Prüfstand XII: submarine launched V-2 rockets

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To confirm what? That a chamical weapon could cause some panic, even with a small warhead?
Chemical weapon must be dispersed properly. Which isn't exactly very simple. Since Germany did not have workable proximity fuze, releasing chemical agents before impact was out of question, so essentially the warhead would just splash the chemicals around at the moment of impact. Not a very efficient way; basically you would have a toxic puddle inside the (small) crater and hardly anything more.

To my knowledge, there has never been an attempt to use chemical weapons during WW2. It would have been logic, to start with the V2 Rocket in some closer destinations than the US, so the missing proximity fuse is not the key point of the story. If the German scientist could built the V2 (A4) rockets, they could have found a way to develop a proximity fuse. It’s said, that Hitler never liked chemical weapons because of WWI (but had no moralic problems with gas poisoning millions...) or nuclear weapons (because of the "Jewish" physics).

Carrying this huge device over the Atlantic at a time, when German subs were lost in great numbers just for a minor bang isn’t worth the effort. It seams like, most German leaders saw it the same way, so that that thing has never been built.
 
If the German scientist could built the V2 (A4) rockets, they could have found a way to develop a proximity fuse.
They had a number of proximity fuses in development, they were just very very late. On the other hand, such a big missile as a chemical A 4 (which had its huge warhead located pretty at the back, between the tank section and the engine), would have required something more than a regular proximity fuse, triggering the warhead at least a couple of times higher.
 
To my knowledge, there has never been an attempt to use chemical weapons during WW2
Not exactly true: Nazi used tear gas against defenders of Kerch quarries in 1942, claiming that it is theoretically-nonlethal (of course, in underground tunnels with poor ventilation it WAS very lethal). Germans tried to claim that it doesnt happened, but all survivors mention gas attacks.
 
If the German scientist could built the V2 (A4) rockets, they could have found a way to develop a proximity fuse
German scientists of Nazi era were a sorry bunch of mistrusted academicians, with severe delusions of grandeur, who constantly bickered with each other for prestige and power. They weren't even protected from draft. Nazi leadership distrusted scientific methods, they believed in "brilliant insight of Aryan superman". In electronic, Germans were pretty much hopeless. Even Hungary (one of electronic giants of 1930s, actually) have better ideas than them
 
Not so sure about that, Germany already had guided Weapons like Fritz-X, a clever rocket guiding system in the V2, acoustic guided torpedos and some more interesting stuff. The allied radar system was better than the German one, but Radar systems were high tech most countries had nothing like that (Hungary?)
 
Germany already had guided Weapons like Fritz-X,
On stolen French control system, yeah. "Great" achievement.

acoustic guided torpedos
US fielded acoustic torpedoes the same time - and US actually created anti-submarine acoustic torpedo, much more complex (because it need to home in 3D, while anti-shipping torpedo need only the 2D homing)

but Radar systems were high tech most countries had nothing like that (Hungary?)
Hungary in 1941-1944 essentially developed all the basic radar designs (after Germans refused to sell them their radars): long-range early warning, conical scan gun-laying, conical scan fighter guidance, and lobe switching aerial intercept fighter-based radars.
 
There is no evidance, that any know how from France was stolen for Fritz-x, other than a suspicion by the French (see here in the forum) . The development started before WW2 and is well documentated. Many ideas were developed in parallel, same is true for the radar system.

So you agree that Hungary started developing a radar system after the Germans allready had one in use? Doesn't sound like a leading pioneer.

The German "Geier" Torpedo could also operate in 3 domensions and against subs, it even used its own signal/echo for orientation, so that accoustic counter devices (Foxer) became obsolete.

The Allied had much bigger recources, much more people involved in developing, no interuption (in the US) by bombing, this should be well considered when comparing the archievments in electronics.
 
