XAC Y-20 Kunpeng

[ChuckAnderson]

Hi Everyone!

My apologies if this has been posted before here.

Has any more information come out on the AVIC-1 transport aircraft design from the PRC?

Chuck

 

[Apophenia]

Ah yes, I wonder how ex-Boeing Long Beach engineer Dongfan Chung is doing these days. ;D

There's some speculation around the internet on this Avic Defence transport (AVIC-I and AVIC-II have now merged). Some are just calling it 'Y-XX', other go out on a limb with 'Y-13'.

A wind tunnel model and cockpit section have been built. The consensus seems to be that the Avic design is slightly smaller than the C-17, perhaps with an IL-76 influence. Prototype powerplant is to the the WS-18 (D-30KP-2). production aircraft would be powered by a HBR turbofan derived from the FWS-10 by 603 Institute. Take-off weight is said to be in the range of 60t.

If produced, it will be interesting to see if the Y-XX wing resembled the Comac C919 LCA.

BTW, this design was begun by AVIC-I to rival the AVIC-II/Antonov ASTC proposal for a 4-turbofan derivative of the An-70. At one point, there was also mention of a 4-turbofan amphibian transport by AVIC-II.

 

[collins355]

This apparently is what it really looks like. To be revealed later in 2009.

 

[T-50]

the first two pics are shameless copycat's of the C-17! the last picture is in my opinion a original design.
Illadvise the Chinese to continue with the last design! I know they can do the job,and let the world know that they can also developing original own designs!

 

[Deino]

No, this last picture is also just a "what-if" or fan art published some months ago, but it may be a hint of how it could look like, if the rumours about a An-70-based design are true.

Anyway, at the moment, it looks more as if it is a "development" (??) of the Il-76 design and this news is from AVIC today:

AVIC: China’s largest home-made 200-tonne class air Lifter to emerge in December

November.05 (China Military News Reporting by Johnathan Weng) — Despite of the IL-76MD, China will demonstrate its indigenous 200-tonne class heavy military airlifter in the last month of 2009. This transporter is also the largest aircraft which China has ever made. Mr. Hu Xiaofeng, the General President of AVIC, unleashes this information on one media news press today.

Hu Xiaofeng says that the new military transporter will emerge as prototype aircraft, which is independently developed and manufactured by XAC (Xi’an Aircraft Industry Group). He also promises that the 80-tonne class C919 jet liner is being under production and will be delivered to COMAC (Commercial Aircraft Corporation of China).

China-Defense-Mashup has reported before that this military transport airfraft project was initiated before 3-4 years. Chinese Government has esteemed this project as “National Significant Project”. The Military department believes that the R&D on heavy airlifter should be based on the mature and reliable technologies, but its performance can approach the international advanced transport aircraft with Chinese independent innovative technologies.

It can be summarized that China’s future Military Heavy airlifter Prototype will be designed on Russia’s IL-76MD. But China’s airlift aircraft will has an expanded size and payload capacity, improved electronic devices, and even some concepts absorbed from C-17. For the Engine, China will probably use D-30 engines and then replace them by WS-18 or advanced 4 high-Bypass ratio turbofan engines developed from FWS-10.

The detailed information has been unavailable. Here is the previous specifications estimation. Some numbers may be incorrect.

Crew: 3
Payload Capacity: 60,000-65000 kg
Length: 49 m
Wingspan: 50 m
Height: 15 m
Wing area: 310 m2
Empty weight: 100,000 kg
Max takeoff weight: 220,000 kg
Power: 4×turbofans
Maximum speed: 750-800 km/h
Range: (with max payload) 4,400 km
Service ceiling: 13,000 m

For years, Xi’an Aircraft Industry Group has been absorbing foreign aviation technologies and QC(Quality Control) & QA(Quality assurance) measurements by industrial subcontracting with Boeing and Airbus. Meanwhile, AVIC is preparing the correspondent attached technological projects. Such as CARDC (China Aerodynamics Research & Development Center) has achieved breakthrough in “Turbofan Engine low-speed Simulating Testing Technologies” for Airlifter high bypass engine. Besides, in 2008 China’s research on Polyacrylonitrile (PAN) based carbon fibers will reach its milestone to produce high-performance aviation materials. PLA’s future heavy airlifter will realize the shrunk aircraft empty weight by CF Compound Material made fuselage and wings.

The strategic value of China’s heavy airlifter, is not only the great improvement PLA’s forces long distance projection, but also an air platform for China’s New concept Strategic Weapon System. A great conventional weapon gap between PLA and U.S. forces usually shrivels China leaders’ purpose of taking Taiwan back by forces. So Heads in China Government has been focusing on unconventional “Shashoujian” weapon system for strategic striking back.

On the media news press, Hu Xiaofeng also says that L-15 will participate this month’s Dubai Air show 2009. He tells that lots of foreign Air Force pilots have visited Aviation Industry Group for related test flight.

