SM-6 is not stealth but could be pod based (EWP, etc).
Having the SM-6 pod-based for external carriage would also mean it could be fitted the Mk-72 booster.
SM-6 is not stealth but could be pod based (EWP, etc).
You'll have to redesign and retest the whole thing once again.Having the SM-6 pod-based for external carriage would also mean it could be fitted the Mk-72 booster.
You'll have to redesign and retest the whole thing once again.
Same trouble that the assembly will have to survive a huge kick and pass separation trials again will resurface.
Well, much of trouble of new missile is this redesign and separation trials.I doubt that would be an insurmountable difficulty.
Well, much of trouble of new missile is this redesign and separation trials.
As per quellish there is an ongoing effort to complete external JASSM integration with B-21.
Range of the launching aircraft. External carriage messes up not just RCS but also drag.Why would JASSM be carried primarily internally and not externally.
Isn't the point of something like MACE to give the F-35 JASSM-like range capable of internal carriage? If that's what you want, and it is in the pipeline, then there's no real reason for a larger bay, heavier structure, more cost, etc.
Maybe, but I doubt a program built like that is survivable.No one knows if MACE is in the pipeline. Everyone is spitting in the dark. It was an RFI.
The 15 foot weapon elevator limits real, and I could easily see FA-XX being sized for that.
You mean MACE or a plane built around internal carriage of 15ft long weapons?Maybe, but I doubt a program built like that is survivable.
The latter.You mean MACE or a plane built around internal carriage of 15ft long weapons?
The latter.
You realize that's only about 30cm longer than what's getting stuffed into an F-35, right?The latter.
The context was about B-21 carrying external ordnance. It may be JASSM or LRSO for the B-21.On the B-1, not B-21, I believe.
Post in thread 'Northrop Grumman B-21 Raider (LRS-B)' https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/northrop-grumman-b-21-raider-lrs-b.25915/post-568058
Like on the F-35? A stealthy interdictor?Range of the launching aircraft. External carriage messes up not just RCS but also drag.
Keep going...You realize that's only about 30cm longer than what's getting stuffed into an F-35, right?
And the reverse: why wasn't the F-35 designed to receive such weapon? Mind you it was the Navy who demanded the 2000lbs bay capacity. CALF would've had a smaller bay in line with the F-35B. They could've asked for more but didn't.You realize that's only about 30cm longer than what's getting stuffed into an F-35, right?
Putting all your eggs in one basket when the upcoming administration is full of budget hawks. Is that a good idea? Musk will rip the Navy a new one.
There is a heck lot of difference between "way too fat, we could achieve this with a different approach" and "TFX run 2". I could see some overlap between certain CCA capabilities that would promote joint service fielding, but that's all.Hint: trying to run multiple overlapping aircraft programs for one service when the upcoming administration is full of budget hawks is really not a good idea - and will get your job pulled away and given to someone else.
The context was about B-21 carrying external ordnance. It may be JASSM or LRSO for the B-21.
So it's not "per quellish" as he didn't explicitly state which one will get it though by rule of grammar the B-1B was the intended subject, and not "JASSM" but "external munition" as originally stated for the B-21. I think that clears that up, but the point about external carriage remains valid.But the specific post was about the B-1B and the effort to fit it with external JASSM.
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B-1 Drops JASSM from External Pylon, Expanding Bomber Firepower | Air & Space Forces Magazine
A B-1B bomber dropped an inert AGM-158 missile from an external pylon on Dec. 4, marking the first time the bomber has demonstrated such a capability.www.airandspaceforces.com
I don't see a B-21 having external carriage it have zero interest, I return to NGAD subject not B-21.So it's not "per quellish" as he didn't explicitly state which one will get it though by rule of grammar the B-1B was the intended subject, and not "JASSM" but "external munition" as originally stated for the B-21. I think that clears that up, but the point about external carriage remains valid.
The idea was floated around by flateric and quellish. It is also highly relevant to the subject at hand: external weapon carriage on 6th gen manned fighters.I don't see a B-21 having external carriage it have zero interest, I return to NGAD subject not B-21.
It eliminate the advantage of stealth of the B-21.The idea was floated around by flateric and quellish. It is also highly relevant to the subject at hand: external weapon carriage on 6th gen manned fighters.
I maintain my belief that if the need arise, large, standoff payloads will be carried-and delivered-by specific magazine drones, even under hardpoints if necessary, and not the manned fighter. There is a great effort underway to build small, high performance weapons. At the very least, we can say with confidence that AIM-260 will not be a great divergence from AMRAAM in terms of dimensions (fancy word for:they're the same size).
