush.

They're not on the verge of lockdown right now. With low case numbers, a lot of activities are ok.

Far better vaccines will come by 2022. Those will form the backbone of long term response. The current vaccines are all stopgaps, basically, not yet optimized.

Europe and the US should by all means continue AZ inoculations. Their calculus is waaay different.
 
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I post the following with some hesitation. Rules are still in place in the UK and I trust the average person will observe them. I am a little disappointed with my fellow Americans who follow them incompletely and are paying the consequences.

www.bbc.com

Covid lockdown eases: Celebrations as pub gardens and shops reopen

Shoppers have been rushing back to the High Street, where queues were seen outside some retailers.
www.bbc.com www.bbc.com
 
Hood said:
I seem to remember around December that the AZ vaccine was found slightly less effective in trials than the Pfizer vaccine and there had been talk that the doses in the trials may have been too low. I suspect that after that, the main production batches have been more concentrated doses to compensate.
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If they changed the dosage between trials and the production run that would almost certainly invalidate their emergency use authorization. Any change would have to have authorization from MRHA (UK), EMA (EU) and all the other national medical authorities, and I don't see EMA especially being on-board with that.

The issue with AZ and dosage were that some of the trials subjects accidentally got a half dose as their first dose, there was then an attempt to figure out what to do to fix that, and they got their second dose late as a result (standard second dose AFAIK). When they combined all the stats from the trials they found that the affected group had better protection than the group who got the proper dosage both times (averaging the figures between both groups was one of the objections to their initially submitted data). The speculation was initially that the lower dosage was more effective, but they eventually realised that it was the longer period between doses that was key, which was the justification for the UK switching to 12 weeks between doses. So in theory we're getting the higher level of protection from the same overall dosage. Increasing dosage would also allow fewer people to be covered, and we've seen how much furore there's been over the number of doses AZ can crank out the door.
 
edwest said:
I post the following with some hesitation. Rules are still in place in the UK and I trust the average person will observe them. I am a little disappointed with my fellow Americans who follow them incompletely and are paying the consequences.

www.bbc.com

Covid lockdown eases: Celebrations as pub gardens and shops reopen

Shoppers have been rushing back to the High Street, where queues were seen outside some retailers.
www.bbc.com www.bbc.com
Click to expand...
Happy lockdown ending for those that are already there!
And congrats.
(and behave (a little bit longer), obviously) :)
 
A brief aside. In the US, the people who really matter work on Wall Street. They want everything to be exactly the way it was in early March 2020. Unemployment at 4.6%, Initial Public Offerings at their "usual" number and so on. Today, Wall Street is off to the races, They've posted record highs, the number of IPOs are up, and the wealthy are publishing lists of places they can go to get around restrictions. Quite irresponsible but I suppose the top 10% can do as they like. No one should follow the last example.

Regarding the AZ vaccine, I've read a scholarly article which, in summary, states that the data is not 100% conclusive. In other words, a yes or no answer is not possible at this point.
 
You'd be surpised about what is going in some places in the US. I've seen examples of people doing what they want because they can or think they can. For example, a curbside only restaurant where you sat in your car and your order was brought to you. A few days ago, I ordered again. But this time, instead of the usual, I saw a family of six walk out, with one person wearing their face mask improperly. Then I saw a few more people go back and forth in short order. Just down the street, this is still not allowed.
 
Don't worry, those kind of ppl are everywhere. I can understand how enraging this can be. You've got kids, keep them lashed that they don't run everywhere and spread or catch germs and suddenly one irresponsible mature man cross your path ruining everything you've fighted for.

In France, I hear they have secret dinning places for the ones in the known that know where to go where even covid-masking is not allowed. The great days of occupied Paris have caught-up (while the Ukrainian president calls NATO for help right from the front line (CNN)).

Think about a depressing virus...
 
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edwest said:
You'd be surpised about what is going in some places in the US. I've seen examples of people doing what they want because they can or think they can. For example, a curbside only restaurant where you sat in your car and your order was brought to you. A few days ago, I ordered again. But this time, instead of the usual, I saw a family of six walk out, with one person wearing their face mask improperly.
Click to expand...

My god, the horror. :rolleyes:
 
TomcatViP said:
Don't worry, those kind of ppl are everywhere. I can understand how enraging this can be. You've got kids, keep them lashed that they don't run everywhere and spread or catch germs and suddenly one irresponsible mature man cross your path ruining everything you've fighted for.
Click to expand...

I doubt somebody crossing your path, who wasn't wearing a mask "correctly", is a danger to anybody. Social distancing, vaccines, your OWN mask, etc. There's being cautious then there's being clinically paranoid.
 