November.6 is the one year birthday of Re-grouped AVIC group.

So, let's sit and wait Deino

 

[Deino]

Regarding all the hype around those An-70-look alike CG's I would be very careful with all these judgements, to see the new Y-X or Y-20 as sometimes called "only" as an enlarged, turbofan-powered An-70-development.

As far as I remember correctly, we know this picture some long time and at first it appeared with some severe grammar-issues. All deemed it more or less an "interesting" Fan-art or what if, but suely not a realstic official artwork.

Now in this news-report exactly this CG is used and all guys cry "YES it is" ... the same artist is also known for several other more or less crude and not very realistic CGs of a H-6-look-alike Bomber, a J-8II-look-alike fighter and a J-10B ... all not very real !!

On the other side there are several reports, which expect the new 200t-transport more alike an Il-76-based or at least technologically based design.


Therefore ... I will just sit and wait for this - IMO biggest surprise of the year - that could only be topped by the PAK-FA's roll-out.

Deino

PS: As far as I know these are the only "official" leaked pictures of that model ....

 

[hesham]

Hi,

http://www.china-defense-mashup.com/wp-content/uploads/2009/11/newlifter1.jpg

 

[Triton]

Artist's impression of 200-ton Chinese Military Airlifter. This aircraft will be independently developed and manufactured by XAC (Xi’an Aircraft Industry Group) and is based on the Ilyushin IL-76.

Specifications (provisional)

Crew: 3
Payload Capacity: 60,000-65000 kg
Length: 49 m
Wingspan: 50 m
Height: 15 m
Wing area: 310 m2
Empty weight: 100,000 kg
Max takeoff weight: 220,000 kg
Power: 4×turbofans
Maximum speed: 750-800 km/h
Range: (with max payload) 4,400 km
Service ceiling: 13,000 m

"AVIC: China’s largest home-made 200-tonne class air Lifter to emerge in December" at Chinese Defense Mashup http://www.china-defense-mashup.com/?p=5394

 

[Triton]

Model of XAC (Xi’an Aircraft Industry Group) military airlifter. It has been speculated that this aircraft may be designated the Y-20.


Source:http://cnair.top81.cn/Il-76_Y-8X_H-6U.htm

 

[Triton]

Model identified as Y-20.

Source: Trimble, Stephen. "C-17 and A400M Had a Baby... in China" The Dew Line
http://www.flightglobal.com/blogs/the-dewline/2009/12/c-17-and-a400m-had-a-baby-in-c.html

 

[MC72]

Is very interesting transport aircraft
this new chinese transport aircraft, I agree with Deino , really is very similar to the AN-70 a little scale-up and with turbofans, that is in the way of the new chinese philosophy , coming from a previous existing projet ,gain fast experience and knowledge , for example, like the J-10 and the IAI-Lavi
The Avic Y-XX (Y-20) is bigger and wider of the IL-96 MD; If you think that generally this type of aircraft is designed to transport specific cargo, both heavy and sensitive, we should ask ourselves what kind of "special" weapons are considering transporting the Chinese? Shure, something bigger than a MBT!
Saludos
MC72

 

[blackstar]

There are significant differences, however. Note that the tail is entirely different.

 

[Deino]

Hmm ... honestly I don't think that this is the "real" epresentation of how the Y-XX might look like.

The latest info - and IMO most reliable - picture is this one ...

Deino

 

[Stargazer]

Is very interesting transport aircraft
this new chinese transport aircraft, I agree with Deino , really is very similar to the AN-70 a little scale-up and with turbofans, that is in the way of the new chinese philosophy , coming from a previous existing projet ,gain fast experience and knowledge , for example, like the J-10 and the IAI-Lavi
The Avic Y-XX (Y-20) is bigger and wider of the IL-96 MD; If you think that generally this type of aircraft is designed to transport specific cargo, both heavy and sensitive, we should ask ourselves what kind of "special" weapons are considering transporting the Chinese? Shure, something bigger than a MBT!
Saludos
MC72

Very nice profiling work, MC!

 

[foiling]

Hi MC72. Just to say that I love your artwork. I am a passionate collector of aircraft 3-views, especially giant aircraft, and your work is very impressive. Keep it up and best wishes. I hope to see many more of your masterpieces on this site.

 

[MC72]

Hi foiling,
Just before the great remodelling of all the site of Secretprojet, I had a problem in my account with the post and create new topics, now this problems was fix and now i can handling all the tools, and shure I will post several aircraft 3-view
Saludos
MC72

 

[Trident]

http://cnair.top81.cn/transport/Y-20.jpg
This model which closely resembles (apart from the winglets) the model in the opening post shows clear Il-76 heritage in the landing gear sponsons (the usual lateral ones on either side and two more on the bottom of the fuselage).