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There is no evidance, that any know how from France was stolen for Fritz-x, other than a suspicion by the French (see here in the forum) . The development started before WW2 and is well documentated. Many ideas were developed in parallel, same is true for the radar system.
I tended to side with French here. The reasons:

* French engineers, who worked on radio-controlled bomb (BHT-38) before war, since 1943 worked on jamming of German system, and claimed that it is very similar to their pre-war efforts.

* Germans were absolutely unable to develope ANY other radio control system at all. Even when it became obvious, that K-S is efficiently jammed, no new system was suggested at all.

The German "Geier" Torpedo could also operate in 3 domensions and against subs, it even used its own signal/echo for orientation, so that accoustic counter devices (Foxer) became obsolete.
Yeah, problem is, that they never fielded one. Both US and Britain worked on active sonic torpedo also, by the way. In fact, Britain was the first who actually suggested such design.
 
I've seen a webside (forgott the name, maybe I will find it again) from a guy who recovered in detail how Fritz-X worked and how it was developed. As said, the Germans also worked on it before the war. There have been a lot of obstacles and it took years to turn it into a usefull weapon. There was absolutly no indication of any french influence and France never had an operational glide bomb.

The German Zaunkönig and even the Geier Torpedos were fielded (The Geier almost at the end of the war). The Geier war an active sonic Torpedo which was fielded, not only worked at, like the allied counterpart.

Britan certainly never sugested this design to the Germans....
 
On stolen French control system, yeah. "Great" achievement.



That the Germans had stolen and copied the BHT system (knowing that the BHT was not at the top). Is there a bibliographic trace, a book, an article or a proven reference site where this was mentioned or is it a speculative inference? I ask that just in case I have to use this info elsewhere, I would like it to be supported by a source.
 
That the Germans had stolen and copied the BHT system (knowing that the BHT was not at the top). Is there a bibliographic trace, a book, an article or a proven reference site where this was mentioned or is it a speculative inference?
Well, it is mentioned or implied in following sources:

* The True Beginnings of French Aeronautics 1938-1959 (Part I) - Philippe Jung, AAS History Series, Vol.28 (2007)
* Articles de Philippe Jung dans Pégase N°115-116-117 sur l'Aéronautique française repliée à Cannes pendant la guerre
* Les dossiers secrets de la marine: Londres-Vichy 1940-1944

Unfortunately, I did not remember where exactly.
 
Mentioned or implied doesn’t mean that it really happened. The history of engineering is full of stories of stolen ideas, but in most cases, it was just “convergent evolution”. The development of the Fritz-x took quite a while, so even if the German developers knew about the French developments, it didn’t help a lot.

The jet engine, the radar system (which was first invented and tested in 1904 by Christian Hülsmeyer and later forgotten) and many other things were invented more than once.
 
Mentioned or implied doesn’t mean that it really happened. The history of engineering is full of stories of stolen ideas, but in most cases, it was just “convergent evolution”. The development of the Fritz-x took quite a while, so even if the German developers knew about the French developments, it didn’t help a lot.
Well, Germans were well-known for lifting other ideas from those they invaded - Goliath tracked mine, for example - so it's plausible. And it's explain pretty good why Germans were unable to use anything else, after K-S was jammed.
 
That the Germans had stolen and copied the BHT system (knowing that the BHT was not at the top). Is there a bibliographic trace, a book, an article or a proven reference site where this was mentioned or is it a speculative inference?
Well, it is mentioned or implied in following sources:

* The True Beginnings of French Aeronautics 1938-1959 (Part I) - Philippe Jung, AAS History Series, Vol.28 (2007)
* Articles de Philippe Jung dans Pégase N°115-116-117 sur l'Aéronautique française repliée à Cannes pendant la guerre
* Les dossiers secrets de la marine: Londres-Vichy 1940-1944

Unfortunately, I did not remember where exactly.
I will read them again to confirm the info.
 
I linked to a thread on another board where I already went through this with Pellas et. al., possibly even you, and demolished this nonsense. Why should I do it again when it's there to be read?

You "demolished" nothing and you barely read any of the sources cited, nor did you bother to assess or respond to most of them, nor stop to consider their provenance, content or authenticity. But, thanks for linking to the prior discussion so that others may judge for themselves what you did and did not manage to "demolish".
 
