DPRK Navy ships

[SK2]

I know I'd be looking at either a more capable version of something they have in the fleet already, or a class that does something the fleet as a whole needs that it doesn't currently have right now.

So yes, adding an AAW ship makes sense, and or an AAW/ASW ship to give their missile subs a bastion to work in.

I would suggest AAW and ASW corvettes instead of FACs, that can buy time to defend their SSBs to and from combat patrol

 

[ValiantHeart]

But don't they have something with an equivalent weapons load?

Now that's a huge NO. Their indigenous designs can carry only 4-8 missile at best.

 

[Scott Kenny]

Now that's a huge NO. Their indigenous designs can carry only 4-8 missile at best.

I'm not sure it's worth fitting more than 8x Harpoon-class missiles onto any given ship (note that the USN didn't fit more than 8x onto the CGs and DDGs, I think only the BBs got 4 sets of launchers).

So is it worth building a whole new class to get 16x AShMs per ship?

 

[Dilandu]

I'm not sure it's worth fitting more than 8x Harpoon-class missiles onto any given ship (note that the USN didn't fit more than 8x onto the CGs and DDGs, I think only the BBs got 4 sets of launchers).

So is it worth building a whole new class to get 16x AShMs per ship?

Just made a VL-capable ASM, seriously!

 

[SK2]

Just made a VL-capable ASM, seriously!

It depends, if you are putting them to corvettes maybe, but if you are putting them on FACs it's wasting space (and harming stability of the vessel)

 

[ValiantHeart]

Just made a VL-capable ASM, seriously!

The VLS launcher may be too expensive for North Korea to field en masse (though I do hope they come up with an indigenous Karakurt design). Tilting launchers mounted on stands, on the other hand, would be cheaper and more economical to equip large numbers of ships.

 

[TomS]

I'm not sure it's worth fitting more than 8x Harpoon-class missiles onto any given ship (note that the USN didn't fit more than 8x onto the CGs and DDGs, I think only the BBs got 4 sets of launchers).

So is it worth building a whole new class to get 16x AShMs per ship?

OTOH, many new Western frigate designs are getting 16 NSM or equivalent, which is similar in size.

 

[Scott Kenny]

OTOH, many new Western frigate designs are getting 16 NSM or equivalent, which is similar in size.

Fair point, but don't NSMs data link and call their targets to minimize the chances of one ship drawing all the missiles?

I'm not sure a heavy missile load is compatible without that ability. You'd want more missile carrying craft to get more angles of attack on the target formation.

 

[KonTim]

North Korea building second warship of largest new class on east coast: Report | NK PRO

North Korea is building a second warship of its largest new class in Chongjin on the east coast, according to an SI Analytics nK Insight report released Tuesday, following state media’s recent reveal of the first such ship on the west coast. Construction on the vessel started in May 2024 at the...

www.nknews.org

 

[ValiantHeart]

It looks like the ship will have VLS installed at both her bow and stern.

Wonder if it will have a helicopter hangar or helipad (most likely not).

 

[Dilandu]

Wonder if it will have a helicopter hangar or helipad (most likely not).

Likely not. As far as I know, North Korean only ever installed helipad on one ship - the experimental Soho-class (tentatively named) catamaran frigate - and it's possible that they weren't exactly satisfied with the results:

 

[ValiantHeart]

Likely not. As far as I know, North Korean only ever installed helipad on one ship - the experimental Soho-class (tentatively named) catamaran frigate - and it's possible that they weren't exactly satisfied with the results:

View attachment 760143

Which had more to do with their lack of a dedicated anti-submarine helicopter than anything else, even until now.

That said, if they wanted a lightweight helicopter that could be converted into an ASW helicopter for use on warships, I wonder why they didn't choose the Mi-2?.... hey, maybe if a helipad and hangar were to be seen on this new warship class, the Mi-2 would probably be a good candidate.

 

[Scott Kenny]

That said, if they wanted a lightweight helicopter that could be converted into an ASW helicopter for use on warships, I wonder why they didn't choose the Mi-2?.... hey, maybe if a helipad and hangar were to be seen on this new warship class, the Mi-2 would probably be a good candidate.

Because an Mi-2 Hoplite only has ~1300lbs useful load? And a single APR-3E Russian lightweight torpedo is 1200lbs? The Chinese Yu-7 LWT is ~550lbs, but the successor Yu-11 is longer and heavier, probably on the order of 800lbs (the Mk50 is ~800lbs).

