Ryan XV-5 and beyond - Liftfan VTOL designs

[AeroFranz]

Jemiba,
I don't think that you could use a valve for vertical thrust modulation.
The time response of the jets is such that you can't rely on them for altitude control, so you have to run them at a high RPM setting, with a relatively constant mass flow. The way you control attitude is by selectively spoiling thrust by using the faster-acting louvers in the fan ducts.

If you use a valve to take some air away from the ducts, the only place they have to go is the flight nozzles, and in that case you would simply start moving forward. This is only desirable in transition (by the way, the fan louvers were deflected to aid the process of transition).

IIRC the system wasn't entirely satisfactory. There was some talk of modifying at least the front fan (which provided pitch control) with a different system to increase authority.
Lots of good info is available on the NTRS.

for those interested, search for "Lift-fan aircraft: Lessons learned-the pilot's perspective "
here's a quote from said reference, put a little bit more eloquently than I was able to

Roll control in fan mode of flight was accomplished through differential modulation of wing-fan lift with the exit louvers which normally are also modulated for height control through the lift-stick

hope this helps!

 

[Jemiba]

My opinion about altitude control stems from an article about
lift-fan VTOL aircraft from AW, August 1963, but there may well
be different techniques and the use of a valve may be a misunder-
standing. Perhaps just the engine is controlled via the throttle ?

 

[shedofdread]

I've not read all the "Lift-fan aircraft: Lessons learned-the pilot's perspective " article by any means but it would appear from what I've read so far that the XV-5A is controlled how I suspected and others suggested - throttle for collective and the vanes deflected for yaw and pinched to reduce the flow by, apparently up to 25% to affect roll and pitch.

By the way, thanks AeroFranz for suggesting that article - very interesting.

S

 

[AeroFranz]

I confess I'm a little rusty on my XV-5 trivia, but I'm almost willing to wager avWeek was wrong on that one. The way it's written, it certainly seems to imply that to control altitude, the XV-5 pilot would increase engine rpm and obtain increased lift fan rpm - and hence thrust. This is certainly true, but as opposed to a mechanical driveshaft, the thrust increase is not nearly as fast, or at least not fast enough for precise altitude control. Probably something that has to do with the inertia of a big rotating steel disc. I have a few AIAA papers that should explain the whole deal. Let's see if I can dig out some quotes.

 

[hesham]

Hi,

I found this in Popular Science magazine,and they said that,
it a wind-tunnel for the wing-fan Ryan VZ-11 ?!.

http://books.google.com.eg/books?id=BiEDAAAAMBAJ&pg=PA92&dq=RYAN+VZ-11&hl=ar&ei=SRejTKeFOoeuOKWv6akE&sa=X&oi=book_result&ct=result&resnum=4&ved=0CDEQ6AEwAw#v=onepage&q&f=true

 

[Stargazer]

I found this in Popular Science magazine,and they said that,
it a wind-tunnel for the wing-fan Ryan VZ-11 ?!.

Not to worry. VZ-10, VZ-11 and VZ-12 were the initial designations for the projects that became the XV-4, XV-5 and XV-6.
The model seen here is very different from the final Vertifan, just like the initial Hawker project varied from the finished Kestrel.

 

[reelarchives]

I have been extremely busy over the past year and have just begun to copy some of the best of my Republic Aviation films which I purchased over a year ago from a former employee of Republic. The Ryan XV-5A was a Ryan project and not a Republic one, but given that Val Schaeffer was also once a test pilot for Republic makes me think that this may have been one of the reasons that this film ended up in Republic's collection? Val died back in 2006 and Lou Everett also a test pilot died back in 1965 during one of the XV-5A test flights. This film footage predates Lou Everett's death because he and Val are both seen in the film. I have put up some copies on eBay at the link below. The film is being copied as we speak and I expect delivery of 25 copies in about 30 days. If interested please see the link to the eBay auction to reserve your copy.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120662248789&ssPageName=STRK:MESELX:IT

 

[Orionblamblam]

I have been extremely busy over the past year and have just begun to copy some of the best of my Republic Aviation films ...

A few questions:
1) What films are you going to make DVD-available...
2) And when?

