Royal New Zealand Navy loses a ship

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www.abc.net.au

New Zealand navy ship runs aground and sinks off Samoa

New Zealand says it has rescued all 75 crew and passengers from a wrecked navy vessel that ran aground and sank off Samoa while conducting a reef survey.
www.abc.net.au www.abc.net.au

68967c327d1c8e713955b6539c213d13
 
publiusr said:
Some working ship have the helipad above the level of the bridge—the bow looking bulbous.

The last time I saw ships like these outside of documentaries—was in the movie *Ffolkes*.
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Ahhhh... Roger Moore in his cat-loving woman-hating character.

Ffolkes was the US title - the UK saw it as North Sea Hijack.
 
And now there is the MV Ruby…

RUBY, General Cargo Ship - Details and current position - IMO 9626390 - VesselFinder

Vessel RUBY (IMO 9626390, MMSI 229041000) is a General Cargo Ship built in 2012 and currently sailing under the flag of Malta.
www.vesselfinder.com www.vesselfinder.com

She has a 20,000 ton ammonium nitrate load and no port wants her.


Headed for Malta…
 
www.bbc.com

New Zealand loses first naval ship to sea since WW2

The HMNZS Manawanui ran aground while surveying a reef off the coast of Samoa before sinking.
www.bbc.com www.bbc.com

www.theguardian.com

New Zealand navy ship Manawanui sinks off Samoa

All crew safe after specialist dive and hydrographic vessel ran aground near the southern coast of Upolu as it was conducting a reef survey
www.theguardian.com www.theguardian.com


 
yahya said:
gayexpress.co.nz

Sexism and Homophobia Can’t Diminish Commander Gray’s Heroic Actions - express Magazine

Commander Yvonne Gray’s swift decision-making has been credited with saving 75 lives when the navy ship she commanded, HMNZS Manawanui, was lost off the coast of Samoa on Saturday.
gayexpress.co.nz gayexpress.co.nz
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I've seen a bit of this floating around. She's a very well qualified officer. If there's anything in her personal life that should be examined, it should be her love of campervanning; a repugnant business.
 
yahya said:
gayexpress.co.nz

Sexism and Homophobia Can’t Diminish Commander Gray’s Heroic Actions - express Magazine

Commander Yvonne Gray’s swift decision-making has been credited with saving 75 lives when the navy ship she commanded, HMNZS Manawanui, was lost off the coast of Samoa on Saturday.
gayexpress.co.nz gayexpress.co.nz
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MrPhantomMan said:
She's a very well qualified officer.
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After joining the New Zealand Navy, Gray served as the commanding officer of the Navy’s Mine Counter Measures Team before taking the helm of the Manawanui.

First RNZN command posting after a stint in systems management. It doesn't mention what she did in the RN or how much bridge time she had. If she had none, then she's a desk jockey promoted directly into the big chair and the accusation of diversity hiring she's allegedly facing has to be taken seriously.

Running a surveying ship aground takes a special degree of Whisky Tango Foxtrot.
 
pathology_doc said:
After joining the New Zealand Navy, Gray served as the commanding officer of the Navy’s Mine Counter Measures Team before taking the helm of the Manawanui.

First RNZN command posting after a stint in systems management. It doesn't mention what she did in the RN or how much bridge time she had.
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Warfare Officer according to the link Yahya posted, which starts out at OOW, so she'll definitely have bridge time.

The people whinging about diversity hires would probably be making exactly the same comment if it was a Maori officer.
 
Like I said, the love of campervans is probably more of an issue than anything else. Just gross.
 
DWG said:
Warfare Officer according to the link Yahya posted, which starts out at OOW, so she'll definitely have bridge time.
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Starts out as OOW, yes, but after that?

I would think that the road to the captain's chair passes of necessity through the XO's position. The sideways shift from MCM specialist is what motivates my concern that this is a DEI job.
 
pathology_doc said:
Starts out as OOW, yes, but after that?

I would think that the road to the captain's chair passes of necessity through the XO's position. The sideways shift from MCM specialist is what motivates my concern that this is a DEI job.
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Yes, it should, assuming that this ship is big enough to have an XO. Crew is a minimum of 39, though it sounds like they were carrying ~64 RNZN crew, 4 crew from other militaries and 7 scientists for a total of 75. I'm not sure where the RNZN would insist on having an XO to handle things when you're talking 40-60 crew.

The initial description of mapping a reef that hasn't been surveyed since 1987 "in rough seas and high winds" is not a place I'd want to be in charge of a ship. 37 years of coral growth to account for, and it looks like someone misjudged how much the reef would grow and how fast the wind and waves would push the ship.
 
Personally, I would rather suggest they have the job done by an aircraft or even, a satelite with lidar.

Check the small print/details certainly but the decision to risk the ship belongs far above the pay grade of the captain.

Not seen anyone pointing fingers at these August folk........

