Dassault Rafale NEWS ONLY

[GTX]

Speaking of Poland: https://sputniknews.com/amp/military/201703241051941863-polish-air-force-f35-f16/

 

[Deltafan]

Speaking of Poland: https://sputniknews.com/amp/military/201703241051941863-polish-air-force-f35-f16/

Topic mistake ? ???

 

[Jemiba]

I think he meant, that Poland seems not to be interested in the Rafale anymore.
(http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,17813.msg290544.html#msg290544)

 

[GTX]

Exactly

 

[Deltafan]

Ah, OK. I made the mistake :-[

 

[fightingirish]

Poland is also not interested in acquiring second-hand F-16s.
Link: https://www.flightglobal.com/news/articles/poland-shoots-down-used-f-16ab-acquisition-435508/

Back to the topic Rafale. B)

Rafale F4 standard launched
Paris, March 22nd 2017, French defence Minister Jean-Yves Le Drian announced that he had authorized the development of the Rafale F4 standard. The first Rafale F4 should be delivered in 2025 but some of the features of this new version will be available as early as 2023.

The key improvements would be the following:

• Improved net-centric capabilities (New data links, satcom)
• RBE-2 AESA upgrade
• SPECTRA upgrade
• OSF IRST (New IR channel for the OSF)
• M88 engine upgrade (AB thrust > 8 T)
• Mica NG missile integration
• AASM missile upgrade

Le Drian also confirmed that a 5th production tranche should be ordered during the next LPM (Multi-year military procurement plan).

sources:

• https://www.portail-aviation.com/
• http://www.defensenews.com/
• https://www.flightglobal.com/
• http://www.air-cosmos.com/
• http://www.defense.gouv.fr/

[...]

Source: http://rafalenews.blogspot.com/2017/03/rafale-f4-standard-launched.html

 

[hesham]

Hi,

with all respect to Poland,we have both (Egypt),but Rafale has a large capacity more than F-16.

 

[Deltafan]

Thanks fightingirish (and Hesham ).

I'm astonished by

"M88 engine upgrade (AB thrust > 8 T)"

Not because it could not be possible, but because I did not see a proof that it is what the minister said :

Le standard F4 "prévoit également la prise en compte des évolutions attendues de la motorisation"

AFAIK, officially, nothing is said about these "évolutions" of the engine. I would like to know from where the author of the article in the link found "AB thrust > 8 T"

 

[kaiserd]

Hi,

with all respect to Poland,we have both (Egypt),but Rafale has a large capacity more than F-16.

The Rafale is a fine aircraft and I'm sure it will serve Egypt very well.
Re: Poland its more a case of the F-16 already being in service and being cheaper than the Rafale (while also being very capable) while if they have more money to spend the Poles would almost certainly be able to get the F-35, which Egypt is not likely to be allowed to buy in the near future.
For political reasons Poland may also favour US fighters while for Egypt likely some of the motivation for the Rafale buy was to demonstrate less reliance on the US.

 

[Deltafan]

After the order of 24 Rafale in 2015, Qatar buys 12 more Rafale, with the option of buying 36 more.

http://abcnews.go.com/International/wireStory/french-president-arrives-qatar-amid-arab-boycott-doha-51636977

 

[Deltafan]

About the "expensive Eurocanards" :

in Qatar :

Deal for the 36 Rafale (6.3 + 1.1 =) : 7.4 billions €

Deal for the 36 F-15 : 12 billions €

https://www.defensenews.com/global/mideast-africa/2017/12/07/qatar-moves-to-buy-more-rafale-jets-order-infantry-fighting-vehicles/

http://www.janes.com/article/71443/qatar-agrees-purchase-of-f-15qa-fighters-from-us

 

[Deltafan]

France orders $2.3 billion upgrade for Rafale warplanes

https://www.defensenews.com/global/europe/2019/01/14/france-orders-upgraded-rafale-warplanes-for-23-billion/

 

[Deltafan]

Indonesia would be interested in 48 Rafale.

Et si l'Indonésie s'offrait des Rafale et des sous-marins Scorpène ?

