PWS,PZL & LWS Projects

[hesham]

Hi,

The PZL Foka was twin boom single seat lightweight fighter project and powered
by one pusher engine,it was abandoned in favour of PZL-45.

PWS Z-17 was single seat fighter project developed to replace PZL-7.

PWS Z-18 was single seat fighter project developed to replace PZL-11c.

 

[hesham]

Hi,

PWS Z-36 was single seat fighter project.

PWS Z-37 was two seat fighter developed from Z-36.

 

[lark]

PZL Foka was not a plane but an inverted 'V' engine.
Several variants of this engine with various power output were produced.

source : Polish Aircraft 1893-1939 - Jerzy B.Cynk- Putnam.London 1971

 

[Jemiba]

Just as in illustration for "PZL projects" and rare prototypes :
(from RAF Flying Review 12.59)

The "PZL dabrowskis fighter" was a light fighter derivative of
this designers light tourer from 1938.

 

[hesham]

Thank you my dears (lark & Jemiba),

and for PZL-45 when the PZL-44 was designed the next was a project
of twin boom single seat fighter powered with pusher engine,but later
abandoned in favour of the PZL-45 conventional design,as low wing
light weight fighter.

PWS Z-47 was two seat fighter/trainer project developed from Z-17 &
Z-18.
PWS Z-49 was two seat fighter/trainer project developed from Z-36 &
Z-37.

 

[hesham]

Hi,

PZL Zbik was twin engined two seat fighter/reconnaissance aircraft
project led to develope PZL-38 Wilk.

PZL project of 1936 ,it was also twin engined two seat reconnaissance/
observation aircraft.

 

[Nick Sumner]

Jemiba,

Does 'RAF Flying Review 12.59 have plan drawings and frontal elevations too? If not do you know where they could be found?

Is there an accompanying article? Is it any good?

 

[hesham]

Hi,

PZL Losos was single engined two seat medium bomber/reconnaissance aircarft project,
powered by Hispano-Suiza 12Z engine.

PZL Project from P.46 Sum,it was single engined two seat reconnaissance/bomber project,
powered by Bristol Hercules engine.

 

[smurf]

Nick S asks

Does 'RAF Flying Review 12.59 have plan drawings and frontal elevations too? If not do you know where they could be found?

Putnam's Polish Aircraft 1893 - 1939 by Jerzy Cynk has:
3-view of PZL Los with Mis as side view inset. No drawings (thrown into baker's oven by designers wife when Germans reached Warsaw!) but description says same basic structure as Los, Hercules or Gnome Rhone engines of 1400hp. Wing had streamlined fairings between trailing edge and rear fuselage removed. Fuselage longer, 46'11. Increased area tail generally similar to Los.

3-view of PZL P38 Wilk with P48 Lampart scratch side view.

PZL P62(?) Dabrowski's light fighter 3-view.

PZL P45 Sokol (Falcon) author's impression, with spatted undercarriage.
The PZL P45 Sokol of the RAF Flying review article is in the book (3-view) as the RWD 25 Sokol

Much description of these and others.

 

[Jemiba]

"Does 'RAF Flying Review 12.59 have plan drawings and frontal elevations too?"

Sorry, no, this article only features side views. There are several more of lesser
known types, like the P-46 Sum, PWS-33 Wyzek, LWS-3 Mewa, Nikol A-2
(at least not known to me ...!) and a data table for these types.

 

[hesham]

My dear Jemiba,

for PZL-46 see;http://avia.russian.ee/air/poland/pzl-46.php
for PWS-33 see;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/PWS-33_Wy%C5%BCe%C5%82
for LWS-3 see;http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/LWS-3_Mewa
for Nikol A-2 see;http://www.answers.com/topic/nikol-a-2

 

[lark]

The Sokól - Falcon- fighters were with three of them...

P.Z.L. P.45
P.W.S.41
and
RWD 25

They all were under development in the late 30' but events overtook the development.
There's an excellent article by Jerzy B.Cynck in Air Pictorial , Oktober 1963
with side and plan wiews of these projects.

