Various Focke-Wulf projects

[Andreas Parsch]

Unlike the other German aircraft manufacturers, Focke-Wulf didn't use a consistent P.XXX/EF.XXX/E.XXX numbering system. Designations like Fw 249 were created post-war by aviation writers and should not be considered official RLM ones. (I have not had the courage to challenge Andreas about this matter so far. )

*LOL* :!

Anyway, I'd appreciate if you could clean up the mess of "FW-xxx" designations a bit. My selection of reference sources on the subject is far from complete, and contains conflicting information, especially on the subject of 8-series numbers (just for the record, I have FW-249 noted as "non-RLM" ). There are quite a few FW numbers in my list, which seem a bit doubtful, and I'd love to see some of them confirmed or rejected.

 

[rousseau]

Do you know any Nazi aircrafts which there are couple of Comfirm Fuel Tanks on the wing?

 

[elmayerle]

There was such an installation flown on some FW-190s with faired in tanks above the wing. I'm not sure if it was a field-mod kit, a factory kit, or simply a test installation.

 

[hesham]

My dears,

I found six projects and aircraft to Focke-Wulf in Internet,I don't know any,
do you know them?;
AL 102,AL 103,AW 102,S-39 (FW-39),S-48 and FW-197.

 

[hesham]

Thanks dear Richard,

but the FW-197 was right,it was from great site,and there was also A.36,
do you know it?.

 

[richard]

The Focke Wulf A 36 was a mail carrier ,low wing monoplanepowered by a single P&W 525hp (1931)
I confirm,there's no Fw 197
The RLM numbers were sometimes duplicated (Bf 163;Me 163 Me162;He162 etc )but ,really,not in this case :197 was for the Arado 197 biplane fighter for the "Graf Zeppelin" carrier .
Cheers
Richard

 

[hesham]

Thanks dear richard,

a big surprise to all members (from a friend):
the Focke-Wulf Project 195 was six engined low wing
douple deck military transport aircraft,and remember
the Blohm and Voss P.195 was high altitude fighter.

 

[hesham]

Focke-Wulf P.127 :mixed powered planet,single seat fighter project.
a drawing to Focke-Wulf P.VII.

 

[Jemiba]

Interpretation of aerial reconnaissance photos was always difficult !
Add to this rumours of a new Focke-Wulff type, designated "189 or perhaps
198" and wartime nervousness ...
Sorry. just a what-if story ! ;D

 

[Tophe]

rumours of a new Focke-Wulff type, designated "189 or perhaps
198" and wartime nervousness ...

Interesting. How would you read the words of a veteran on the Web, mentioning a "twin-boom Fw 119 Zerstorer" met in unfriendly skies? "Fw 119 or 191" would not match the "twin-boom" word. "Fw 119 or 189" would not match the "Zerstorer" word I think...

 

[richard]

The first prototype of the Fw 189 was an attack plane

 

[Jemiba]

"How would you read the words of a veteran on the Web, mentioning a "twin-boom Fw 119 Zerstorer" ?"

Just the same way, as I read words about the "F-19 stealth fighter", or the first appearance of
the "MiG 23 Flipper", written in more modern, "much better informed" times !

 

[hesham]

But my dear Jemiba,

I saw on the Internet an information about FW-119 attack aircraft,
but I am not sure it was right or not.

 

[hesham]

My dear richard,

please give me any informations about Focke-Wulf A.3,A.4 and
A.6.

 

[Maveric]

Hi Jemiba,

the Focke A.3 was a monoplane from 1910 with a 8 hp NSU, built but not flown.
The A.4 was also a monoplane with NSU, built but not flown.
The A.6 was a rebuilt A.5 from 1913/14.

Servus Maveric

 

[Wurger]

Unknown Focke-Wulf long range bomber

Hi guys,

what about a completely unknown german bomber? Dating from 1936, it was to be a bomber able to reach 6000 kms with a 1000kgs bomb load. Visit this wonderful site, run by Oliver and Erwin:

http://deutscheluftwaffe.de/Neuigkeiten-englisch/web/new%20site/frames2/Neuigkeiten.htm

Tons of goodies for Luftwaffe buffs.