I painted your handle on my torso. I know now that my lungs are safe. Thank you.
 
sferrin said:
TomcatViP said:
Unmasked ;)
I am glad that I have to do a correction.
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Even NO mask. If you're wearing a mask, got the vaccine, and are social distancing, why care what somebody else does?
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Because none of them are 100%. The overall success of vaccination and other mitigation strategies ultimatey depends on sufficient people taking precautions to break any chain of transmission and keep R below 1. The more people who aren't vaccinated and observing precautions, the higher the risk. And many people are at much higher risk than others. I'm the only one in my family who isn't clinically extremely vulnerable.
 
DWG said:
sferrin said:
TomcatViP said:
Unmasked ;)
I am glad that I have to do a correction.
Click to expand...
Even NO mask. If you're wearing a mask, got the vaccine, and are social distancing, why care what somebody else does?
Click to expand...
Because none of them are 100%. The overall success of vaccination and other mitigation strategies ultimatey depends on sufficient people taking precautions to break any chain of transmission and keep R below 1. The more people who aren't vaccinated and observing precautions, the higher the risk. And many people are at much higher risk than others. I'm the only one in my family who isn't clinically extremely vulnerable.
Click to expand...
The "extremely vulnerable" would probably be susceptible to the regular flu (remember when that existed). What did they do then? The world isn't going to remain masked up and in lockdown until COVID goes extinct. The goalposts have moved so far since, "15 days to flatten the curve" it's become a farce.
 
Covid-19 is considerably more dangerous than regular flu. Genetically, it's as much like flu as a cockroach is like a blue whale - both animals, and there the similarity ends.
 
This is not a case of "As long as I get to safety." Our actions involve the usual quarantine precautions I was taught in the 1970s. You and the patient wear a face covering, gloves are worn and there is hand washing. If anyone thinks viruses are only transmitted over long distances in the open air then they are missing the point.

I avoid people - keep my distance - if they are not wearing a face mask or wearing it wrong. I can't tell an infected from an uninfected person just by looking at them. And that is the key problem. When bars in the US were allowed to reopen for a brief period, they packed people in like sardines. So, after people were found to be infected, they closed them again.

In fact, signs with the words "Face Covering Required to Enter" did not appear until relatively recently.

I am about to get the vaccine and will continue taking precautions even after the final dose. Until an official announcement from the relevant health-care authorities occurs, I will limit the places I go to. Especially the crowded kind filled with people who think everything's fine, and masks are not required. I strongly urge people to get complete information about whatever vaccine they get.
 
In the Netherlands, the reluctance among ultra-orthodox christians against vaccinations and measures to limit covid-19 spreading is noticeably higher than in the rest of the population - as is the number of covid-19 deaths.
 
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France official death count closes on 100 000 covid casualties (Europe1 is a popular private radio Chanel - France total population 65Millions):

www.europe1.fr

Covid-19 : 99.135 morts en France, la situation continue de se dégrader à l'hôpital

Selon les dernières données de Santé publique France publiée lundi, la France compte 99.135 morts du Covid-19 depuis le début de l'épidémie dans le pays. A l'hôpital, les patients continuent d'affluer avec plus de 800 personnes supplémentaires prises en charge lundi par rapport à dimanche. Plus...
www.europe1.fr www.europe1.fr
 
sferrin said:
DWG said:
Because none of them are 100%. The overall success of vaccination and other mitigation strategies ultimatey depends on sufficient people taking precautions to break any chain of transmission and keep R below 1. The more people who aren't vaccinated and observing precautions, the higher the risk. And many people are at much higher risk than others. I'm the only one in my family who isn't clinically extremely vulnerable.
Click to expand...
The "extremely vulnerable" would probably be susceptible to the regular flu (remember when that existed). What did they do then? The world isn't going to remain masked up and in lockdown until COVID goes extinct. The goalposts have moved so far since, "15 days to flatten the curve" it's become a farce.
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As Arjen pointed out, Covid is much more of a killer than flu is, estimates range from two to three times as lethal up to ten times and more (complicated by how much of a killer flu is varying from year to year). And flu hasn't been showing explosive growth in exposed populations, because we typically have some existing resistance to flu strains, while Covid is essentially a virgin field epidemic with no population resistance. And one that's particularly lethal for those categorized as 'clinically extremely vulnerable' or 'shielders' in the UK.

And what vulnerable people did, and do, is get vaccinated against flu. And now they're getting vaccinated against Covid, but the vaccination programme is incomplete and incidence still high, so until the vaccination programme is completed, and incidence drops down, it makes sense to take extra precations, such as mask-wearing and social-distancing, whether for yourself, or for the benefit of those around you. And equally we are scaling back lockdown precautions for those shielding as well as the general population. Shielders have had additional precautions over everyone else under our lockdown restrictions - for instance when most people were told "work from home if you can", shielders were told "work from home if you can, but if you cannot you must not attend work" - and these have now been scaled back to simply instructions to continue to be careful over and above what most people are doing.
 
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