 

[hesham]

Hi,

A very strange thing that the LWS-1 was re-allocated to a project of single seat
low wing fighter,which was taken over by PZL as P.39,the LWS-1 was originally
the continues to produce Lubin R.XX aircraft.

 

[lark]

Hesham,
What is the source of your reply # 12 reply ?
As far as I know, all the designs you mention are two engined.
What is the designation of the single seater you showed us in side view?
Thanks.

 

[hesham]

My dear lark,

Please get my special message.

Anther project to PZL was Woik two seat fighter.

 

[lark]

Picture for the LWS 1/PZL-39 is very hazy.
Designation changed several times as well as the configuration of the design.
Maybe one of the Polish members can set more light on this subject ?

 

[hesham]

Hi,

The PZL P.33 single seat fighter project,in two different drawings,
and the last with a very strange retractable landing gear.

 

[hesham]

Hi,

I know that topic for PWS and PZL,but that is a project to Lubin,
the R.XXB was intended to compete PZL P.30B & P.37.

 

[Szymon]

Hey

I'm from Poland and I interesting polish plane projects before war, projects not finished because war begins - Polish Air Force 1940 -> something like Luftwaffe 1946 . I make some 3D renders this projects, rest of them is under construction.



PZL 38 Wilk (Wolf) - double seat pursuit fighter with Foka (Seal) engines. Foka engine is Nowokuński construction, powerfull (420 HP) but light weight (280kg) and has a small front section.

Arming: front 20mm FK wz. 38D and two machine guns KM 7,9 mm PWU. Shooter has two machine gins KM 7,9mm PWU on hydraulic yoke hidden with guns in hulk when she was not used, and shooter cocpit was closed. One PWU 300kg thrown bomb on frame in diver flight (similarly how in IAR-81).

Spread: 11.05 m
Length: 8.35 m
Height: 2.50 m
Surface: 20.4 m2
Total weight: 2155 kg
Useful weight: 645 kg
Maximum Weight: 2800 kg
Maximum Speed : 465 km/h
Cruise Speed : 360 km/h
Speed minimal: 120 km/h
Raising: 8 m/s
Ceiling: 9000 m
Range: 850 km
Waste of fuels: 220 l/h

Only one flying copy exiss. On Paris Air Show in 38 Wilk is a model with Foka engines, flying tests made in ranger engines because Foka has to small power. This copy take over by Germans like war thropy, and burnt in air raid in museum in Berlin.

Old render in Rhino3D (new render under construction)
http://republika.pl/szymonkot/P38Wilk.jpg

PZL 48 Lampart (Leopard) - Development of PZL 38 Wilk with two Gnome-Rhome 14M07 "Mars" (730 HP) , larger and with no slots. Nowokuński died in Tatra mountains in 1939 and not finish Foka engine his successors be able to to finish up engine. Command of aviation decided to apply different engines on fuselage, choice fell on GR Mars, which were wanted to apply in LWS-3 Mewa (Seagull).Two version were foreseen pursuit and assault.

Arming A version : front two 20mm FK wz. 38D and two machine guns KM 7,9 mm PWU. Shooter has two machine guns KM 7,9mm PWU on hydraulic yoke hidden with guns in hulk when she was not used, and shooter cocpit was closed. One PWU 300kg thrown bomb on frame in diver flight (similarly how in IAR-81).

Arming B version : front eight machine guns KM 7,9 mm PWU. Shooter has two machine guns KM 7,9mm PWU on hydraulic yoke hidden with guns in hulk when she was not used, and shooter cocpit was closed. One PWU 300kg thrown bomb on frame in diver flight (similarly how in IAR-81).

Spread: 11.50 m
Length: 8.70 m
Height: 2.50 m
Surface: 21.5 m2
Total weight: 2400 kg
Useful weight: 1100 kg
Maximum Weight: 3500 kg
Maximum Speed : 560 km/h
Speed minimal: 130 km/h
Raising: 9 m/s
Ceiling: 10000 m
Range: 1500 km

Plane exist only in plans.