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I linked to a thread on another board where I already went through this with Pellas et. al., possibly even you, and demolished this nonsense. Why should I do it again when it's there to be read?

You "demolished" nothing and you barely read any of the sources cited, nor did you bother to assess or respond to most of them, nor stop to consider their provenance, content or authenticity. But, thanks for linking to the prior discussion so that others may judge for themselves what you did and did not manage to "demolish".
You were part of that other discussion and got your proverbial buttocks handed to you in it. For those interested, this is the thread I'm referring to, and you can read starting on about page 69 of it the exchange Mr. Pellas had with me and others.


I'll let the board members decide who did and said what on this topic, rather than rehash old ground.
 
During the 1960s, Americans studied various Cold War plans against the Soviets. One of these projects was the Sunrise program, which planned the placement of underwater containers with nuclear missiles in the territorial waters of NATO countries. cont.jpg
 
To confirm what? That a chamical weapon could cause some panic, even with a small warhead?
Chemical weapon must be dispersed properly. Which isn't exactly very simple. Since Germany did not have workable proximity fuze, releasing chemical agents before impact was out of question, so essentially the warhead would just splash the chemicals around at the moment of impact. Not a very efficient way; basically you would have a toxic puddle inside the (small) crater and hardly anything more.

To my knowledge, there has never been an attempt to use chemical weapons during WW2. It would have been logic, to start with the V2 Rocket in some closer destinations than the US, so the missing proximity fuse is not the key point of the story. If the German scientist could built the V2 (A4) rockets, they could have found a way to develop a proximity fuse. It’s said, that Hitler never liked chemical weapons because of WWI (but had no moralic problems with gas poisoning millions...) or nuclear weapons (because of the "Jewish" physics).

Carrying this huge device over the Atlantic at a time, when German subs were lost in great numbers just for a minor bang isn’t worth the effort. It seams like, most German leaders saw it the same way, so that that thing has never been built.
There were many attempts to use WMD's in all three of the major categories we know today: chemical, biological, and nuclear.

The majority of these were in the form of Japanese bioweapon munitions that were developed by the sinister and macabre superlab on the Asian mainland, Unit 731. Numerous attacks, which certainly numbered in the dozens and may have numbered in the hundreds, were carried out against Chinese soldiers and especially civilians. There were also at least two (2) attempts to use biological agents against American forces in the Pacific War, and two other missions---including a seaborne strike with bubonic plague against the US city of San Diego---were planned but canceled for various reasons. Total casualties are not known with any real accuracy but estimates range from 50,000 to 500,000 dead.




Japanese chemical weapons were produced by the hundreds of thousands and were used often against Chinese forces in the field through at least 1943. Again, thousands were killed, though perhaps not as many as died at the hands of Unit 731. Gigantic stockpiles of bombs and shells were simply thrown into rivers and other bodies of water or else plowed under with bulldozers at war's end, and in recent years some of these have corroded to the point that they are leaking. Some Chinese civilians have been sickened and there are claims that a few have died, though I have not been able to verify the latter. Japanese chemical specialists have spent considerable time in recent years doing cleanup of their WWII chemical munitions in China.



1000.jpeg

Germany is said in some sources to have used chemical weapons on a small scale during the siege of Sevastopol in 1941. In addition, it is known that a German bioweapons lab under the direction of Kurt Blome (and with the enthusiastic support of nuclear physicist Erich Schumann at the German Army Weapons Bureau) maintained a technical liaison with Unit 731 throughout the war years. Schumann wanted German biological agents to be used for destroying crops in the United States, but while a number of diseases were weaponized, as far as is known, no attacks were actually mounted.

The British and Americans also developed lethal biological weapons under the auspices of Operation Vegetarian. Anthrax bombs were tested on Gruinard Island, which was so horribly contaminated as a result that it was off limits for more than 50 years after the war.