So it's either carrying sensors OR a weapon.

You need more like 8000lbs payload to haul sonobuoys, dipping sonar, 3-4 crew, and a pair of torpedoes or depth charges.

 

[ValiantHeart]

The destroyer/frigate that North Korea is building will likely be comparable to China's Type 054A class, after comparing the length and width of the ship.

It will be much more heavily armed though, considering it will have fixed phased array radars on the superstructure and two VLSs on the bow and stern.

I mean, if this ship is of Chinese origin (or at least has some connection), it would make sense, since China has been known to export weapons with very high levels of customization to suit the requirements of its customers.

 

[Ainen]

I mean, if this ship is of Chinese origin (or at least has some connection), it would make sense, since China has been known to export weapons with very high levels of customization to suit the requirements of its customers.

I'd argue it's absolutely unlikely there's any Chinese link, and it's too early for any Russian(other than maybe money inflow from trade).
If there are some technological links - it's, as usual, Iran.

 

[ValiantHeart]

The more I look at the ship from this angle...

....the more it looks like the South Korean Daegu class.

It's also worth noting that South Korean shipbuilders were attacked by North Korean hackers around late 2023. They didn't say exactly what was stolen, but...

 

[Dilandu]

the more it looks like the South Korean Daegu class.

Frankly, the similarity is too generic. While I don't doubt that North Korea used spies and hackers to gain modern military data, this is more likely a result of parallel evolution.

 

[ValiantHeart]

New images of another frigate of same class being made on east coast of DPRK along teasing new submarine.

 

[ValiantHeart]

Chongjin, Eastern Coast.


Nampo, Western Coast.

 

[ValiantHeart]

And the cream of the crop, the new, under-construction nuclear-powered submarine.

 

[lancer21]

Any rough estimate for the subs size and displacement, and missile load? I've seen preliminary estimates at around 12 meters diameter which is for example Delta SSBN size.

 

[ValiantHeart]

Some useful analysis and estimate:

North Korea’s Nuclear-Powered Missile Submarine: A Mystery Wrapped Around a Riddle and an Enigma - 38 North: Informed Analysis of North Korea

On March 8, North Korean (Democratic People’s Republic of Korea or DPRK) media reported that ...

www.38north.org

 

[Grey Havoc]

H I Sutton - Covert Shores

 

[ValiantHeart]

New Guided Missile Frigate Fitting Out at Nampo - Beyond Parallel

New satellite image provides the closest look to date of the new North Korean Navy’s guided missile frigate (FFG) at the Nampo Navy Shipyard.

beyondparallel.csis.org

The ship and the suspected location on the ship where the VLS would likely be equipped.

 

[sahureka]

Molto meno interessante, una nave da guerra piuttosto piccola, costruita con l'esperienza di progettazione dell'Amnok.
Dispone di un solo RBU-6000 per ASW e di un obsoleto AK-230 CIWS, una piattaforma anemica.
Anche se ce ne fossero due, sarebbe stato meglio costruirne un altro Amnok.

Sembra, ma non è un RBU-6000 (ha 12 tubi e un calibro di 213 mm). Come puoi vedere in questa immagine,

il modello nordcoreano è dotato di 10 tubi
e il calibro è attualmente sconosciuto, che per standardizzazione potrebbe essere 252 mm, come nel caso dell'RBU-1200 (o della versione cinese FQF-1200) in uso da decenni nella Marina nordcoreana.
Parzialmente simile al modello RBU-12000, dotato di 10 tubi ma con un calibro di 300 mm.

Quindi tendo a pensare che si tratti di una creazione nordcoreana che ha preso a modello i prodotti russi; resta da stabilire come è scritto il calibro e se ha un sistema di caricamento automatico come nell'RBU-6000 o nell'RBU-12000, oppure è caricato manualmente come nell'RBU-1200.

Inoltre, questo cacciatore di sottomarini non ha l'AK-230 a poppa, ma i nordcoreani, utilizzando la stessa cupola della torretta, hanno installato una mitragliatrice Gatling da 30 mm a sei canne (ma non è un AK-630)


poi a prua dietro l'RBU ci sono due torrette con armi tipo gatlin da 14,5 mm,


completare un MANPADS X 6 a centro nave.