Old render in Rhino3D (new render under construction)
http://republika.pl/szymonkot/P48LampartA.jpg


PZL 54 Rys (Wildcat) - Development of PZL 48 Lampart with two Hispano-Suiza 12L (1200-1600HP).

Arming : front two 20mm FK wz. 38D and two machine guns KM 7,9 mm PWU. Shooter has two machine guns KM 7,9mm PWU on hydraulic yoke hidden with guns in hulk when she was not used, and shooter cocpit was closed. One PWU 300kg thrown bomb on frame in diver flight (similarly how in IAR-81).

Spread: 11.50 m
Length: 8.70 m
Height: 2.50 m
Surface: 21.5 m2
Maximum Speed : 640km/h

Plane exist only in plans.


PZL 50 Jastrzab (Hawk) - Successor of PZL P.11.All in metal construction, with Bristol Mercury (850HP) engine. In construction similar to Seversky P-35.Best aerodynamical but he had weak engine

Arming : 4 km 7,9 mm wz. 36. Two in hulk, two in external parts of wing and 100kg of bombs.

Spread: 9,70 m
Length: 7,70 m
Height: 2.70 m
Surface: 19 m2
Total weight: 1900 kg
Useful weight: 500 kg
Maximum Weight: 2400 kg
Maximum Speed : 480 km/h
Cruise Speed : 375 km/h
Range: 750 km

Only one copy of plane exist in flight tests but in september 1939 was shoot down by own AAA.

Old render in Rhino3D (new render under construction)
http://republika.pl/szymonkot/P50Jastrzab.jpg

Soon more infos and renders PZL P.62, RWD-25 and RWD-22

 

[hesham]

Hi syzmon,

Can I ask you about the PZL P.52 ,I rote that it was also called
Rys as single seat fighter project, is that right ?.

 

[Szymon]

Rys i codename of PZL 54 project, development of Wilk/Lampart with Hispano-Suiza engines. I search my data for PZL P.52 later, maybe i found some infos.

PZL P.62 (no codename) - project of Dabrowski figter with Hispano-Suiza engine (Dabrowski was project PZL P.37 Los). Metal one seat fighter. Its only project but very nice aerodynamical

Arming: One 20mm FK cannon shoot by the engine, and 8 (or 6 by the other sources) 7,9mm type PWU 36 machine guns in wings (other sources - 6 in wings, 2 over the engine)

Spread: 11,00 m
Lenght: 8,50 m
Height: 3,86 m
Surface 19,00
Total weight: 2000 kg
max weight: 3250 kg
Max speed: 640-660 km/h
Range: 800 km

Old renders:
http://republika.pl/szymonkot/PZL-62.jpg
http://republika.pl/szymonkot/PZL-62_2.jpg

New renders:
http://republika.pl/szymonkot/PZL_P.62.jpg
http://republika.pl/szymonkot/PZL_P.62_2.jpg

 

[Szymon]

Hi syzmon,

Can I ask you about the PZL P.52 ,I rote that it was also called
Rys as single seat fighter project, is that right ?.

I didnt found closer info about PZL P.52 but P.50 is Jastrzab, P.54 i Rys (development od Wilk/Lampart with Hispano Suiza Engines), P.56 Kania is development of P.50 Jastrzab with Hispano-suiza engine. If ministry of Aviation announced competition this individual air - institutions onto some airplane it marked (PZL, RWD, PWS, LWD) some constructional offices to study of different answering conception order of ministry of Aviation, thus P.52 PZL of relate preliminary project can be internal sign of P.54 Rys of different office depression then this which won internal competition or sign of development P.50 Jastrzab. In my notes I have passed, that in view of problems P.50 from tight turning and raising two versions were considered from short and long wing, so sign P.52 can be sign of version P.50 with longer wing.

 

[Szymon]

This is very nice project of PWS-46 (or PWS-60 - he has two numbers). It's a concept of Ciolkosz : heavy fighter , bomber/attack plane and recon plane. Two G&R engines in twin tail concept plane with two cocpits and two pilots, or pilot and nawigator/bombardier. It's project from 1939 and looks similar like Twin-Mustang.