 

[Deino]

If true it would be not only the next mayor surprise but also a similar important step as the J-20 was one year ago:

Just found over there at the SDF:

Looks like 1.11.2012 would be for Large Transport.
rolling out 1.5/6 2012

Will see it very soon.

http://www.cannews.com.cn/v/html/news/201112/750.html

Since the 5./6. is already gone they were now speculation on the 8th or 9th.

He said he was told by XAC and chief designer of the large transport that they were trying to get a 5th or 6th roll out, and top military officials will be attending. It doesn't seem to be a set date, but should happen any day now. A good indication is when a couple of PLAAF 737s will land at XAC.

1月8日9：:00，颜良将举行Y20-001架结构装配交付仪式
Jan 8 at 0900 (which has passed) Structural assembly roll out, donno what does that mean, but IIRC when it was said about the Y-12 it was rolled out with nothing but its basic structure (fuselage, wings, tail), no electronics, engine pod, interior, or landing gear.

So lets hope a bit !!

Cheers, Deino

 

[Triton]

Artist's impression of Shaanxi Y-20.

Source:
http://www.asian-defence.net/2011_10_01_archive.html

 

[archipeppe]

Artist's impression of Shaanxi Y-20.

Source:
http://www.asian-defence.net/2011_10_01_archive.html

Definitely more C-17 than any Antonov derived project...

 

[Trident]

I don't know... the four engine, high wing layout is hardly patented or are you basing this on the T-tail with an inverse-taper fin? That makes probably 70% of the world's current airlifter projects C-17 copies (A400M, KC-390 - although that might then be a C-5 copy according to some CGIs, Il-214/MTA, XC-2 etc.). I can see at least as much Antonov (cockpit section with curved rather than planar windows) and Ilyushin (main landing gear fairings on the belly in addition to the sponsons) heritage in that image, quite apart from the very open question of how reliable it is in the first place.

Assuming for a moment that the picture is accurate, then I would argue that the aircraft owes far more to the Il-76 than anything else - a nose job and a re-shaped tail hardly outweigh the vast majority of the aircraft in between these two extremities.

 

[Deino]

Thsi is simply fan-art !

 

[Triton]

Thsi is simply fan-art !

Anything real found for the Shaanxi Y-20 lately?

 

[Deino]

Actually the most "real" thing is that image I posted a few posts above ...

 

[Deino]

Latest CG .... and in mind of the so far high reliability of his CG's maybe we can assume this to be the first realistic artist impression !?!?

Deino


[EDIT: bad HTML fixed to properly display images—Mod.]

 

[GTX]

Looks like a C-17 crossed with an Il-76

 

[chuck4]

That looks like fairly low bypass engines, not the sort one might expect on an efficient subsonic aircraft of second decade of twenty first century.

 

[Deino]

That looks like fairly low bypass engines, not the sort one might expect on an efficient subsonic aircraft of second decade of twenty first century.

Yeppp .. the prototype is said to be powered by four Solovjev D-30 as used in the Il-76 .... later it might look like this one !

 

[Deino]

.... nad as the projected AEW !

 

[Deino]

If one follows the latest reports, then the Y-20 began with its first taxi-tests on Friday 21.12.12 .... and since the CFTE at Xi'an is known for its tight security, images won't appear soon. Anyway this is reportedly from one who saw these tests ....

 

[chuck4]

Interesting if the first flights of a mere transport were kept under wraps, while first flights of j-20 and j-31 were done so as to give maximum unofficial visibility.

 

[Deino]

Merry Christmas from Xi'an ..... the Y-20 is out !!!

Cheers, Deino

 

[Antonio]

The Dragon seems unstoppable.

 

[famvburg]

Isn't that sketch from Maverick a copy of the first photo or vice-versa?

 

[Trident]

Nice Christmas present! Apart from the T-tail that does look a lot like the An-70 though - if that translates into a similar cargo hold cross section the only thing (barring unforeseen issues) that will prevent it from wiping the floor the warmed-over Il-476 is the engines and that may well be a temporary issue.
Is this the largest aircraft built in China so far?

 

[chuck4]

If the rumor of this plane being in the 200 ton max TOW class is true, then it would be by a large margine the heaviest domestically built aircraft yet flown in China. The previous record holder was probably the obscure Y-10 passenger jet prototype manufactured in the late 1970s, which would have been in the 100 tons Max TOW class.

The Chinese have announced that a high bypass turbofan based on the core of WS-10 has been developed for use in future transports. That probably means Y-20.

 

[sferrin]

Looks like an AN-70 with jets.

 

[chuck4]

It looks more like the C-17 than the An-70. The configuration of the nose, the fuselage hump for the wings and the tail are all far more similar to C-17 than the An-70.

 

[flateric]

Looks like an AN-70 with jets.

taking Antonov guys help into account...

 

[Bazinga]

This reminds me of the C-15 and C-17 powering. Looks to me this thing is underpowered. Unless the chinese have a very high T/W ratio or a very long runway.