Le ministre indonésien de la Défense a expliqué à la France que son pays souhaitait s'armer pour contrer la menace chinoise. Djakarta est intéressé par 48 Rafale, jusqu'à 4 Scorpène et 2 Gowind.

www.latribune.fr

 

[Hood]

How would they pay for all that stuff? I thought they were paying for Flankers in palm oil? They can barely afford to pay to keep their share of K-FX going either. In fact if they did buy Rafales it could well spell the end for the I-FX programme.

 

[galgot]

How would they pay for all that stuff? I thought they were paying for Flankers in palm oil? They can barely afford to pay to keep their share of K-FX going either. In fact if they did buy Rafales it could well spell the end for the I-FX programme.

Not to say it's gonna happen , but it may be about palm oil indeed . On July 2018 UE stated the end of palm oil as 2030, provoking the ire of Indonesia , while Total import hundreds of thousands of tons per year for using in "biofuels". Total is a very powerful lobby in Fr, and Fr is member of UE... So...
I suppose each are discussing about finding ways to sell their stuff.

 

[GTX]

Yeah, I will believe this when I see the first photos of aircraft in TNI-AU markings. I am sure the interest is there but as to the budget...

 

[Antonio]

Dear members,

please try to stay in the topic

Thanks in advance

 

[Deltafan]

It seems that the article in the French newspaper La Tribune, the source of the information, is contradicted, or in any case minimized, by the Indonesian Minister of Defense.

Prabowo Subianto Eyeing to Bolster National Defense System

Prabowo Subianto officially requested a substantial upgrade for the country's primary defense weaponry system (alutsista) to the DPR.

en.tempo.co

Wait and see...

 

[TomcatViP]

I fail to see how a suspected major Rafale strike (military source - SEAD - NATO member) could be out of subject?
Assessing the credibility of an information by looking at the point of equilibrium and balance is all about what is done in such case.
This is not l'ORTF.

 

[Antonio]

May I suggest to start a dedicated thread about "suspected major air strike: Rafale fighters involved" which probably will raise conflictive posts due to its nature.

As a result, a thread focused on technical aspects could be kept here for Rafale. Thus information related to forum core interest is best preserved.
Political threads alone allow for better monitoring and can be cleaned or closed if necessary.

 

[TomcatViP]

There is nothing Political in compiling the story and assessing information about a reported strike.
Forbes also has it reported on the same terms.

 

[Antonio]

There is nothing Political in compiling the story and assessing information about a reported strike.
Forbes also has it reported on the same terms.

Of course not.

But that's the kind of post that has a higher risk to raise political conflict between members...in fact, moderation was already requested for it.

I personally agree that the post is still right for the Bar, but a dedicated thread would make it easier to moderate if needed.

Thanks in advance

 

[TomcatViP]

The first batch of five Indian Air Force Rafale is likely to arrive in India by end of July. The aircraft will be inducted at Air Force Station Ambala on July 29 subject to weather," the IAF said.
Reports suggest that the Rafale jets are likely to be deployed in the Ladakh sector on the Eastern Border with China in view of the border row with the country.

IAF to Induct Dassault Rafale This Month, Here's How This Fighter Jet Can Increase India's Firepower - News18

India chose Dassault Rafale over Lockheed Martin’s F-16 used by Pakistan Air Force, Boeing’s F/A-18, Eurofighter Typhoon, Russia’s MiG-35 and Sweden’s Saab Gripen.

www.news18.com

I am however sceptical regarding Rafale upgrades as contracted. IMOHO upgrades would have had been done in India. But if the plane is rushed into service, what would it be of it?

 

[Bhurki]

But if the plane is rushed into service, what would it be of it?

France Hands Over Three Rafale Fighter Jets to India

Three French-made Rafale multirole fighter jets have been officially handed over to the Indian Air Force to date, according to a senior Indian official.

thediplomat.com

"IAF pilots are flying the new fighter jets for at least 1,500 hours in France as part of the induction process into service."
Training is well underway right now, so those jets will probably have half a squadron worth of pilots ready from get go.

 

[helmutkohl]

The first batch of five Indian Air Force Rafale is likely to arrive in India by end of July. The aircraft will be inducted at Air Force Station Ambala on July 29 subject to weather," the IAF said.
Reports suggest that the Rafale jets are likely to be deployed in the Ladakh sector on the Eastern Border with China in view of the border row with the country.