Arment: 2 or 4 - 7,9 mm PWU 36 machine guns in central wing section and 1000 kg of bombs.

http://republika.pl/szymonkot/PWS-46.jpg

 

[shinblam]

PZL P.56 Kania and P.63

Howdy again. Today I'm looking for information and history on a couple of projects from PZL, the P.56 Kania and the P.63. Now the only site I could find decent information on either was www.powiat.mielec.pl, but there is one problem, I can't read Polish.

From what I could gather from the sight was that the P.56 was a fighter project from 1939 and was powered by a single Hipano-Suiza 12Y, and the P.63 was another single seat fighter project from 1939 powered by "Jeden silnik gwiazdowy, o mocy 883-1177 kW (1200-1600 KM)." and was armed with 4-6 7.9mm machine guns and 2 20mm cannons. Again, your help is appreciated.

 

[Apophenia]

Re: PZL P.56 Kania and P.63

More Polish pages and a machine translator

http://www.poltran.com/

PZL.56 Kania

http://www.samoloty.ow.pl/str360.htm
http://awiacja.republika.pl/pzl2.htm#PZL.56 [Dead link]
-- http://web.archive.org/web/20110722051346/http://awiacja.republika.pl/pzl2.htm
http://pl.wikipedia.org/wiki/PZL.56_Kania

PZL.63

http://www.samoloty.ow.pl/str003k7.htm (scroll to bottom)
http://www.samoloty.ow.pl/str087.htm

 

[shinblam]

Re: PZL P.56 Kania and P.63

Thanks for the info Apoph. There doesn't seem to be much info floating around on the P.63.

Another request: any drawings or diagrams of the P.53( a redesigned and up-engined P.50) and/or P.63?

thanks

 

[Apophenia]

Re: PZL P.56 Kania and P.63

Edited for confusion! I'm not actually innumerate, just muddled ... :-[

 

[joncarrfarrelly]

Re: PZL P.56 Kania and P.63

According to 'Polish Aircraft 1893-1939' by Jerzy B. Cynk, the P.56 'Kania' designation was assigned to a reworked, Hispano 12Z powered P.50 Jastrzab. The book lists no P.63, the closest thing is what is refered to as P.Z.L. 'Dabrowski's Fighter Project (P.62?)' for an aircraft also to be powered by a Hispano 12Z as a competitive proposal to the P.56. The aerodynamic design was based on a light touring aircraft that Dabrowski had designed in 1938 for his personal use, the tourer was largely modelled on the P.Z.L. 26 Challenge tourer. As to designation, to quote Cynk; "There is reason to believe that the designation P.62 was applied to the fighter, although reliable information is lacking and Dabrowski himself has not been able to confirm this."

The book includes an 3-view and an impression of the aircraft by Cynk, both of which were based on Dabrowski's sketches.
The side-view in the link posted earlier is from the 3-view in the Cynk book, a is the grayscale image of the aircraft, and the linked 3-view is a reworking of the Cynk 3-view. The drawing is provisional and, as stated, is based on Dabrowski's sketches and recollections. The book was published in 1971, so perhaps something more definitive has come to light in the interim.

Post-war Dabrowski worked on a trainer aircraft with Percival Aircraft called the Gazelle, like the P.62(?) this was also based on the general lines of his 1938 tourer. The RAF did not buy the Gazelle and Dabrowski moved to Folland where he worked on the wing design for the supersonic Gnat project. After Folland he moved to the US where he worked for Cessna, Stanley Aviation and from May 1959 until his death in September 1967, Boeing.

Jon

 

[Szymon]

Re: PZL P.56 Kania and P.63

Shinblam look this:

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,1471.0.html

PZL-63 - incorrect plane number, see PZL-53 "Jastrzab" II.

PZL-53 "Jastrzab" II (attention: met in older publications sign PZL-63 is incorrect !) - single-engine one-seat figter plane, being further evolution of airplane PZL-50 "Jastrzab" with radiale engine of large power (probably type Bristol "Hercules" II or III, Bristol "Taurus" II or III, Gnôme - Rhône 14N-21 or PZL "Waran"). Only project.