I believe my option is cheaper and just as accurate for gross detail.
 
pathology_doc said:
Starts out as OOW, yes, but after that?

I would think that the road to the captain's chair passes of necessity through the XO's position. The sideways shift from MCM specialist is what motivates my concern that this is a DEI job.
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A little research is a wonderful thing.

The RNZN's Littoral Warfare Force has two branches, Hydrographic Survey and Clearance Diving, they both embark on HMNZS Manawanui as their at-sea asset, and they're both actively engaged in operations, not just training - Manawanui was disposing of WWII ordnance in the South Pacific in 2022 (Gray probably aboard as detachment commander) 2023, 2024 (Gray aboard as skipper). So she'll have had extensive experience on the Manawanui even before taking command. I suspect it's likely the standard career path for the Littoral Warfare Force, with the captain for their afloat assets picked from the commanders of the Hydrographic and Clearance Diving groups.

And then there's the RNZN press release on Commander Gray taking command:
"It is her first ship command in a naval career that started in the United Kingdom in 1993 as a warfare officer. Her service as a warfare officer ranged from working on aircraft carriers to frigates and mine hunters."
"her role in maritime evaluation has seen her help ‘work up’ ships and crews to peak efficiency."

More details from Forces News here:
"
She spent most of her junior career at sea, including on the aircraft carrier HMS Invincible and the minehunters Walney, Bridport and Cromer, after specialising as a Mine Warfare Officer.
After completing the Principal Warfare Officer course in 2004, she joined HMS Westminster as the PWO (Underwater) and Operations Officer, with operational experience in West Africa, Northern Europe and the Gulf.
Following a posting to the Maritime Warfare Centre in Portsmouth, she took the opportunity in 2009 to work with the Royal Australian Navy at HMAS Watson, Sydney."

So not exactly a desk jockey, almost certainly command track if she did the PWO course, and considered competent enough to represent the RN abroad.

Coming from a diverse background, it's been my experience that it's the people who protest about diversity who are inevitably the actual competence problem.
 
Foo Fighter said:
Personally, I would rather suggest they have the job done by an aircraft or even, a satelite with lidar.

Check the small print/details certainly but the decision to risk the ship belongs far above the pay grade of the captain.

Not seen anyone pointing fingers at these August folk........

I believe my option is cheaper and just as accurate for gross detail.
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Neither are good at mapping the sea floor.
 
DWG said:
2023, 2024 (Gray aboard as skipper).
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Bizarre, then, that she manages to ground a hydrographic survey ship.

DWG said:
it's been my experience that it's the people who protest about diversity who are inevitably the actual competence problem.
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All you had to say is that she'd held command for at least many months before the accident and possibly close to two years.

For the record, plenty of colleagues in my own profession (medicine) who I trained with (or who trained me) are one or more of not straight, not white or not male, and they are among the most competent I've met (ranging from very good to insanely brilliant). I would happily trust any of them with my life. One of them I helped hire, and I specifically pushed for him to be selected above a range of other candidates that included two white guys. He was very good at what he did, and I was very sorry to see him go when his wife's career choices took the both of them elsewhere.

In my career, I've also been involved in the sacking of two subordinates. One was white, and he was a bad egg who was clearly out of line (to the point where most of us refused to work with him) and had to go. The other was not, and the first thing I did for him was to call up all the places he'd previously worked to make sure that he wasn't a good man having a bad time for whatever reason. He turned out to have been a substandard performer everywhere, also to the point where nobody who'd worked with him wished to do so again, something that hadn't been revealed to us when he was foisted upon us out of the blue.

So please excuse me if my levels of skepticism on "diversity hires" are very high, especially when they're a cause celebre of diversity news outlets. Once bitten, twice shy. I am quite capable of judging someone on their merits, but I also have a very high degree of suspicion when something seems not quite right.
 
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Scott Kenny said:
In heavy seas and high winds, working around a reef that hasn't been mapped in 37 years.

Ask any sailor if they want to be poking around reefs in those conditions, they'll tell you hell no.
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Mapping the damn reef was what the ship was built for!
 
pathology_doc said:
Mapping the damn reef was what the ship was built for!
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Which is NOT a job you do in bad weather.

Storm blows over in a couple of days, if that, you steam out to deep water away from things that will put big damn holes in the people tank. And you apologize to the bosses that the job took a little longer, but that storm was too dangerous to be screwing around close to bigass rocks and shoals!
 
Too early to lay clear blame with so many unknowns (to us anyway), but I've never seen such a determined rush to defend the competency of the commanding officers of a ship that ran aground or struck any other stationary object, either.
 
_Del_ said:
Too early to lay clear blame with so many unknowns (to us anyway), but I've never seen such a determined rush to defend the competency of the commanding officers of a ship that ran aground or struck any other stationary object, either.
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No, it is the CO's fault. Her ship, her fault.

The reasons she hazarded the ship need examining.
 

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