IAF to Induct Dassault Rafale This Month, Here's How This Fighter Jet Can Increase India's Firepower - News18

India chose Dassault Rafale over Lockheed Martin’s F-16 used by Pakistan Air Force, Boeing’s F/A-18, Eurofighter Typhoon, Russia’s MiG-35 and Sweden’s Saab Gripen.

www.news18.com

I am however sceptical regarding Rafale upgrades as contracted. IMOHO upgrades would have had been done in India. But if the plane is rushed into service, what would it be of it?

maybe due to urgency regarding high altitude conflict?
in that sense, is the Rafale's configuration better suited for that role than the Flanker?
I often hear that the Mirage 2000s are optimally suited for conflict in that area
it might also be useful to bring in something dissimilar than the Flankers China also uses

 

[TomcatViP]

Hammer rumored on Indian Rafale:

Hammer (Highly Agile Modular Munition Extended Range) is a precision-guided missile developed by French defence major Safran. The missile was originally designed and manufactured for the French Air Force and Navy.

"The order for the HAMMER missiles is being processed and the French authorities have agreed to supply them to us at a short notice for our Rafale combat aircraft," government sources told ANI.

IAF to integrate Rafale with new generation air-to-ground missiles

www.outlookindia.com

India to boost Rafale capabilities with HAMMER missiles under emergency order: Sources - Times of India

With the Rafales arriving in the country in the middle of a dispute with China, the Indian Air Force is further boosting the capabilities of the combat aircraft by equipping it with the HAMMER missiles (60-70kms range) from France. The order for these missiles is being processed under the...

m.timesofindia.com

 

[Bhurki]

Hammer rumored on Indian Rafale:

Hammer (Highly Agile Modular Munition Extended Range) is a precision-guided missile developed by French defence major Safran. The missile was originally designed and manufactured for the French Air Force and Navy.

"The order for the HAMMER missiles is being processed and the French authorities have agreed to supply them to us at a short notice for our Rafale combat aircraft," government sources told ANI.

IAF to integrate Rafale with new generation air-to-ground missiles

www.outlookindia.com

India to boost Rafale capabilities with HAMMER missiles under emergency order: Sources - Times of India

With the Rafales arriving in the country in the middle of a dispute with China, the Indian Air Force is further boosting the capabilities of the combat aircraft by equipping it with the HAMMER missiles (60-70kms range) from France. The order for these missiles is being processed under the...

m.timesofindia.com

Since these are being bought under 'emergency powers' which has a limit of INR 5 bn ($80M), procurement numbers are likely to be about 300 at maximum. (AASM is an expensive jdam, albeit with a 3-4x tossing range)

 

[TomcatViP]

It is understood according to the new rules mandated by the Mod (Fr) that all logistic for the transfer is at the charge of the IAF: AdlAE's A330 tankers are escorting the 5 planes to UAE where IL-76 will take over.

https://twitter.com/x/status/1287645042677444608

View: https://twitter.com/i/status/1287645042677444608

 

[galgot]

Fr air force support the transit of 5 Rafales with two A330 MRTT,
one of them carrying 100000 covid testing kits.

L'armée de l'Air et de l'Espace soutient le convoyage de 5 Rafale vers l'Inde avec deux A330 MRTT - Zone Militaire

Ce 27 juillet, les cinq premiers Rafale destinés à l'Indian Air Force ont décollé du site de Dassault Aviation, à Mérignac pour rejoindre l'Escadron n°17

www.opex360.com

 

[Archibald]

Covid tests and Rafale... can't see any connection, except maybe "It's christmas day in India, avec en prime, le cadeau bonus !"

Aside that, can't help thinking that the Armée de l'air hasn't that much tankers and Rafale to spare those days... but we happily déshabille Pierre (Armée de l'Air) pour habiller Paul (India). Oh well...

 

[galgot]

Covid tests and Rafale... can't see any connection, except maybe "It's christmas day in India, avec en prime, le cadeau bonus !"

Aside that, can't help thinking that the Armée de l'air hasn't that much tankers and Rafale to spare those days... but we happily déshabille Pierre (Armée de l'Air) pour habiller Paul (India). Oh well...

Le client est roi ... Well, anyway if that can help.

