AARGM / VFDR Missiles

bring_it_on said:
I'm struggling to see why the Army will pick it over integrating a similar capability on say the PrSM (which it is already doing to an extent)?
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Isn’t it a USN program? If so the containers might be intended for USVs.
 
I doubt Mk135. Tomahawk's booster is designed around the volume constraints of that round, PrSM's not anywhere near as close to maxxing out a VLS cell and doesn't need to make that compromise when other options are available.
 
The best way to take PrSM into a maritime environment is via the Palletized field artillery launcher that has a 2 pod x 4PrSM magazine. It can be put on the amphibs and probably also the LCS. The SM-61B, IR-CPS etc would be the best VLS options.
 
We should really sort things out in this topic zoo of types
 
sferrin said:
Looks like a waste of money. PrsM would do the ground launch mission better and cheaper.
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How exactly? Considering it dosnt (nor is there any plans to be as far as I can find) have a anti radiation payload, frankly I bet creating a hole new anti radiation payload would cost about the same as turning AARGM land based.

Also do we know the range and speed of this? Because I'm kinda dubious on wikipedias claim of mach 4 and 300km.
 
Cjc said:
Also do we know the range and speed of this? Because I'm kinda dubious on wikipedias claim of mach 4 and 300km.
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It's a claim repeated in official videos. Here it specifies 'more than double' the range of AARGM. It's a 1,000lb missile.

defence24.com

AARGM for Poland in Two Phases?

Ministry of National Defence (MOND) plans acquisition of AARGM anti-radiation missiles for F-16 fighters, most probably also – their modernized version – for the new generation ”Harpy” program fighter jets. Acquisition of this type of armament could possibly be completed in two phases. This...
defence24.com defence24.com

Also, referring back to Ronny's post, that's likely conservative.


1661106722087.png
 
Except AARGM-ER is not an airbreather...

While those graphs are great for illustrating qualitatively the differences between rocket and ramjet propulsion in general, I think they may be slightly optimistic for this specific case. The SRM baselined here seems to be a boost-glide type, as opposed to boost-sustain or dual-pulse that I'd expect in a long-range ARM.
 
Trident said:
Except AARGM-ER is not an airbreather...
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Says here that it is.

en.wikipedia.org

AGM-88 HARM - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org

The Navy's FY 2016 budget included funding for an extended range AARGM-ER that uses the existing guidance system and warhead of the AGM-88E with a solid integrated rocket-ramjet to double the range.[28]
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www.navyrecognition.com

US Navy completes first captive carry flight test of Advanced Anti-Radiation Guided Missile on F/A-18 Super Hornet fighter

U.S. Navy completed the first captive carry flight test of an Advanced Anti-Radiation Guided Missile – Extended Range (AARGM-ER) missile on an F/A-18 Super Hornet
www.navyrecognition.com www.navyrecognition.com
 
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Ronny said:
Any suggestion on why the leading edge of AARGM-ER is eject able ? Doesn't that make the missile draggier when crusing?
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marauder2048 said:
I don't think they are ejectable just removable to allow the existing AARGM front-end to be mated to the new SRM.
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I just realized that the slide specifically explains this -- the front end (warhead and guidance) can be swapped for a telemetry package and flight termination system (TM/FTS). To do that, you need to be able to demount the guidance section, which entails removing those parts of the strake.
 
Passage from Iron Hand: Smashing the Enemy's Air Defenses by Anthony M. Thornborough, Frank B. Mormillo, Tony Cassanova, and Kevin Jackson. Space based ELINT/SIGINT cue, briefly mentions the ramjet designs.
 

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NASA said:
Passage from Iron Hand: Smashing the Enemy's Air Defenses by Anthony M. Thornborough, Frank B. Mormillo, Tony Cassanova, and Kevin Jackson. Space based ELINT/SIGINT cue, briefly mentions the ramjet designs.
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They were talking about one of these. The first was the original concept, directly referred to as "AARGM". The second appears AGM-88 sized but I think just to test a different propulsion setup.

AARGM2.jpg

today 2.jpg
 
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Forest Green said:
TomS said:
Second try, after my morning caffeine.

With a 21-inch booster (either Mk72 or Mk135), ARreS would have some ridiculous kinematics and possibly out-sticks PrSM. But with such a booster, it's bigger than PrSM, not smaller.
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Any more info on AReS or a thread?
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Must have been some thread rearranging at work.

Anyway, AReS is a proposed ground-launched AARGM derivative.

www.thedrive.com

Land-Based Strike Version Of Navy's Long-Range Air Defense Blasting Missile Breaks Cover

The Advanced Reactive Strike Missile will be able to hit targets on land and at sea and be fired from a launcher inside a shipping container.
www.thedrive.com www.thedrive.com
 
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TomS said:
Forest Green said:
Trident said:
Except AARGM-ER is not an airbreather...
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Says here that it is.
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That was 2016. If you read through this thread (especially around posts 90-110) you'll see that the final outcome in 2017 was a sole-source award for Orbital ATK's enlarged solid rocket motor design.

See the slide here especially, from 2019.
Post in thread 'AARGM / VFDR Missiles' https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/aargm-vfdr-missiles.3411/post-428258
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Jane's book: The upgrade would be based on a new solid-propellant rocket motor.
 
NASA said:
From a friend at SAS
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Thanks! Is the lower one their SiAW solution?

EDIT: ah, when I blew the pic up the captions are legible. "Maritime Strike"? And an air breather? Don't think there's any program for that. Maybe it is a HALO stand in but I don't see how that configuration would be hypersonic. Probably an internal project idea phishing for a sponser.
 
I assume there's a ventral fin on the lower one that is out of sight on this shot?
 
I suppose the next development for the AARGM-ER would be to replace its' rocket-motor with a VFDR?
 
sferrin said:
NMaude said:
I suppose the next development for the AARGM-ER would be to replace its' rocket-motor with a VFDR?
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See page one of this thread. They already looked at that and decided to pass.
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That was years ago so in the interim they may've changed their minds. The upgrade to VFDR propulsion IMO does make sense if you want to dramatically increase the range of the AARGM-ER but don't want to increase the size of the missile from its current configuration.
 
NASA said:
Update: apparently the bottom was NG's pitch for Navy's HALO, and it lost.
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Hard to picture how that object could host a scramjet. Perhaps they went with a ramjet solution. Hard to say without knowing the program requirements.
 
NASA said:
More images from elsewhere, was forced to pull down the original image I had posted above.
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Ah, thanks. From that angle and with that nozzle it looks like we're looking at an integral booster ramjet a la ASALM. Which honestly would be a pretty fearsome air launched carrier weapon, though perhaps only "hypersonic" at the highest throttle setting or else with range limitations. I think I read once that the "screaming eagle" program that seemed to exist, die, exist again, then die again didn't specify what the propulsion mechanism had to be so long as requirements were met. It might be that a ramjet only solution was technically acceptable even if it didn't win the competition. IMO, the hardest problem with HALO is that I don't see how the weapon can't have a hard 15' length limit for CV weapon elevators, which makes it a complicated stack to put together from a hypersonic point of view. It looks like Northrup went with a low risk, high speed ramjet rather than something more exotic - but that's just me just taking a stab in the dark looking at the model.
 
sferrin said:
NASA said:
More images from elsewhere, was forced to pull down the original image I had posted above.
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That HALO concept looks pretty slick. I wonder why it lost.
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Hopefully because the other solution was lower technical risk. Throwing a hypersonic together in the next 6-7 years is a tall order. Making it only 15' long is a taller one. Does this demo look like an integral rocket - ramjet to you? You have posted a lot about the ASALM.
 

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