The F-103 and TFX footage is of considerable interest to me (and I'm sure others)

 

[reelarchives]

I have been extremely busy over the past year and have just begun to copy some of the best of my Republic Aviation films ...

A few questions:
1) What films are you going to make DVD-available...
2) And when?

The F-103 and TFX footage is of considerable interest to me (and I'm sure others)

I have 3 DVD's which I will be releasing within the next 30 days as the films are scheduled to be digitally transferred in the next few days. I have asked for 25 copies of each film. I have already put up two of these DVD's on eBay and will be adding the third in the next couple of days. Here is what will be on these 3 DVD's:

DVD 1) XV-5A Test Pilot footage along with views of the interior and exterior of the aircraft, plus scenes of the aircraft in flight. (30 minutes)
DVD 2) TFX Thunderstriker - Approximately 15 minutes of mock up scenes of the aircraft from various angles.
DVD 3) AP-100 Scenes including a 15 minute animated film, 7 minute sound film, plus some other R&D scenes

Not copied yet, but in the near future:
XF-103 R&D scenes 2,000 ft - 1 hour in color, plus about another 1 hour of B&W footage & a Titanium film with sound with references to the XF-103 and lastly some color animated scenes of the XF-103 cockpit.

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

Republic TFX: http://cgi.ebay.com/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=120662307325

 

[Barrington Bond]

Hello folks,

has anyone heard from Reelarchives recently? I sent a message from here on the 29/1/11 and one from Ebay a bit later but have had no response.

Regards,
Barry

 

[Caravellarella]

Dear Boys and Girls, here is a contemporary article in French on the Ryan Vertifan projects......

The article comes from the 1st October 1965 issue of Aviation Magazine International......

Terry Caravellarella

 

[UpForce]

Dear Boys and Girls, here is a contemporary article in French on the Ryan Vertifan projects...... The article comes from the 1st October 1965 issue of Aviation Magazine International...... Terry (Caravellarella)

Thank you Terry, a good reason to brush up on my French (which seems to be in a state of perpetual disrepair) ... perhaps I'll pick up some technical vocabulary as well. Having now scoured through secretprojects discussions for some time - quite a challenge as often someone adds a comment to a thread several tens of pages long - I've seen a ... well, what to me seems like a "disproportionate" amount of VTOL concepts relying on a "turbotip fan" arrangement. In many cases those solutions show potential greater than that of a helicopter, for example. It seems quite appealing to me on many levels but I don't think I've seen a single production model application of it (VTOL or other) anywhere. So what gives? Production VTOLs are few and far between and to take a recent example the F-35B has a "big hulking" driveshaft and a clutch that has to put up with a lot (I think they ran into problems for a while) - did Boeing, Locheed et. al. even consider a "turbotip fan", or is it just somehow incorrigibly flawed?

 

[Caravellarella]

Dear Upforce, I don't know enough about "turbo tip" lift fans to comment properly, but it does appear to be a very complex and heavy way of generating lift and it does appear to use a lot of the available volume in an airframe. Here is picture of the planned operational version of the Ryan XV-5A; it is still a very small aircraft (with a limited payload) and the retractable main undercarriage has to fit into external pods on the wing leading edges. It isn't "secret", but it is a "project"......

The picture comes from the 15th September 1966 issue of Aviation Magazine International......

Terry (Caravellarella)

 

[Stargazer]

Such scans would really benefit from higher resolution... Do you scan in 150 dpi? You ought to make it 300 for these!

 

[Caravellarella]

Such scans would really benefit from higher resolution... Do you scan in 150 dpi? You ought to make it 300 for these!

But Stéphane, I'm already scanning at 600dpi with a print destination output of 300dpi. You should remember that these magazines are old and a high quality print resolution was not required for a throwaway fortnightly journal on thin paper. Here is some more information in French on the Ryan XV-5A Vertifan when it was still at the "project" stage, and it wasn't "secret" either......

The article comes from the 1st May 1963 issue of Aviation Magazine, which means it's even older than I am ......

Terry (Caravellarella)

 

[AeroFranz]

Really enjoying these scans - Thanks!