Pzl-56 "Kania" - single-engine one-seat fighter plane. Developmental version of airplane PZL-50 "Jastrzab" with piston engine of type Hispano-Suiza 12Y-51 i/lub 12Z. Only project.

Its draw of P-56:
http://szymonkot.republika.pl/1.jpg

PS: Translation of names -> Jastrzab in english is Hawk, Kania is Kite.

 

[Dominik]

To find interesting drawings of Jastrzab, you shoul visit:
http://www.airart3d.ovh.org/html/gallery.htm
There you can find the latest, although, according to some people, not very accurate 3d drawings.
Another site, where you can find Jastrząb is: http://www.dws.xip.pl/wojna/rzeczB.html (click "Lotnictwo i obrona przeciwlotnicza and and you will find link to the article on Jastrząb.
AFAIK there wasn't such project as PZL 52. There was PZL 53 though. It was developed version of Jastrząb, so called Jastrzab II with redesigned wings, aft fuselage and more powerful engine.

 

[airman]

please visit also : http://www.samoloty.ow.pl/ , you will find more about polish projects ! :

 

[Justo Miranda]

Please see attached some stuff from my publication UNKNOWN!-1
Drawings SOURCE GRADING 4

 

[SlickDriver]

Szymon,

Do you have anything on the PZL.46A Sum or PZL.49 Miś bombers?

 

[Justo Miranda]

Szymon,

Do you have anything on the PZL.46A Sum or PZL.49 Miś bombers?

No, I have only fighters

 

[airman]

sign in your preferites this link:
http://www.powiat.mielec.pl/poser/samoloty/rws/index.htm

http://www.powiat.mielec.pl/poser/samoloty/pzl/pzl56.htm ( pzl 56)

http://www.powiat.mielec.pl/poser/samoloty/pzl/pzl62.htm (pzl 62)

ok, site are in polish language, but i suppose like me i could be understand the primary technical data ! ;D

 

[Dominik]

IMHO www.samoloty.ow.pl is much better, although there are still some Polish aircraft to describe.
http://www.samoloty.ow.pl/str250.htm (article on Miś)
http://www.samoloty.ow.pl/str087.htm (article on PZL 62 aka 55).

Sum was the successor of Karas. It had semi-monocoque fuselage, fixed undercarriage, cantilever twin rudder. The engine was Bristol Pegasus XX.
It could carry 600 kg bombs and 7 machine guns.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y177/Piterski/Pzl-46%20Sum/Sum-21.jpg

 

[Dominik]

Recently I've found a new site with some Polish aircraft graphics and animations.
http://bdf2005.republika.pl/html/galeria.html (especially RWD-25, PZL-45 Sokół, PZL-50 Jastrząb and PZL P.11g Kobuz)
http://pl.youtube.com/watch?v=thFecaq-dfk
The second is PZL 38 Wilk animation. Really neat, although some errors might be found.

Regards

 

[hesham]

Hi,

here is the Z-17.

 

[airman]

IMHO www.samoloty.ow.pl is much better, although there are still some Polish aircraft to describe.
http://www.samoloty.ow.pl/str250.htm (article on Miś)
http://www.samoloty.ow.pl/str087.htm (article on PZL 62 aka 55).

Sum was the successor of Karas. It had semi-monocoque fuselage, fixed undercarriage, cantilever twin rudder. The engine was Bristol Pegasus XX.
It could carry 600 kg bombs and 7 machine guns.
http://i5.photobucket.com/albums/y177/Piterski/Pzl-46%20Sum/Sum-21.jpg

yes, you are right, infact is one of my preferites !

 

[airman]

a little present for you : on Aerei nella storia of Febbraio - Marzo 2010 ( February - March 2010) there was an article about Pzl P.50 and images that reprents a P.24 with a low wings ,various variants of P.50 and P.56 !
I have scanned and saved in pdf