Potential New "Secret Projects" books

[Justo Miranda]

'Any idiot can give stuff away, it needs a professional to make money.'

Mike Brewer ?

 

[Hobbes]

New book proposal

Fighters of the early Cold War

-...

With the large number of types you list, the book would only have room for a few pages per type. Generally, books that do this only have the space for a superficial treatment: leading particulars, brief summary of the development history, notable uses.

What's the added value of such a book over just printing the Wikipedia entries for each type? I.e. What specifically would you want to see in such a book?

 

[Justo Miranda]

New book proposal

Fighters of the early Cold War

-...

With the large number of types you list, the book would only have room for a few pages per type. Generally, books that do this only have the space for a superficial treatment: leading particulars, brief summary of the development history, notable uses.

What's the added value of such a book over just printing the Wikipedia entries for each type? I.e. What specifically would you want to see in such a book?

In my opinion about 170,000 words and 217 pages of pen & ink scale drawings

 

[Hobbes]

groan...

what would this book contain that isn't already well-known?

 

[Justo Miranda]

groan...

what would this book contain that isn't already well-known?

Miranda drawings

 

[gatoraptor]

groan...

what would this book contain that isn't already well-known?

Miranda drawings

Which, to my mind, would make it very worthwhile. Comparison drawings of similar types might be useful.

 

[edwest4]

Partly for sure, but not smart to show a book as available to purchase within two weeks when they were obviously well aware that it was not even in the hands of the printers. Times are certainly difficult but not every error can be attributed automatically to Covid.

According to my sources, the situation of the British publishing industry is quite worrying.

Despite the Government aid, at least one of the largest wholesalers has defaulted on its payment of the distributors and they are on stop. Their survival is very much in doubt, consequence of a sizeable bad debt.... Retailers and wholesalers returned all the stock that they could possibly dispense with to reduce their exposure.

I got interested in economics many years ago when a motorcycle salesman told me 'Any idiot can give stuff away, it needs a professional to make money.' The harsh reality is that a lot of UK Companies are run by idiots whose only ability is self-promotion, when one company in a sector is performing much better than another the only factor that applies is how it is run. In the first comment it seems that there is always an external factor that can be rolled out to 'explain' the latest shortcoming. This indicates poor management both by failing to reorganise to cope with the steady stream of 'issues', and taking their customers for granted. This isn't just in publishing it's endemic in UK businesses.
The second comment is another facet of the same issue. Rather than have explored alternative ways of getting stock sold the easy knee-jerk option of returning stock, not paying your bills, and completely failing to anticipate disruption in an increasingly fragile infrastructure is going to see a lot of companies struggle to survive.

This sounds harsh, but it's nothing like as harsh as the business these people operate in, by choice. In my time I've made several profitable investments by simply looking at the basics of a company's annual report. In one case the share price is about 10% of the 1989 price, that's in uncorrected numbers for inflation and AFTER the stock market crash. Against this the Directors and shareholders have seen ever increasing incomes financed by company assets being sold off (and thus enabling tax avoidance on a huge scale) and rented back. Insanity.

BOT there are a huge number of Secret Project volumes possible. However I'd suggest that including some that are available in model-kit form in each volume would be a good move. The more obscure subjects could be produced in book form as the excellent 'The Secret Horsepower Race' from Morton's. Keep print run realistic so those that are interested will have an incentive to buy when available rather than wait for discounted books to become available. This reinforces beneficial behavior and deters activities that harm the producer.

As a final thought it may be worth looking at popular subjects in the massively popular on-line games for subjects that may have a larger interest. A lot of players have developed a keen interest in the vehicles in these games having started on first person shooter games and matured as they grew up.

"Keep print run realistic..."? Amazon spent many years doing one thing: Convincing people that they deserved a discount on books. Once that pattern was set, they began offering consumer goods other than books. Mr. Bezos, the head of Amazon, is now worth around 150 billion dollars, US.

Speculators abound on the internet. They hope that individuals will pay 300 dollars and more for books that have sold out. Does this harm the producer? Yes, but no honest producer would charge such sales dampening prices. One book recently came back into print that was reportedly going for 1,000 dollars US on the so-called "secondary market." Price gouging is nothing new. It does happen.

Influencing consumer behavior is at the heart of advertising. There are companies that do nothing else but monitor consumer trends. Unfortunately for them, the only consumer trend for most is declining incomes relative to expenses.