 

[TomcatViP]

Used Rafale for Croatia:
Fr defense confirms Croatia was offered used Rafale airframe sourced directly from the French AF.

Source (in Fr.):

La France a proposé des avions Rafale d'occasion à la Croatie - Zone Militaire

Les conséquences de la crise économique provoquée par la pandémie de covid-19 risquent d'être douloureuses pour la base industrielle et technologique de

www.opex360.com

 

[helmutkohl]

Used Rafale for Croatia:
Fr defense confirms Croatia was offered used Rafale airframe sourced directly from the French AF.

Source (in Fr.):

La France a proposé des avions Rafale d'occasion à la Croatie - Zone Militaire

Les conséquences de la crise économique provoquée par la pandémie de covid-19 risquent d'être douloureuses pour la base industrielle et technologique de

www.opex360.com

that would be sexy

a nice whatif Rafale in Croatian colors

 

[helmutkohl]

Αγορά μαχητικών αεροσκαφών Rafale από τη Γαλλία | Pagenews.gr

Μία νέα αγορά σχεδιάζει το υπουργείο Άμυνας από τη Γαλλία. Μπορεί το σχέδιο με την απόκτηση φρεγατών τύπου Belh@rra να ναυάγησε για διάφορους λόγους, ωστόσο…

www.pagenews.gr

Greece to get 18 Rafales! 8 of which are free from Francia

 

[Deltafan]

Αγορά μαχητικών αεροσκαφών Rafale από τη Γαλλία | Pagenews.gr

Μία νέα αγορά σχεδιάζει το υπουργείο Άμυνας από τη Γαλλία. Μπορεί το σχέδιο με την απόκτηση φρεγατών τύπου Belh@rra να ναυάγησε για διάφορους λόγους, ωστόσο…

www.pagenews.gr

Greece to get 18 Rafales! 8 of which are free from Francia

Nothing is certain. While there have been a lot of articles in the past few days, for the moment the original information, which appeared in the Greek press, has still not been confirmed. We should know more on September 10.

According to the newspaper "Parapolitika", the Greek Prime Minister, Kyriakos Mitsotakis and the French President Macron would have agreed on the acquisition by the Greek air force of 18 Rafale fighter planes. According to the article, of the 18 fighters, 10 will be of new construction, so a squadron of Rafale C F3-R, and the last 8 will be older models, in service in the French Air Force. According to "Parapolitika", the most amazing thing is that the 8 oldest devices will be offered FREE to Greece ...

Defense cooperation Greece-France will take place on September 10

As the newspaper Proto Thema reveals in its Sunday edition, the emergency armament program will amount to 10 billion euros for the purchase of new weapons systems.

According to the available information, the armament package will include the purchase of 18 Rafale fighters, the acquisition of new frigates, the complete modernization of MEKO type frigates, the purchase of torpedoes as well as other ammunition and other weapons systems for all three branches of the E.D

 

[TomcatViP]

It seems also through those last rumors (Croatia & Greece) that the French gov looks toward divesting part of the early Rafale lot (even for free) to buy some new tranches for the AdlA.

Regarding Greece, I wonder if a refit of their M2K won't be in the plan.

 

[Grey Havoc]

Things are looking pretty ugly in the Mediterranean at the moment.

 

[Deltafan]

It seems also through those last rumors (Croatia & Greece) that the French gov looks toward divesting part of the early Rafale lot (even for free) to buy some new tranches for the AdlA.

Regarding Greece, I wonder if a refit of their M2K won't be in the plan.

Already signed (December 2019)

Greece Signs Contracts to Upgrade Mirage 2000 Fleet

 

[Deltafan]

It seems also through those last rumors (Croatia & Greece) that the French gov looks toward divesting part of the early Rafale lot (even for free) to buy some new tranches for the AdlA.

Yes, there is a gap for the deliveries of Rafale to the Armée de l'Air between 2024 and 2027. A recent report of two members of the French National Assembly proposed a new order to fill it and to sell an equivalent number of aircraft already in service with the Armée de l'Air.

On a French forum it was said that a decision on the new order "could" be announced next Thursday. As usual: to be confirmed.

 

[Trident]

One thing's for sure: if Greece actually ends up getting Rafales and then fails to paint them in the Aegean Ghost pattern it will be a monumental tragedy!