 

[Caravellarella]

Really enjoying these scans - Thanks!

Dear Aerofranz, thank you. Here is an image of a Ryan VTOL airliner project with pop-out lift fans and small vertifans in the wing-tips......

The image comes from the 1st July 1967 issue of Aviation Magazine International......

Terry (Caravellarella)

 

[joncarrfarrelly]

Dear Upforce, I don't know enough about "turbo tip" lift fans to comment properly, but it does appear to be a very complex and heavy way of generating lift and it does appear to use a lot of the available volume in an airframe. Here is picture of the planned operational version of the Ryan XV-5A; it is still a very small aircraft (with a limited payload) and the retractable main undercarriage has to fit into external pods on the wing leading edges. It isn't "secret", but it is a "project"......

The picture comes from the 15th September 1966 issue of Aviation Magazine International......

Terry (Caravellarella)

That 3-view differs greatly from the one published in Aviation Week in 1964 for an operational evaluation version of the XV-5A, posted back on page 2:
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,1938.msg89203.html#msg89203

 

[Caravellarella]

Dear joncarrfarrelly, I'm sorry but I don't know enough about the Ryan XV-5 to be able to comment definitively. Here is an article in French about the prototype......

The article comes from the 15th August 1968 issue of Aviation Magazine International......

Terry (Caravellarella)

 

[Caravellarella]

Dear Boys and Girls, here are some pictures of the Ryan XV-5 Vertifan prototypes under construction; taken from 1963 issues of Aviation Magazine International......

Terry (Caravellarella)

 

[hesham]

The Ryan Model-209D,


http://www.dtic.mil/dtic/tr/fulltext/u2/824698.pdf

 

[hesham]

By the way,


in the report,there is a reference to No.4013,and I knew that,the Ryan company
had been used the 4000s series,and may be that number related to it,and the
No.4013 was not aircraft.

 

[hesham]

Hi,


that aircraft was designed in early 1960s,and we know many VTOL or V/STOL
competitions appeared in this period,so may be that aircraft was intended to
one of those contests,any idea.

 

[Stargazer]

A NASA wind-tunnel test model of the XV-5A in late 1962.

You can compare it with an earlier model here: http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,1938.msg105347.html#msg105347

Also, an April 1964 article on the beginning of XV-5A testing.

 

[Stingray]

More XV-5A from the USAAM archives:

 

[Triton]

Courtesy of San Diego Air and Space Museum:

http://youtu.be/_NrsknJIIiM

 

[blackkite]

Wow thanks. Fan stream was too hard to resue pilot.
It's the same idea of Mcdonnell Douglas Joint Strike Fighter lift fan concept.
F-35B's lift fan is shaft drive.

 

[Jemiba]

From "Der Flieger" 1963, an artist's impression of a
service version of a Ryan liftfan aircraft:

 

[Stargazer]

Beautiful design, Jens, thanks for sharing!

 

[Firebee]

Any further information about the Ryan 209D that Hesham posted a picture of on the last page? I've always been fond of the XV-5A design, and the 209D version is even nicer looking. Is that picture from the PDF that has also been linked recently? I havn't had a chance to look through that yet. Thanks to everyone for the great photos/art/video.

 

[Jemiba]

From FlugWelt 1962, two artist's impressions and some detail drawings:

 

[Stargazer]

During 1967, the U.S. military services became highly aware of innovations in the V/STOL field and how it could effect their operational capacity in war zones. To meet the vital need for a fast plane to retrieve downed pilots in the jungle and mountainous terrain of Vietnam, the US Air Force issued a requirement for a Combat Aircrew Recovery Aircraft (CARA). A total of nine contractors submitted proposals to meet the CARA requirement, including the Ryan Aeronautical Company, which proposed a larger growth version of its high performance, high-speed Vertifan fan-in-wing V/STOL.

Identified as the Model 230, Ryan's CARA proposal was based on two and one half years of flight test experience with the Vertifan. Ordered as the VZ-11 by the Army, and redesignated as the XV-5A, the original Vertifan V/STOL research aircraft (or Model 143) had demonstrated the ability to land on and take-off from any surface that would support the aircraft's weight, including unprepared desert, with no foreign object damage in either engine or lift fans. Rescue tests using a 230-pound instrumented mannequin were completed while personnel worked comfortably under the hovering aircraft.