Thus far, the only nuclear attacks known and documented to occur were the US bombings of the Japanese cities of Hiroshima and Nagasaki. There is at least one (1) known MAGIC document (American SIGINT intercept and decrypt of a Japanese transmission) which alleges the use of some kind of German nuclear weapon against the Russians on the eastern front, and I have encountered rumors of nuclear weapons---battlefield nukes if they existed at all---supposedly used in Pomerania late in the war. There are German sources which state that a last gasp strike with a handful of tactical nuclear weapons was planned for the western front in early April, 1945, in the vicinity of the Luneberger Heide, where a known German underground nuclear weapons facility of some kind was located. If this is accurate, a known subsequent Luftwaffe mutiny might be the explanation for why this mission was never carried out.
 
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There is at least one (1) known MAGIC document (American SIGINT intercept and decrypt of a Japanese transmission) which alleges the use of some kind of German nuclear weapon against the Russians on the eastern front,

Since there is absolutely no mention about it in any Russian sources (and use of new "wunderwaffe" would be a major concern, which would certainly be reported to Stalin, discussed on the top, and scientific elite would also be informed to provide consultation), it quite obviously just rumors.

and I have encountered rumors of nuclear weapons---battlefield nukes if they existed at all---supposedly used in Pomerania late in the war.

Again, there is zero even rumors about it in Soviet sources. Which quite obviously means that nothing like that ever happened.

in the vicinity of the Luneberger Heide, where a known German underground nuclear weapons facility of some kind was located.
What "known facility"?
 
Since there is absolutely no mention about it in any Russian sources (and use of new "wunderwaffe" would be a major concern, which would certainly be reported to Stalin, discussed on the top, and scientific elite would also be informed to provide consultation), it quite obviously just rumors.

You don't pop off a nuke without people noticing, even years later. Anything resembling a first generation fission device would be filthy as hell and would leave a patter of radioactive rubbish that would be detectable for some years.
 
Since szukający has already posted a link to Dr. Rider's book, I will add a link to his "German Atomic Bomb Slides" here:


Here are a few parts of Forgotten Creators which describe wartime German work on nuclear weapons and guided missiles---including submarine-launched variants---that were intended to deliver them against targets in the US mainland and elsewhere throughout Allied territory.

Page 4309:

"There is considerable evidence that fission bombs were successfully tested during the war (Sections D.2.5, D.2.6, and D.2.7), and that a hydrogen bomb was nearing completion when the war ended (Section D.2.4). Given the enormous amount of resources that would have been invested in developing nuclear weapons, and Germany’s desperate state late in the war, there must have been concrete plans and methods for delivering such weapons to Allied targets, including targets in the United States. In the usual German fashion, several different delivery methods, including aircraft and large missiles, were probably developed in parallel....

There is significant evidence that Germany was developing the following specific methods to deliver weapons of mass destruction (especially nuclear weapons) to Allied targets such as New York and Washington, D.C.:

1. There is documentary evidence for intercontinental bomber aircraft, and for nuclear weapons designed to be dropped by such aircraft (often dropped with a parachute, indicating that the expected blast was so large that the aircraft needed more time to escape to a safe distance after dropping the bomb). See for example: Postwar Allied discoveries of intercontinental jet bombers intended to attack the United States (Section E.2.1) Erwin Respondek (p. 3247) Werner Grothmann (pp. 3298 and 3384) Edmund Tilley (p. 3335)

2. There is documentary evidence that V-1 cruise missiles were modified to attack the United States with a payload sufficiently destructive to justify the mission. There were several different versions of the V-1 that could be ground-launched, submarine-launched, or air-launched from a large aircraft, and that were either unmanned or manned. See for example: Allied discoveries of piloted and air-launched V-1 missiles (p. 1695) Interrogation of Edmund Sorg regarding nuclear-armed V-1 missiles (pp. 3648–3649) Hans Kammler’s 23 April 1945 telegram ordering the destruction of special V-1s near Berlin to prevent them from being captured by Russian forces (p. 3649) Allied intelligence reports on submarine-launched V-1 missiles intended to attack the United States (pp. 4119–4126)