 

[Orionblamblam]

Re: Unknown Focke-Wulf long range bomber

Hi guys,

what about a completely unknown german bomber? Dating from 1936, it was to be a bomber able to reach 6000 kms with a 1000kgs bomb load. Visit this wonderful site, run by Oliver and Erwin:

http://deutscheluftwaffe.de/Neuigkeiten-englisch/web/new%20site/frames2/Neuigkeiten.htm

All I see is a painting of a Storch. I'm dubious of its ability to carry a 1000 kg payload 6000 km.

EDIT: Ah, it's one of those unlinkable sort of websites. The bomber info is available under the "News" link.

 

[Justo Miranda]

Re: Unknown Focke-Wulf long range bomber

Hi Scott
You have to click on "Homepage"
them on "The Archive"
them on "Various Documents"
them on letter "F" of matrix
them on "Focke Wulf Aircraft Factory Ltd."
them on "Fernbomber 1936"...
Arf...arf

 

[Jemiba]

Re: Unknown Focke-Wulf long range bomber

That really looks like an interesting find and it's not even as suspicious, as some other
german stuff, as it still is from a time, when it could hardly have turned the tide !

Just keep in mind the heading "Betrachtungen über die Entwicklungsmöglichkeiten ...",
meaning "Considerations about the possibilities to design a long range bomber" !
And the authors of that site stressed this in the description of those documents, too,
and should be praised for that !

 

[Wurger]

Re: Unknown Focke-Wulf long range bomber

Just keep in mind the heading "Betrachtungen über die Entwicklungsmöglichkeiten ...",
meaning "Considerations about the possibilities to design a long range bomber" !
And the authors of that site stressed this in the description of those documents, too,
and should be praised for that !

Scepticism is OK, but I guess that rule applies to many subjects in this Secret Projects forum, and not just the ones stemming from Germany, and from that particular time frame. A project isn`t serious just because it comes from a country other than Germany. This project is merely that, a project, but to my knowledge all aircraft who came to hardware stage started this way.

 

[saturncanuck]

Re: Unknown Focke-Wulf long range bomber

Isnt thsi the 1000x1000x1000?

 

[Tophe]

Re: Unknown Focke-Wulf long range bomber

Thanks Justo for the directions ;D

 

[Skybolt]

Re: Unknown Focke-Wulf long range bomber

Isnt thsi the 1000x1000x1000?

No, this has two DB-601 or Jumo-211... more some thoughts on a bomber built on the experience gained with the Condor. Surely it is authentic. That has been ever considered by the RLM, doubtful. It is a souped-up He-111 in concept.

 

[Jemiba]

Re: Unknown Focke-Wulf long range bomber

"This project is merely that, a project, ..."

Judging the text, I wouldn't call it a project, it's more a detailed examination,
if and ow such a bomber would be feasible, and which technologies and methods
could be used, today we would call it a feasibility study. Only available engines
were considered and a cruising height of more than 8000 m was prerequisite.
A 4-engined aircraft was examined, too,but the twin engined solution was clearly
favoured. Pros and cons of fitting a pressure cabin against the use of pressure
suits were considered. Quite probably there wasn't a specification for such an
aircraft, but this document could have let to one, I can imagine, if it could have
led the RLM officials to the insight, that such an aircraft could have formed
a useful weapon. Yes, it's authentic, I think, and really interesting stuff, as said
before.

And yes, all aircraft start as a project, in nearly all countries. And scepticism is nearly
always appropriate, may it be about russian projects from the cold war (or even from
today, as the PAK-FA/T-50 shows), or about stuff from "Area 51". That I recommend
more scepticism with regards to german projects from the timeframe 1939 to 45, has
just the reason, that this market has spread unproportionally and so probably has lured
out quite a lot of quacks. But I thought, that much was already clear ... :

 

[Wurger]

Re: Unknown Focke-Wulf long range bomber

Other curiosities on this plane, according to specifications.

3 man crew;
14 hour endurance at a 8000-10000m ceiling;

The nose compartment was intended just to take-off, land, bomb and flying at medium altitude. At higher levels the crew would take their seats in the pressurized room, where complete instrumentation are present.

The proposed armament included a single remote controlled ( operated from the pressure cabin ) 15mm MK 6-11, which is unknown to me. I only know the Mauser GL-15, then MG 210, but in the "6-12" and "6-13" prototypes. These where gas-operated guns, derived from the MG 151.