The new Model 230 was a jet-powered, high subsonic (Mach 0.8), extremely maneuverable plane (ultimate load factor 11.0) which combined the performance and survivability of a jet fighter-bomber with a vertical take-off and landing aircraft. It would be capable of accompanying strike forces from land bases or aircraft carriers to strike zones, loiter at safe altitudes during a strike and provide instant response to a rescue mission as it developed. Mid-air recovery of pilot who ejected from strike aircraft would be achieved through snagging cable attached to main canopy and reeling man into passenger compartment. Chute would dump its lift air as man was drawn closer to plane.

Survivability, a key feature of the Model 230, incorporated armament, redundant systems and compatibility of aircraft through design to operate with jet strike aircraft. At jet speed, the aircraft could accompany strike group and was available in emergency to descend, hover and make rescue within minutes. Operational compatibility of the Model 230 was also linked to its capacity for mid-air refueling. Taking its turn, CARA would pumpi in fuel that would extend its cruise range as required to accompany the strike force to target area, recover aircrewmen if any are downed and return to home base.

The Model 230 had geometric-dynamic characteristics similar to the XV-5A research aircraft, using arrangements of lift fans in wings, nose and aft fuselage section to achieve vertical takeoff, landing and flight hover maneuvers. However it was larger and had a design mission take-off gross weight of 26,600 pounds, a mid-point hover gross weight of 21,750 pounds and an empty weight of 15,103 pounds. It was powered by two General Electric turbojet engines. It incorporated two [52?]-inch diameter wing fans and 45-inch diameter fans in the nose and aft fuselage. The Model 230 carried a crew of three and had a cabin volume capable of holding five rescuees.

Other CARA concepts from other companies included tilt wings, compound rotorcraft and advanced type stopped- and stowed- rotor craft. Although no design was formally selected, Bell's tilt-rotor configuration, as demonstrated by the D-266 design, was favored. The CARA requirement was therefore taken over by the Bell D-300 concept, which became the Model 301 or XV-15, progenitor of the V-22 Osprey.


Adapted from the following sources:
- Ryan Reporter, Volume 28. No. 3, July/August 1967
- The Aerospace year book, Volume 46, Books, Inc., 1968

 

[Stingray]

From the September '64 issue of Army Aviation Digest:

 

[Triton]

Model of Ryan XV-5A manufactured by Fermo found on eBay.

Source:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/VTG-1-48-FERMO-ARMY-RYAN-XV-5A-METAL-DESK-TOP-DISPLAY-FACTORY-JET-MODEL-AIRPLANE-/350606605351?_trksid=p2045573.m2042&_trkparms=aid%3D111000%26algo%3DREC.CURRENT%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D27%26meid%3D2368476073436108491%26pid%3D100033%26prg%3D1011%26rk%3D4%26sd%3D390474837760%26

 

[Triton]

Model of Ryan XV-5A manufactured by Fermo found on eBay.

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

Already posted earlier in this topic Mark, but thanks

 

[fightingirish]

Ryan COIN Vertifan Artwork from 2 Feb 1969
Larger pictures at San Diego Air & Space Museum Archives, posted there on 7th February 2013.
Link: http://www.flickr.com/search/?w=49487266@N07&q=Ryan%20COIN%20Vertifan%20

I hope, this is the right topic.
Dear mods, please feel free to move this post to a suitable topic.

 

[Jemiba]

Seems absolutely ok for me, thank you for sharing !
It looks, as if the pusher prop would have been stopped during take-off/
landing. I would have sought it to be just feathered, so being able to provide
forward (or rearward) thrust very quickly. But maybe the artist just took this
picture with a very short "exposure time" ?

 

[shedofdread]

I wonder why the lift fans are hinged that way round? If they swung up rather than down then the weight of the aircraft would be borne against some kind of bump stop rather than placing the strut that lowers them into compression.

Anyway, whatever the reasons, many thanks for posting what is [to me] very interesting stuff