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Page 4121:

Clayton Bissell and Hewlett Thebaud to the Joint Chiefs of Staff. 9 December 1944. Subject: Agreed Joint Evaluation of the Possible Existence of the V-3 Rocket and Probability of Attack against the U.S. [Franklin Delano Roosevelt Library, Hyde Park, New York. Map Room Files, Box 164, Folder Naval Aides. Files: A/16—General Correspondence]

1. The cable from Lieutenant Commander Earle, Naval Attach´e, Turkey is probably propaganda and represents a plant by the Germans. There is no reliable information available of German development of a long range rocket other than the V-2.

2. The V-3 may possibly be a rocket of smaller dimensions than the V-2 with a shorter range. It would be possible to launch such a missile from specially designed or modified submarines. Attached is a sketch of a German submarine based in a southern Norwegian port showing a pair of rails extending from conning tower to the bow and terminating at a flat, rectangular surface. The purpose of this is unknown.

3. German attack from Europe of United States cities by long range rockets is deemed impossible now. Small rocket or flying bomb attacks from specially constructed submarines are considered possible. Any such action would be made with propaganda effect rather than material damage as the primary objective.

Page 4123:

Clayton Bissell to Stockholm Military Attache. 3 November 1944. Outgoing Cable WAR 56799. [Franklin Delano Roosevelt Library, Hyde Park, New York. Map Room Files, Box 49, Folder Rocket Bombs 1944]

Have been advised through OSS that Tykander their representative in Stockholm has received reliable information that German U boats are equipped with bomb launching platforms. Investigate and keep us fully informed.

Page 4124:

U-Boat Aimed V-Bomb Here, Army Paper Says. New York Times. 15 May 1945 p. 10.

A German submarine tried to V-bomb New York last election day, presumably with a jet-propelled or rocket-propelled weapon, the Army newspaper Stars and Stripes reported tonight, quoting “sources considered reliable.” It was reported that the bomb was launched from the deck of a U-boat lying off the coast and that it fell short or was knocked down by fighter planes patrolling as a screen against any such projectiles.
The Stars and Stripes said that “operators” at Mitchel Field were quoted as having said that it was determined that the bomb fell into the sea. The paper recalled that last Nov. 8, the day after the Presidential election, the Army and Navy in a joint statement said that a V-bomb attack on the United States was entirely possible. A Navy spokesman in Washington said that the report of the submarine attack was without foundation, The United Press reported. An official of the bomb squad of New York’s Police Department said last night that the squad had no knowledge of an attempted bombing of New York last Nov. 7 by the Germans. “Undoubtedly, if a robot bomb had been launched at New York from a U-boat, as reported, and had neared its objective, we would have been informed,” the spokesman said.

[Dr. Rider: "The original version of this story appeared as: U-Boat Aimed V-Bomb at New York, Stars and Stripes, 14 May 1945. Considering that the report came from the U.S. Army’s own newspaper and sources that they considered reliable, the subsequent denials by the U.S. Navy spokesman and New York bomb squad do not seem very convincing. If the incident actually occurred, can it be clarified if the weapon was a sub-launched V-1 cruise missile or something else? If the weapon fell into the sea, was it ever located? Was the warhead a conventional explosive, or a chemical, biological, or nuclear weapon? A V-1 strike on a U.S. city with only a conventional warhead would have done relatively little damage and would have had no strategic military value. For evidence of modified V-1 missiles that could have delivered weapons of mass destruction, see pp. 1695 and 3648–3649, as well as Henshall 2000, pp. 129–130."]