Allego anche un disegno fatto da me nel recente passato

 

[sahureka]

Modern naval units were also put into service a few years ago, such as the surface effect hull missile units of various sizes



and this Haesham-B class of larger dimensions and with retractable anti-ship missile canisters

 

[ValiantHeart]

View attachment 766846

Unfortunately, this design, which could have revolutionized North Korea's fast attack craft fleet - particularly the Haesam/Nongo-B - appears to have been discontinued under Kim Jong Un. Manufacturing/operating costs and technological complexity could be issues.

And where did you get this image :3

 

[sahureka]

Unfortunately, this design, which could have revolutionized North Korea's fast attack craft fleet - particularly the Haesam/Nongo-B - appears to have been discontinued under Kim Jong Un. Manufacturing/operating costs and technological complexity could be issues.

And where did you get this image :3

The uncensored original was sent to me privately by a user of another forum, with a ban on publishing it in the original but only after heavy censorship so as not to show which area the ship was sailing in, also with a ban for commercial purposes, as I wrote in several languages in the photo.
Then others copied it by putting their references, but they don't have the original photo, or rather the original photos because there are more than one

 

[Scott Kenny]

Any rough estimate for the subs size and displacement, and missile load? I've seen preliminary estimates at around 12 meters diameter which is for example Delta SSBN size.

I'd feel confident saying that it's GW SSBN sized. So some 6800 tons submerged, 16x Polaris-sized birds.

 

[sahureka]

1) From the little that can be seen in the photographs;
2) What the DPRK currently uses on its ships;
3) And in the hope of not being put up against the wall and shot, much of this is a figment of my imagination.

A first look at what it might look like, which I am sure will have to be modified a lot once the frigate is clearly visible.

 

[ValiantHeart]

1) From the little that can be seen in the photographs;
2) What the DPRK currently uses on its ships;
3) And in the hope of not being put up against the wall and shot, much of this is a figment of my imagination.

A first look at what it might look like, which I am sure will have to be modified a lot once the frigate is clearly visible.
View attachment 766975

Close-in defense weaponry (a.k.a CIWS) is a bit weak for such a large ship.

Still have those classic round hatches.

And I doubt whether the forward VLS can carry that many cells - I'm guessing only 16.

 

[sahureka]

From amidships to the extreme aft as there were no photos I avoided making assumptions, so I installed neither the MAPADS x6

nor the 6x14.5mm CIWS widely used on North Korean ships and also on Myanmar frigates.


Therefore in this first draft of what the new frigate might look like, I have ‘fantasised’ about the part towards the bow.
The only systems seen already positioned in the photos are the 6x30mm CIWS and a launcher resembling the one seen about 4 years ago that could use a small missile with SAM capabilities similar to the Raytheon Coyote 2 or the Iranian Qaem 118, to intercept drones, helicopters, guided bombs or subsonic missiles.

However, today it is too early to think whether the ship will be weak or not.
The rest I have placed, are weapons and electronic systems already available and used in the DPRK and others unknown and included by me only as an interpretation of the openings on the foredeck and in the command superstructure.
Write 16 cells, I have drawn 24, but as I wrote it is only a first draft made without knowing what they will put in those VLS cells.
To give an example the Iranians on the new catamarans have cells of two different sizes for different types of missiles;
So if the North Koreans are not going to install universal VLSs as in the Russian ships where all types of missiles can be used, the number of cells that can be installed could vary depending on the type and size of missiles the North Koreans intend to use.
On the bow of the similar 76/62 instead of the new 10-tube RBU-12000 ASW rockets, I installed two older RBU-1200 for ASW rockets, this is because I estimated that the size of the similar RBU-1200 would be too high and would interfere with the 76/62
But again, everything at the moment is unofficial and just a figment of my imaginat

 

[Hood]

Plus there is the question of where the aft-facing radar arrays are located.

But its a neat and plausible impression of how it may look when completed.

 

[sahureka]

Article from ‘NK Insight’ of 10 April 2025
Title:
"Significant Support from Russia needed for new N.K Naval Combatant Construction."
Reading the article, the author seems to build it around the idea that the new frigate has already been created and will be completed with Russia's indispensable and inevitable help.
Russia's help is possible, but many so-called experts persist in making the big mistake of underestimating North Korea.
https://si-analytics.ai/fuel-import...to-the-wonsan-tourist-zone-―-april-4-2025-복제/

From the document above, a satellite photo of the frigate showing another part of the ship

 

[Dilandu]

Russia's help is possible, but many so-called experts persist in making the big mistake of underestimating North Korea.

