Afghanistan withdrawal, Bagram Air Base

[Dilandu]

You have to wonder... Where all those bodily fit men were when the bad guys made their way in?

Mostly they are those, who were too associated with fallen regime, and fear repercussions.

 

[Orionblamblam]

Afghan security forces have lost close to 50k dead since 2014. Adjust that for US population size. That is like half a million battlefield casualties.

The notion that their men just suddenly quit is asinine.

So... not that impressive, then. The US lost 600,000 in the Civil War in much less time when our population was a fraction of what it is now.

As to their men: what do you see on those airfields? Lots of men. Not so many women. Where are *they?*

 

[Dilandu]

As to their men: what do you see on those airfields? Lots of men. Not so many women. Where are *they?*

Most likely? They were quickly divorced (as far as I know, Islamic laws allowed divorce to be done literally in several minutes without any officials), and left behind, since after being divorced they are not responsible in any way for their former husbands wrongdoings (again, as far as I know). Nobody would went after them. If they already have children - preferably sons - they would actually have social status similar to widows, i.e. being able to represent themselves, make deals by her own name, ect.

 

[Grey Havoc]

Analysis: Defiant Biden is face of chaotic Afghan evacuation

Four presidents share responsibility for the missteps in Afghanistan that accumulated over two decades.

apnews.com

 

[Fluff]

Naive question, but where are the C-5s for mass evacuations? Have CRAF jets been activated?

I somehow doubt that there was that level of planning. I would be happy if I was proved wrong though.

In any case, I wonder if the USAF would dare risk any of its remaining C-5s now under the current circumstances.

I’m amazed the c17 took off, will need a thorough inspection before another flight.

basically everyone thought they had weeks, or even months, so no evac fleet on standby, just what happened to be there at the time…

and now no-one can get in…..

 

[fightingirish]

My prediction: GEN Mark Milley, who is the current chairman of the US Joint Chiefs of Staff (CJCS), will retire and be replaced by an USAF General (probably by CSAF Charles Q. Brown Jr.) before the midterms.

 

[Grey Havoc]

US reaches deal with Taliban on evacuations: report

The U.S. has reached a deal with the Taliban to ensure that evacuations from Kabul’s airport can take place without interference from the group, according to a report by The Associated P…

thehill.com

Ex-Obama adviser argues Biden should fire Sullivan over Afghanistan

A former White House adviser in the Obama administration penned an op-ed Monday arguing that President Biden should fire national security adviser Jake Sullivan in light of the Taliban ta…

thehill.com

Senate GOP campaign chairman floats 25th Amendment, probe against Biden

Sen. Rick Scott (R-Fla.), who chairs the Senate GOP campaign arm, is raising the prospect of using the 25th Amendment to remove President Biden from office and calling for a congressional investiga…

thehill.com

Biden, Harris AWOL amid Kabul chaos under Taliban

Why didn’t we hear from the president of the United States as this incredible foreign policy crisis exploded over the weekend?

thehill.com

 

[Grey Havoc]

WaPo publisher urges White House to help evacuate journalists in Afghanistan

The publisher of The Washington Post is urging the White House to oversee the safe removal of more than 200 journalists, support staff and their families from Afghanistan as the country has fa…

thehill.com

 

[Orionblamblam]

Nobody would went after them. If they already have children - preferably sons - they would actually have social status similar to widows, i.e. being able to represent themselves, make deals by her own name, ect.

Yeah, I'm sure Talibanistan will be a paradisical wonderland for women.

 

[Orionblamblam]

WaPo publisher urges White House to help evacuate journalists in Afghanistan

The publisher of The Washington Post is urging the White House to oversee the safe removal of more than 200 journalists, support staff and their families from Afghanistan as the country has fa…

thehill.com

More than "200 hundred" journalists, you say? Wow, if we gave each of those 20,000 journalists a gun and set them loose on the Taliban... what a story THAT would be.

 

[Fluff]

WaPo publisher urges White House to help evacuate journalists in Afghanistan

The publisher of The Washington Post is urging the White House to oversee the safe removal of more than 200 journalists, support staff and their families from Afghanistan as the country has fa…

thehill.com

Being realistic, if your a local, if your not already at Kabul airport, then I can’t see how you are going to get there. Foreigners may get rescued by SF, or even escorted by the taliban.