Page 4125:

Robot Bomb Attacks Here Held ‘Probable’ by Admiral. New York Times, 9 January 1945, pp. 1, 6. AN EAST COAST PORT, Jan. 8

A strategically futile attack on New York or Washington by robot bombs within thirty to sixty days was described today as not only “possible but probable” by Admiral Jonas H. Ingram, new Commander in Chief of the Atlantic Fleet, whose command stretches from the Arctic to the Falkland Islands. [...] “And we know very definitely that there are three ways in which he might get robot bombs within range of either city. He might sneak a half dozen submarines off the coast. He might launch robots from the long-range planes we know he has. Or he might sneak a surface ship, disguised as a neutral, within range.” [...] [See also: Officials Silent on Robot Threat/London Paper Predicts Attack. New York Times, 10 January 1945, p. 7.

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There are plenty of other intelligence reports and additional documents in Forgotten Creators that describe the German effort to develop submarine-launched guided missiles. As I stated above, intelligence such as you see here is what led to USN preparations to destroy any u-boats so armed should they be detected in time. PS Nearly all US files at NARA relating to the kriegsmarine nuclear scientist Otto Haxel remain classified and totally off limits to the public to this day. Why?
OMG! Not this crap again... We went through this same nonsense over on the Axis History board...
It's not a post on the atomic bomb, it's about V2, and this forum is called a secret project forum...
 
From posting guidelines V11:
Posts on alien UFOs, speculative Nazi wunderwaffen/flying saucers/atomic bombs, general conspiracy theories, alien crashes, moon landing denial and the like are specifically discouraged and would be better posted elsewhere.

So please don't pollute the forum arguing with trolls (or worse) promoting such crackpottery.
 
You don't pop off a nuke without people noticing, even years later. Anything resembling a first generation fission device would be filthy as hell and would leave a patter of radioactive rubbish that would be detectable for some years.
Exactly. Considering how interested USSR was in atomic research - such anomalous spot would be causing attention for sure, and there would be tons of reports, analysis and samples in archives.
 
You don't pop off a nuke without people noticing, even years later. Anything resembling a first generation fission device would be filthy as hell and would leave a patter of radioactive rubbish that would be detectable for some years.
Exactly. Considering how interested USSR was in atomic research - such anomalous spot would be causing attention for sure, and there would be tons of reports, analysis and samples in archives.

Not to mention a crater lined with radioactive green glass surrounded by a forest that got carbonized. Or a strange place that had been mysteriously dug up in a massive civil engineering project and then filled in with a million tons of cement. I can't seem to recall any such places, though.
 
Not to mention a crater lined with radioactive green glass surrounded by a forest that got carbonized. Or a strange place that had been mysteriously dug up in a massive civil engineering project and then filled in with a million tons of cement. I can't seem to recall any such places, though.
In pure theory we could speculate about mythical German nuke being tested underwater on sufficient depth :), but its extremely hard to invent the justification...
 
"Exactly. Considering how interested USSR was in atomic research - such anomalous spot would be causing attention for sure, and there would be tons of reports, analysis and samples in archives"

And that exactly happened... Here is a pointer to the "tons of reports.." Article was published in 2000. by Russian scientist, for nonproliferation.org.
There is especially interesting story how Gustav Hertz repaired gasseous diffusion plant which was located in "Kefirstadt" .. Or how Beria himself "kindly" asked von Ardenne to build a bomb for USSR.
 

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Not to mention a crater lined with radioactive green glass surrounded by a forest that got carbonized. Or a strange place that had been mysteriously dug up in a massive civil engineering project and then filled in with a million tons of cement. I can't seem to recall any such places, though.
In pure theory we could speculate about mythical German nuke being tested underwater on sufficient depth :), but its extremely hard to invent the justification...

Naw, naw. Underwater testing? That's just unnecessary speculation. We can all agree that what really happened is that the Nazis got Rasputin to use his red mercury-powered Die Glocke open a stargate to the domain of the Ogdru Jahad and tested their first generation naquadah-enhanced quantum torpedo on the other side. Obvious, really.
 