That's some kind of psychological blind spot - inability to realize, that those technologies aren't exactly new, they existed for decades, and it's perfectly reasonable for determined industrialized nation to repeat them.

 

[ValiantHeart]

Article from ‘NK Insight’ of 10 April 2025
Title:
"Significant Support from Russia needed for new N.K Naval Combatant Construction."
Reading the article, the author seems to build it around the idea that the new frigate has already been created and will be completed with Russia's indispensable and inevitable help.
Russia's help is possible, but many so-called experts persist in making the big mistake of underestimating North Korea.
https://si-analytics.ai/fuel-imported-through-khasan-station-is-also-being-supplied-to-the-wonsan-tourist-zone-―-april-4-2025-복제/

From the document above, a satellite photo of the frigate showing another part of the ship
View attachment 767071

It may reasonable to assume that Russia provided technical assistance in the design and construction of the ship… or at least influenced it to some extent. Especially since their naval shipbuilding industry, which had never built a surface combatant larger than 1,800 tons, could suddenly advance so much.

At least we have evidence that North Korea can build naval guns/autocannons, phased array radars and engines for the ship. And indeed, things like radars, missiles and gas turbine engines are anything but simple, so clearly this North Korean achievement is significant.

 

[ValiantHeart]

Also...

The red circle is probably where the aft VLS will be located.

I just gave a rough measurement by eye, but it feels like it's larger than the forward VLS. As if it were intended for larger missiles.

The weapon configuration I'm thinking of is 16 (8x2) smaller VLS cells at the front for launching cruise missiles, with 32 (8x4) larger cells at the rear for launching naval SAMs.

 

[sahureka]

At the bow there are photos, so the configuration should already be clear, from this satellite image I start making assumptions
Green : command superstructure;
Brown : smoke exhaust chimneys;
White : elevated superstructure for radar electronic systems ;
Orange : other mast for electronic/radar systems ;
Magenta: assumption 1) opening for installing gas turbines- or - 2) space for VLS
Yellow: hangar for helicopters or drones (14 metres long and 11 metres wide (KA-27/28ASW(*) with folded blades is 3.8 m wide, 12.25 m long, maximum height 5.4 m)
on the sides with lower superstructure possibility to install CIWS
Light blue: flight deck (+/- metres 22x the width of the ship)
Amber: Extreme aft end of ship lower than flight deck

(*) North Korea has in the past received at least two KA-28 ASWs from Cuba (export version of the KA-27ASW) it is not known if they are operational today, however they are present in the country

 

[Scott Kenny]

That's some kind of psychological blind spot - inability to realize, that those technologies aren't exactly new, they existed for decades, and it's perfectly reasonable for determined industrialized nation to repeat them.

The best use for help from someone who has done the project before is to say, "It took us a really long time to figure that out. Since you want this project done soon it's best to let R&D chew on that for the next iteration."

Which is basically what Lockheed did for the KF-21.

 

[sahureka]

At the bow there are photos, so the configuration should already be clear, from this satellite image I start making assumptions
Green : command superstructure;
Brown : smoke exhaust chimneys;
White : elevated superstructure for radar electronic systems ;
Orange : other mast for electronic/radar systems ;
Magenta: assumption 1) opening for installing gas turbines- or - 2) space for VLS
Yellow: hangar for helicopters or drones (14 metres long and 11 metres wide (KA-27/28ASW(*) with folded blades is 3.8 m wide, 12.25 m long, maximum height 5.4 m)
on the sides with lower superstructure possibility to install CIWS
Light blue: flight deck (+/- metres 22x the width of the ship)
Amber: Extreme aft end of ship lower than flight deck

(*) North Korea has in the past received at least two KA-28 ASWs from Cuba (export version of the KA-27ASW) it is not known if they are operational today, however they are present in the country

View attachment 767099

Taking a cue from the last satellite photo, I have adapted my idea of what this new North Korean military ship might look like.
I lengthened the ship by inserting some superstructures, placed a VLS amidships, but avoided placing electronic systems and artillery towards the stern, which I will eventually place when and if more details are known.
As always, this is my free hypothesis that will probably be refuted when it is at sea trials.