 

[Grey Havoc]

Blinken reaches out to China and Russia on Afghanistan

Secretary of State Antony Blinken on Monday spoke with his counterparts in China and Russia about the security situation in Afghanistan.The calls come as both Beijing and Moscow have signaled an op…

thehill.com

 

[Grey Havoc]

UN Security Council calls for cessation of hostilities in Afghanistan, new government

The United Nations Security Council is calling for an end to hostilities in Afghanistan and the establishment of an “inclusive” government after the Taliban seized control of the country …

thehill.com

 

[Grey Havoc]

US sending 1,000 more troops to Kabul as chaos reigns at airport

The Pentagon will send another 1,000 U.S. troops to Afghanistan to help secure Kabul’s airport following a mad rush on the runway as thousands of Afghan civilians attempted to flee the nation, the …

thehill.com

Watch five dramatic moments in Afghanistan’s chaotic collapse

The world got a glimpse of the chaotic scene in Afghanistan on Monday when videos and images were shared online showing the Taliban’s takeover of the capital, Kabul.The sights of Afghans trying to …

thehill.com

 

[Grey Havoc]

China ready for ‘friendly’ relations with Afghanistan after Taliban takes control

China on Monday said it is ready to pursue “friendly and cooperative” relations with the Taliban after the insurgent group took control of Afghanistan’s capital city of Kabul…

thehill.com

Pentagon to provide two more US bases to house Afghans

The U.S. military will provide two additional facilities in the United States to house thousands of at-risk Afghans being evacuated after the Taliban seized power Sunday, the Pentagon confirme…

thehill.com

 

[Orionblamblam]

They were quickly divorced (as far as I know, Islamic laws allowed divorce to be done literally in several minutes without any officials), and left behind, since after being divorced they are not responsible in any way for their former husbands wrongdoings (again, as far as I know).

Assume for the sake of argument that that is true. So what we'd have is *thousands* of young men who will drop their wives and children at the drop of a hat.

Hands up: who wants them to be dumped en masse into *your* community?

 

[Grey Havoc]

Taliban takeover scrambles U.S. evacuation efforts

Afghans looking to flee their country because of their work with the U.S. and international groups are stuck in a dangerous limbo as the Taliban completes its takeover.The scene at Kabul’s internat…

thehill.com

Chaos, desperation at Kabul airport as Biden defends withdrawal from Afghanistan

Thousands of people desperate to flee Afghanistan thronged Kabul's airport on Monday after the Taliban seized the capital, prompting the United States to pause evacuations, as President Joe Biden confronted mounting criticism over the U.S. withdrawal.

www.reuters.com

 

[Fluff]

They were quickly divorced (as far as I know, Islamic laws allowed divorce to be done literally in several minutes without any officials), and left behind, since after being divorced they are not responsible in any way for their former husbands wrongdoings (again, as far as I know).

Assume for the sake of argument that that is true. So what we'd have is *thousands* of young men who will drop their wives and children at the drop of a hat.

Hands up: who wants them to be dumped en masse into *your* community?

I dont believe anyone is planning just to scoop up these people at the airport and fly them west…..

are they????

 

[edwest4]

Analysis: Defiant Biden is face of chaotic Afghan evacuation

Four presidents share responsibility for the missteps in Afghanistan that accumulated over two decades.

apnews.com

"deadly chaos" Who writes this stuff? When was war ever NOT deadly chaos.

 

[edwest4]

If the US and NATO had wanted to turn Afghanistan into a democracy they should have conquered the country like they did, moved all the mountain men into Strategic Internment Hamlets, and gave out parcels of land to NATO and European adventuers and homesteaders for free. Instead of spending billions paying Afghans to work for them, they could pay their own people to settle in Afghanistan. But that would require going there with a mission to make it a democracy in the first place, not simply defaulting to some hazy, half-baked idea of what Afghanistan "should be" and running on autopilot for 20 years.