If the German scientist could built the V2 (A4) rockets, they could have found a way to develop a proximity fuse
German scientists of Nazi era were a sorry bunch of mistrusted academicians, with severe delusions of grandeur, who constantly bickered with each other for prestige and power. They weren't even protected from draft. Nazi leadership distrusted scientific methods, they believed in "brilliant insight of Aryan superman". In electronic, Germans were pretty much hopeless. Even Hungary (one of electronic giants of 1930s, actually) have better ideas than them
This could be a bit wrong, some credit is due regarding the first electronic analog computer.
Here is a link with a fascinating technical story


The article is written by
James E. Tomayko, a well known technology historian. The article itself is free to download, 16Mb
More on this first ever electronic computer is to be found on cdvandt.org
https://www.cdvandt.org/v2__computer.htm
This computer, a "mischgerat", was actually V2 best kept secret.. It could be said, to, for his author, Helmut Hölzer - a silent, humble genius. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Helmut_Hölzer
 
Since there is absolutely no mention about it in any Russian sources (and use of new "wunderwaffe" would be a major concern, which would certainly be reported to Stalin, discussed on the top, and scientific elite would also be informed to provide consultation), it quite obviously just rumors.

You don't pop off a nuke without people noticing, even years later. Anything resembling a first generation fission device would be filthy as hell and would leave a patter of radioactive rubbish that would be detectable for some years.
For a complete info on Soviet interest in German nuclear prigramme you could consult the work of Reiner Karlsch, historian and author of "Hitler bombe", in German language or Todd Rider.
Soviets were truly "invested" in it, during a war, and especially post war.
 
And that exactly happened... Here is a pointer to the "tons of reports.." Article was published in 2000. by Russian scientist, for nonproliferation.org.
You obviously did not read the article. There is no confirmation of any kind of German nuclear test. Just that Soviet scientists investigated the scale of German nuclear project, and - as well as Americans - overestimated initially its scale.
 

Germany is said in some sources to have used chemical weapons on a small scale during the siege of Sevastopol in 1941. In addition, it is known that a German bioweapons lab under the direction of Kurt Blome (and with the enthusiastic support of nuclear physicist Erich Schumann at the German Army Weapons Bureau) maintained a technical liaison with Unit 731 throughout the war years. Schumann wanted German biological agents to be used for destroying crops in the United States, but while a number of diseases were weaponized, as far as is known, no attacks were actually mounted.
I have to say, that in Germany we tend to neglect the WW2 in the Pacific. Chemical weapons (some say it was just tear gas) didn’t play a role in the European theatre. It was also quite clear, that if Germany used chemical weapons, the counterstrike would be devastading.

There are so many rumours about German nuclear bombs and there was definitely some activity, but Germany was far away from having a usable bomb. It didn’t have a high priority because it was clear, that these bombs would have come to late to win the war. Also, as said, it is believed that Hitler didn’t like the whole “Jewish” physics behind it and most of the best German Physicians like Heisenberg weren’t very keen on working on it (or they already left the country).
 
Have any photographs of such towed containers ever been published or any allied reports based upon evaluation of same ?

cheers, Joe
 
"Exactly. Considering how interested USSR was in atomic research - such anomalous spot would be causing attention for sure, and there would be tons of reports, analysis and samples in archives"

And that exactly happened... Here is a pointer to the "tons of reports.." Article was published in 2000. by Russian scientist, for nonproliferation.org.
There is especially interesting story how Gustav Hertz repaired gasseous diffusion plant which was located in "Kefirstadt" .. Or how Beria himself "kindly" asked von Ardenne to build a bomb for USSR.
Ivan, that paper by the Soviet era scientist, Pavel Oleynikov, is a very important piece of the historiography of nuclear weapons. Thank you for mentioning it. Regarding guided missiles, I read recently that there was apparently an effort spearheaded by General Electric to build a more or less direct copy of the V-2 for use in the Pacific, but as far as I know this did not make much progress prior to the end of the war. Both the Soviet R-1 / SS-1 and the American "Redstone" missile, which appeared shortly after the conflict, were direct derivatives of the wartime German V-2 / A-4.