 

[Jemiba]

Re: Unknown Focke-Wulf long range bomber

"Other curiosities on this plane"

the high cruising altitude was just chosen to achieve optimal cruising
speed and range. Over the target, the bomber wold have flown much
lower, although maximum altitude is given as about 13.000m. Was this
necessary to achieve a reasonable bombing accuracy ?
The installed armament probably would have been of use only in the
target area, where the crew sat in the non-pressurized cabin, but a
remotely controlled weapon could have been used from the pressure
cabin as well. Would the better view have been worth the weight burden
of the double flightstations ? Really curious ! ???

 

[Wurger]

Re: Unknown Focke-Wulf long range bomber

Hi,

Kurt Tank filed this patent nº 678516 in 1937 for a high altitude compartment. Mind It is closely related to the 1936 long range bomber treated in this thread. It was, after all, more than considerations.

 

[Tophe]

Re: Unknown Focke-Wulf long range bomber

At letter M, I have found interesting the link "Mock-up construction test", with Me329 and Ju248 phographs, rare...

 

[hesham]

Hi,

is this a real project to FW, the Rammjager ?.

http://www.antaresmodels.com/luft46.asp?s=L48

 

[sagallacci]

Looks like just a modeler's goofing around.

 

[Chicken kana]

LOLZ??!! ???

 

[Apophenia]

is this a real project to FW, the Rammjager ?.

That artwork was by Ingolf Meyer. It appears on p.118 of his "Luftwaffe Advanced Aircraft Projects to 1945" (there's also a 3-view drawing).

Details given are span 5.8 m, length 7.5 m, height 1.4 m, wing area 6.25 m2, take-off weight 2150 kg, powerplant 1 x HWK 509A-2 rocket motor. The windscreen/canopy are obviously from the Fw-190 (with the extra armour glass panels of the Fw-190A-8/R7 Sturmbock). Meyer is dubious about claims of an ejection seat for the pilot.

Other rammjäger projects noted are by Arado, Blohm & Voss, Gotha, Heinkel, Messerschmitt, and Zeppelin but only the Gotha project in described and illustrated. DFS is not listed but there is a page on their diminutive rammjäger project.

 

[hesham]

Hi,


I know most of Focke Wulf P.0310 series,such as 025.1006,224.20,244.30,
225,237.2 and 251.13,but here is the project P.310.239.01 a jet fighter
from this site;


http://fhsw-europ.ucoz.de/forum/24-295-1


was that a real FW project or not ?.

 

[Jemiba]

Don't know, at least not with this designation.
But if I got it right, that's just a gamer site and they don't give a smeg about authenticity, as long
as it fits into their games. Looking into this gathered up list, there are on the first view several types,
we discarded as "fakes" long ago.
So, please be careful, it's certainly not a reliable source !

 

[borovik]

It seems this is one of the three medium bombers proposal Focke-Wulf in programm '1000x1000x1000'.
It is also likely the source is taken from the work of Richard Lewis Mendes

Richard Lewis Mendes Luft Art images

 

[Jemiba]

Yes, you're right, I think. Have mistaken the second aircraft in the posted picture for the
same type, but it's the Do P.256 .

 

[hesham]

Hi,

I know most of Focke Wulf P.0310 series,such as 025.1006,224.20,244.30,
225,237.2 and 251.13,but here is the project P.310.239.01 a jet fighter
from this site;

Thank you my dears Jemiba and Borovik,


and it seemed to be the Focke Wulf FW P.310.239.01 a real project,who know
more than I mentioned about FW P.310 projects?.

 

[Basil]

Borovik, I know this 1000 x 1000 x 1000 projeckt but I doubt a little if it is a wartime design. It has such a distinct area rule design which first came in the post war years (F-102 etc.). However, Hertel (from Junkers) has patented the area rule 1944 (but this was forgotten or overlooked by the allies).

 

[Stargazer]

The MBI book on the He 162 contains this three-view arrangement for the Focke-Wulf Volksflugzeug ("people's aircraft") contender, which I hadn't seen before.

The proposed Focke-Wulf project bore the name "Volksflugzeug", but was technologically quite complicated. It was intended that the tail surfaces would be T-shaped and the aircraft had the option of being equipped with either a sweptback or an unswept wing. The commission rejected the project together with the proposals from Junkers

 

[hesham]

Hi,


here is a wooden tunnel model for Focke-Wulf P.II;


http://alternathistory.org.ua/proekt-istrebitelya-focke-wulf-pii-s-dvigatelem-jumo-109-004-germaniya