The PRC is practicing it in its Uighur/Mongol provinces. No reason it couldn't be done there, but the PRC doesn't seem interested.

Ah yes, Democracy building via internment camps, massive population culling and colonization.

Good grief.

It's an observation, not a passing of moral judgment.

And yes, the United States did it a lot about 150 years ago to break these people called "the Comanche" and "the Cherokee", among others. Steppe folks are a lot like mountain men in that they can be rough dudes, but you don't need to be especially violent, you just gotta put them in a village. The Russians, Chinese, and U.S. Cavalry used plenty of howitzers and wooden war wagons to pin the steppe folks they fought down and built walls around them. But mountain men already live in villages, so you gotta be rougher.

Democracies used to do it all the time. They stopped for some reason, but if you want Afghanistan to be populated with people who think like Americans, you gotta bring in Americans. Duh. You can no more expect the Pashtuns to roll over and accept Christian, secular, urban culture than you can expect the United States to accept Islamic, pious, rural culture.

That's how every nation, and every successful colonization, has ever been built.

Has everyone forgotten the end of World War II? How many Displaced Persons ended up in the U.S.? It went a bit more smoothly because ethnic, old-country type neighborhoods already existed. So the immigrants became invisible after a while.

 

[edwest4]

They were quickly divorced (as far as I know, Islamic laws allowed divorce to be done literally in several minutes without any officials), and left behind, since after being divorced they are not responsible in any way for their former husbands wrongdoings (again, as far as I know).

Assume for the sake of argument that that is true. So what we'd have is *thousands* of young men who will drop their wives and children at the drop of a hat.

Hands up: who wants them to be dumped en masse into *your* community?

I dont believe anyone is planning just to scoop up these people at the airport and fly them west…..

are they????

Unnamed source: "Yeah, sure. Why not? Besides, some of these people were assets and uh... that's all I can say."

 

[Grey Havoc]

UK's Johnson plans G7 meeting on Afghanistan, steps up evacuation effort

British Prime Minister Boris Johnson intends to host a virtual meeting of G7 leaders to tackle the deteriorating situation in Afghanistan and has stepped up efforts to evacuate UK nationals and others from Kabul.

www.reuters.com

 

[Grey Havoc]

Razorfist on Afghanistan – The Unwanted Blog

Video is a trifle NSFW.

 

[CJGibson]

In October 1963, when Harold Macmillan was handing over the prime ministership to Alec Douglas-Home, he is supposed to have passed on some advice.
"My dear boy, as long as you do not invade Afghanistan you will be absolutely fine," he said.

If we can stay off the politics and concentrate on the news, then the topic can stay in The Bar for now.

Paul, do you have a source for this, it's a cracker. On a par with Reggie Maudling!

Chris

 

[sferrin]

You have to wonder... Where all those bodily fit men were when the bad guys made their way in?

Dying, is where they were.

So those were zombies clambering to board those C-17s?

Hmm. Gonna have to watch "World War Z" again...

Afghan security forces have lost close to 50k dead since 2014. Adjust that for US population size. That is like half a million battlefield casualties.

The notion that their men just suddenly quit is asinine.

That's not what he said though is it. He pointed out (rightly so) that those fighting to get OUT of the country were predominantly male. Didn't see many women or kids.

 

[sferrin]

WaPo publisher urges White House to help evacuate journalists in Afghanistan

The publisher of The Washington Post is urging the White House to oversee the safe removal of more than 200 journalists, support staff and their families from Afghanistan as the country has fa…

thehill.com

Being realistic, if your a local, if your not already at Kabul airport, then I can’t see how you are going to get there. Foreigners may get rescued by SF, or even escorted by the taliban.

You misspelled "executed".

 

[Grey Havoc]

Italy diplomats and Afghan helpers return to Rome on military plane

A first plane carrying Italian diplomats and their Afghan assistants arrived in Rome from Kabul on Monday as Prime Minister Mario Draghi vowed all Afghan citizens who assisted Italy's mission in the country would be protected.

www.reuters.com

Turkey drops Kabul airport plans but will assist if Taliban ask -sources

Turkey has dropped plans to take over Kabul airport after NATO's withdrawal from Afghanistan but is ready to provide support if the Taliban request it, two Turkish sources said on Monday amid turmoil following the militant group's victory in Afghanistan.

www.reuters.com

 

[Dilandu]

You misspelled "executed".