In terms of cruise missiles, the US actually reverse-engineered V-1's during WWII itself and was tooling up to manufacture enormous numbers of the American version, the JB-2 "Loon" or "Thunderbug". These were to have been used by the thousands in the pre-invasion bombardment of Japan ahead of Operation OLYMPIC, the amphibious landing on Kyushu, the southernmost of the Home Islands. By the fall of 1945, according to Allen and Polmar's Code Name Downfall, it was planned to fire 500 of them every day at targets in Japan. The JB-2's radio guidance would have been superior to the original German models, which relied on a functional but comparatively primitive gyroscope.

The following link goes to the paper, "JB-2: AMERICA’S FIRST CRUISE MISSILE", by Gary Francis Quigg.

 
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It's not a post on the atomic bomb, it's about V2, and this forum is called a secret project forum...
That thread I linked to veered off into the V2 and other delivery systems for a nuclear weapon, along with some totally insane stuff about a German ICBM and ICBM silos around page 77 and on. It is all relevant to this thread, and I see no reason to repeat all of that a second time when it's already been discussed somewhere else that is readily accessible to board members.
 
From posting guidelines V11:
Posts on alien UFOs, speculative Nazi wunderwaffen/flying saucers/atomic bombs, general conspiracy theories, alien crashes, moon landing denial and the like are specifically discouraged and would be better posted elsewhere.

So please don't pollute the forum arguing with trolls (or worse) promoting such crackpottery.

You know what? When actual documents surface, and they have, this rule stays in place? The British still have classified documents that have gone beyond the 50 and 75 year rule. Perhaps when they are released and published in The Guardian, people might say: Well, they did have this and that. For example, the British did locate a hidden German atomic installation as mentioned in T-Force by Sean Longden.
 
It's not a post on the atomic bomb, it's about V2, and this forum is called a secret project forum...
That thread I linked to veered off into the V2 and other delivery systems for a nuclear weapon, along with some totally insane stuff about a German ICBM and ICBM silos around page 77 and on. It is all relevant to this thread, and I see no reason to repeat all of that a second time when it's already been discussed somewhere else that is readily accessible to board members.

Woo wooo wooo. Carry on sir. It's people like you who do no research that advance... uh... nothing.

:)
 
It's not a post on the atomic bomb, it's about V2, and this forum is called a secret project forum...
That thread I linked to veered off into the V2 and other delivery systems for a nuclear weapon, along with some totally insane stuff about a German ICBM and ICBM silos around page 77 and on. It is all relevant to this thread, and I see no reason to repeat all of that a second time when it's already been discussed somewhere else that is readily accessible to board members.

Woo wooo wooo. Carry on sir. It's people like you who do no research that advance... uh... nothing.

:)
I (and others) did it once in the linked thread, if you'd bother to peruse it, but I'm not doing it a second time here when you can go there and read it for yourself.
 
Keeping in mind the admonishments of the moderators here and with no desire to get kicked off this site, I will reply privately to Dilandu's question.
 
Writeup with a promise of more: http://up-ship.com/blog/?p=5728

prufstand-xii.jpg
There are several obvious--and serious--issues with this:

First, how do you stabilize it during launch? In anything other than calm seas, a rarity in the open Atlantic, having the canister pitching about during firing would be a serious issue. If the missile on launch were free of the container, it pitching would invariably result in a collision between the container and the missile with the resulting exploding missile as it hits the container walls.

Second, how is the LOX produced. You won't be able to store it for a cross-Atlantic voyage. That means you need a LOX plant on the sub or the canister to make it. This in turn requires power and time. It would be hours involved in making LOX and fueling the missile. Substituting storable propellants--solid or liquid--would require a complete redesign of the missile's fuel system and engine.

How is the operations room, and other systems like pumps and the like on this canister powered? There is no indication of how that would occur.

How many crew / technicians does the missile require? Where do they stay during the voyage?

If the crew / technicians are on the sub, how do they gain access to the container to operate it? This could be a very hazardous operation on its own in open ocean.

The devil is always in the details, and this project seems rather short on details...
 
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