McDD/Northrop/BAe ASTOVL/MRF/JAST/JSF studies

[Triton]

McDonnell Douglas / British Aerospace / Northrop Grumman team JAST 1-7 design concepts.

From JAST to JSF: The Evolution of the Joint Strike Fighter by Ian Maddock, Military Systems Analyst, Analytic Services, Inc. p. 5.
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,3368.msg130070.html#msg130070

 

[Grey Havoc]

The tail design was proven in the YF-23. Originally, Northrop was given a contract to investigate GCLF and LM a shaft driven lift fan for research. However, once it moved into a development contract, Northrop abandoned the GCLF because they knew it wouldn't work. That's when the moved into a Lift+liftcruise engine arrangement. The Marine Corps would not accept such an arrangement.

I would say that they (USMC) rather wish now that they had gone and run with it!

 

[sferrin]

The tail design was proven in the YF-23. Originally, Northrop was given a contract to investigate GCLF and LM a shaft driven lift fan for research. However, once it moved into a development contract, Northrop abandoned the GCLF because they knew it wouldn't work. That's when the moved into a Lift+liftcruise engine arrangement. The Marine Corps would not accept such an arrangement.

I would say that they (USMC) rather wish now that they had gone and run with it!

No doubt had they done so you'd now be saying they'd have rather wished they'd run with LM's design. Didn't matter which one got picked, the task would be HARD. After all the trades were done LM's design was deemed "least hard".

 

[donnage99]

The document from InvisibleDefender states that the accept for the navy version, all versions would only be able to carry 2 1,000 lbs JDAMs along with 2 AMRAAMs interally. That would make their internal bomb bays smaller than that of the Lockheed proposal?

 

[Triton]

Source:
http://www.strange-mecha.com/aircraft/x/jsf1.htm

 

[Triton]

Artist's impression of McDonnell Douglas MRF concept.

Source:
http://www.aerospaceweb.org/aircraft/fighter/jsf/pics03.shtml

 

[Triton]

Wind tunnel model of McDonnell Douglas MRF concept.

Source:
http://www.hitechweb.genezis.eu%2Fpi.htm

 

[Triton]

Advanced fighter concept from Northrop possibly submitted as a MRF proposal.

Source:
http://www.hitechweb.genezis.eu%2Fpi.htm

 

[flateric]

Kinda looks like a patent drawing Donald?

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,1748.msg14714.html#msg14714
http://www.google.com/patents/USD356990
http://www.google.com/patents/US5156358

 

[Matej]

Yes, they are patent drawings. I just added some gray and blue for better look.

 

[Triton]

Yes, they are patent drawings. I just added some gray and blue for better look.

I wasn't aware that they were your pictures, Matej. My apologies.

 

[Matej]

They are not "mine", they are patent drawings. I just modified them a bit to look little better on my website. I do not think it adds a copyright.

 

[Triton]

They are not "mine", they are patent drawings. I just modified them a bit to look little better on my website. I do not think it adds a copyright.

Aerospaceweb.org incorrectly credits the picture to the "JSF Program Office, 2010." I updated the references to point to your website, Matej. I appreciate the time and effort you put into your website.

 

[flateric]

MDC/BAe ASTOVL WT model

 

[sferrin]

MDC/BAe ASTOVL WT model

Looks more like the LM X-32.

 

[flateric]

check the logo at background and family-shaped nose
but yes, BAe/MDC ASTOVL looks very close to 160-190 iterations of Lockheed JAST
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,2392.msg20554.html#msg20554

 

[Deino]

MDC/BAe ASTOVL WT model

Looks more like the LM X-32.

Looks more like the inspiration for Chengdu's J-20 ! :

 

[flateric]

this one looks much more 'inspirational'
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,238.msg114317.html#msg114317

 

[hesham]

Is this a real McDonnell Dougals ASTOVL design ?,they said;


McDonnell Douglas - REN cactus project - lift plus lift/cruise (LLC)

http://www.airborn12.com/extras/fighters.html

 

[Matej]

It shows just an engine principle, aircraft silhouette is only generic.

 

[Triton]

Artist's impressions of McDonnell Douglas/BAe ASTOVL concepst. Tandem seating arrangement?

Source:
http://www.airborn12.com/extras/fighters.html

 

[Jemiba]

I think, both pictures show single seaters. Was there ever a serious requirement
for a two seater ?

 

[flateric]

for JAST/JSF???

 

[Matej]

Tandem seating arrangement?

Just deformed pictures.

 

[Stargazer]

The ASTOVL picture resized and enhanced:

 

[flateric]

wish I had it in hi-res...

 

[InvisibleDefender]

I think, both pictures show single seaters. Was there ever a serious requirement
for a two seater ?

It was discussed but dismissed very early. There are no artists concepts that I have ever seen which show a two seater.

 

[Triton]

Did we lose the link to From JAST to JSF: The Evolution of the Joint Strike Fighter by Ian Maddock when the JSF mega-topic was broken up into smaller topics by manufacturer? Or was the document taken down from the forum?

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

The topic was merged.


The post is here:
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,238.msg130070.html#msg130070


The PDF is here:
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;topic=238.0;attach=137096

 

[hesham]

Hi,

http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1996/1996%20-%201664.html

The drawing.

 

[shedofdread]

For some reason, I've always rather warmed to that design.
Part #7 interests me - I presume that's a door allowing air from the intake duct to flow over the wing roots thus promoting flow attachment in that region at high AoA (and maybe cleaner flow at the tail?)..? Anyone got more info on that feature?

 

[AeroFranz]

I believe the explanation is more simple, it might be an auxiliary door for inlet air for the main engine in VTOL mode, just like the ring of spring-loaded doors on a Harrier.

 

[shedofdread]

Ah! My mistake. You're right - I thought they looked rather like blow-in doors...

Part #7 is labeled differently in the two columns. I had just read the CTOL / CV column. I wonder then, to what does that refer? Hmmm...

 

[hesham]

Hi,


what was this BAe ASTOVL model ?.

http://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1991/1991%20-%200407.html

 

[Mike Pryce]

Its the BAe P.112:

www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,2863.msg96792.html

 

[lantinian]

Part #7 interests me - I presume that's a door allowing air from the intake duct to flow over the wing roots thus promoting flow attachment in that region at high AoA (and maybe cleaner flow at the tail?)..? Anyone got more info on that feature?

I believe the F-22 has exactly the same feature (inlet bleed-air door) with exactly the same purpose.

 

[hesham]

Thank you my dear Harrier.

 

[sferrin]

Part #7 interests me - I presume that's a door allowing air from the intake duct to flow over the wing roots thus promoting flow attachment in that region at high AoA (and maybe cleaner flow at the tail?)..? Anyone got more info on that feature?

I believe the F-22 has exactly the same feature (inlet bleed-air door) with exactly the same purpose.

The early ones had little spoilers immediately aft of the upper inlet lip but those were deleted from aircraft 0028 on as I recall. The inlets further back, on top of the aircraft, are for the engines and serve the same purpose as the side inlets on the XF8U-3 Crusader.

 

[Triton]

McDonnell Douglas / British Aerospace / Northrop Grumman JSF model found on eBay.

Source:
http://www.ebay.com/itm/RARE-Joint-Strike-Fighter-JSF-McDonnell-Douglas-Northrup-Grumman-British-Aero-/140936094809?pt=LH_DefaultDomain_0&hash=item20d0722459

 

[Triton]

McDonnell Douglas / British Aerospace / Northrop Grumman JSF model found on eBay.