No one knows if MACE is in the pipeline. Everyone is spitting in the dark. It was an RFI.
But when it comes to NGAD and FA-XX, we all need to realize that we are amateurs punching at shadows.
F/A-XX may be an uber strike platform ala ATA. They may also take advantage of the CCA revolution. Alot of UCAS research went into making VLO/XLO planforms. I believe the X-45 may have been a stealthier strike platform than Fat Amy.
The F/A-XX is the strike fighter component within the Next Generation Air Dominance (NGAD) Family of Systems (FoS). It is planned to replace the F/A-18E/F Super Hornet in the 2030s. Its specific capabilities and technologies are under development, however analysis shows it must have longer range and greater speed, incorporate passive and active sensor technology, and possess the capability to employ the longer-range weapons programmed for the future. As the Super Hornets are retired from service, a combination of F-35C and F/A-XX will provide Navy tactical fighter aircraft capability and capacity within the CVW. The advanced carrier-based power projection capabilities resident in F/A-XX will maintain CVN relevance in advanced threat environments.
Along with organic tanking, the MQ-25 will pave the way for unmanned air vehicles on the carrier
and manned and unmanned teaming (MUM-T) to extend strike range and enhance maneuverability.
As unmanned tanking capacity delivers, the manned tanker requirement decreases, making
additional service life and capacity available for strike fighter missions. Continued development
of MUM-T will enable information sharing across a distributed force, increasing survivability,
reducing risk to manned aircraft, and ensuring weapons capacity. Future unmanned air vehicles
with survivable planforms, sensors, and robust autonomy will find, fix, identify, track, engage, and
assess land, sea, and air targets. The NGAD FoS will include unmanned platforms with F/A-XX as the
quarterback. These manned and unmanned aircraft plus attritable assets will be employed across
domains to enable integrated kinetic and non-kinetic fires at tactically relevant ranges. As autonomy
and ML efforts mature, the appropriate mix of F/A-XX, manned and unmanned platforms will be
evaluated to ensure the most lethal and affordable CVW possible.
The requirements of the programs are not public.
We are guesstimating based on released statements and budget documents.
As far as i know ERAM and MACE were RFIs; perhaps I am mistaken. But if so, that’s rather far from a program of record. That said I would be surprised if at least one type of budget cruise missile was not adopted, given the number of options the industry seems to be developing for the anticipated market.
There are some people who would like to see the Navy build something big enough to hold 2 JASSM internally for long-range strike missions.
They'll eventually hang things under the MQ-25. They just didn't want to pay for it. Shame the Whales and Vikings all disappeared.If the weapon has a range of over 200 miles there is not much of a burning need to carry it internally.
Are you sure about that?
Focus, padawan.Like on the F-35? A stealthy interdictor?
Yeah, smart idea. Next you might as well have PCAs carry MOP and ARRW internally.
Unless your target is some 500 miles inside an A2AD bubble...If the weapon has a range of over 200 miles there is not much of a burning need to carry it internally.
I hope there was more in this analysis than the obvious point that there still needs to be manned fighters. If AF leadership was smart they would set the expectation that CCAs are an enabler for the manned component, not the other way around.
I'm confused. You keep talking about the A-12 and when you do I assume you are referencing the Grumman A-12. I've found the references on this forum to a larger bay than is specified n Wiki but I see no reference to them being longer than what would be considered a normal length for an aircraft.Focus, padawan.
I'm talking specifically about the FAXX, the USN plane. MOP and ARRW are Air Force Programs, Navy has not publicly indicated any interest in those. ARRW definitely will not fit a carrier weapons elevator. The MOP is 20ft long all by itself, so it won't fit on a carrier either.
One of the jobs of FAXX is going to be long range strike. That's why I'm expecting bays at least the size of the old A-12.
I suppose the JASSM XR variant gets you that additional range but I am in the camp of no internal carriage of JASSM. A better option would be the Andruil Barracuda 500 which is not as wide as a Mk84 but about the same length with a range of 500 miles. I expect Andruil could increase the width closer to Mk84 size and increase the range significantly. Barracuda maybe isn't as LO as the JASSM but would be a lot cheaper and far quicker to manufacture. That means the USN can build the F/A-XX bay around that 14 ft length which would match F-35.Unless your target is some 500 miles inside an A2AD bubble...