Well, our Russian embassy just received assurance that under no circumstances new Afghanistan regime would allow any harm to any foreign citizens (Russians especially, of course). Taliban (terrorist organization, forbidden in Russia) seemingly wanted to play "civilized" at least in big cities. Maybe they learned the lessons of their previous failure?

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

In October 1963, when Harold Macmillan was handing over the prime ministership to Alec Douglas-Home, he is supposed to have passed on some advice.
"My dear boy, as long as you do not invade Afghanistan you will be absolutely fine," he said.

If we can stay off the politics and concentrate on the news, then the topic can stay in The Bar for now.

Paul, do you have a source for this, it's a cracker. On a par with Reggie Maudling!

Chris

Is Afghanistan really impossible to conquer?

William Dalrymple examines how the Afghan president Hamid Karzai's tenure fits into the country's troubled history.

www.bbc.com

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

I don't believe that discussions of the 'right way' to subjugate a native population belong on this forum.

Also - Rotherham, with its 91% White British population and 3% of Pakistani origin. Yes, some people of Pakistani origin did some bad things there. It doesn't make it a bastion of Islamic State.

 

[Fluff]

You misspelled "executed".

Well, our Russian embassy just received assurance that under no circumstances new Afghanistan regime would allow any harm to any foreign citizens (Russians especially, of course). Taliban (terrorist organization, forbidden in Russia) seemingly wanted to play "civilized" at least in big cities. Maybe they learned the lessons of their previous failure?

My cousin in Nigeria has a special deal, just for you….

 

[skyblue]

Unsure if this is the C-17 flight with 800 souls aboard. I'm surprised there are quite a few woman and children who made it.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1427353236500058113

View: https://twitter.com/beverstine/status/1427353236500058113

 

[Grey Havoc]

A quick recap of the disaster over the last 48 hours:

Taliban sweep into Afghan capital after government collapses

The Taliban swept into Afghanistan’s capital after the embattled president joined the exodus of his fellow citizens and foreigners.

apnews.com

Biden is still on the TV at the moment, it is probably safe to say that it is not going to help him one bit.

 

[Grey Havoc]

Undoubtedly.

 

[Grey Havoc]

Analysis: Defiant Biden is face of chaotic Afghan evacuation

Four presidents share responsibility for the missteps in Afghanistan that accumulated over two decades.

apnews.com

 

[Grey Havoc]

Afghan woman in limbo at Kabul airport after Taliban sweep

A young Afghan woman stands between two worlds at Kabul's airport, engulfed in panic as thousands of Afghans scramble desperate to get out following the Taliban takeover of the country.

apnews.com

 

[Grey Havoc]

Europe urges unity on Taliban but is quiet on failed mission

European leaders say they will press for a unified international approach to dealing with a Taliban government in Afghanistan, as they looked on with dismay at the rapid collapse of two decades of a U.S.

apnews.com

 

[Grey Havoc]

Afghanistan Takeover by Taliban Worries Governments in the Region, Europe That Chaos Will Spread

Pakistan and Iran are among countries most vulnerable to a flood of refugees, but European governments also are raising concerns.

www.wsj.com

 

[Fluff]

Unsure if this is the C-17 flight with 800 souls aboard. I'm surprised there are quite a few woman and children who made it.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1427353236500058113

View: https://twitter.com/beverstine/status/1427353236500058113



View attachment 662706

I’d think these are the Afghan staff and families, not the people running along the runway. They must be very relieved. We will need locals for the forceable future, so I hope we don’t send them back or something equally dumb….

 

[Grey Havoc]

Some more details on the fiasco at the airport as it unfolded:

Apache Helicopters Chase Afghans Swarming A C-17 On Kabul Airport's Runway (Updated)

Whatever security perimeter existed at Kabul International appears to have collapsed with Afghans running freely across its runway and taxiways.

www.thedrive.com