I have been in book publishing for almost 40 years. Management problems are not the only problems. And managing the current environment has been handled well by my employer. However, another trend in the US is debt financing; my term. Some start their companies with no money and with the assumption that they will succeeed. Most companies do not. That was true before the internet. Some analysts are concerned about this but this money is coming from somewhere.

 

[edwest4]

New book proposal

Fighters of the early Cold War

-...

With the large number of types you list, the book would only have room for a few pages per type. Generally, books that do this only have the space for a superficial treatment: leading particulars, brief summary of the development history, notable uses.

What's the added value of such a book over just printing the Wikipedia entries for each type? I.e. What specifically would you want to see in such a book?

Wikipedia? Seriously? As a professional researcher, I may use it from time to time as a starting point, but as a primary source? Never.

 

[Hobbes]

misunderstandings abound again. The point I was trying to make: based on the long list of types Justo wants to include in his book, he only has room for the most basic of information on each type, information the likes of which is readily available.
So I asked: what about his book would make it better than Wikipedia-level info. He gave a good answer (new artwork).

 

[SleeperService2]

'Any idiot can give stuff away, it needs a professional to make money.'

Mike Brewer ?

No. Mick Harding Haverhill BMW, Suffolk August 1982.

 

[SleeperService2]

"Keep print run realistic..."? Amazon spent many years doing one thing: Convincing people that they deserved a discount on books. Once that pattern was set, they began offering consumer goods other than books. Mr. Bezos, the head of Amazon, is now worth around 150 billion dollars, US.

Speculators abound on the internet. They hope that individuals will pay 300 dollars and more for books that have sold out. Does this harm the producer? Yes, but no honest producer would charge such sales dampening prices. One book recently came back into print that was reportedly going for 1,000 dollars US on the so-called "secondary market." Price gouging is nothing new. It does happen.

Influencing consumer behavior is at the heart of advertising. There are companies that do nothing else but monitor consumer trends. Unfortunately for them, the only consumer trend for most is declining incomes relative to expenses.

I have been in book publishing for almost 40 years. Management problems are not the only problems. And managing the current environment has been handled well by my employer. However, another trend in the US is debt financing; my term. Some start their companies with no money and with the assumption that they will succeeed. Most companies do not. That was true before the internet. Some analysts are concerned about this but this money is coming from somewhere.

I think we are fundamentally in agreement on this. Amazon's success can be attributed to two things; aggressive tax avoidance and employment policies, the second you cover at the end. Where is the money coming from? Believe it or not it is literally produced out of thin air based on the assumption the Lending Bank will make good on the default, after 2008 a very dangerous assumption. So Ed West Inc goes to the bank to borrow 1 million bucks to set up a new concern. As his corner shop has done well the bank lends the money at a suitable (for the bank) interest. The loan is 10 year term at 20% interest per annum. Ed West Inc is OK with this as they believe their product will enjoy very high margins. Assuming all goes well in 10 years the bank will have had the capital plus about 2.75 million profit. They also make money because this 2.75 million 'future profit' can be marked as an asset for the bank and then used to either generate more loans or get into leveraged dealing. If they do this enough we rerun 2008 again, profits have been taken but the losses are paid by the general population. That last bit is why some worry as the next crash will be at least an order of magnitude bigger than 2008 and too big to fix.
Going back to my poor management comments. If a business needs to trick people into believing their products are best by advertising then it is because they haven't kept ahead of the competition or something better has come along to replace it. Management failing in both cases. A good example is Reckitt Benckiser and Gaviscon. For years the company suppressed research that looked into the causes of ulcers as every ulcer patient brought the stuff week in, week out. RB got idle and thought they'd have an easy life for ever. Enter Barry Marshall and Robin Warren who proved ulcers were bacterial, could be treated with common medication and whoops there goes RB stock. The pair got the 2005 Nobel Prize for that.

 

[Hood]

To get back on topic, I think we need more First World War project books. There is a massive number of unbuilt and experimental developments that could fill numerous tomes.
I'd even buy an interwar projects book, but I suspect the bigger market would be WW1 (assuming not everyone is a Spitfire fanboy).

 

[Schneiderman]

To get back on topic, I think we need more First World War project books. There is a massive number of unbuilt and experimental developments that could fill numerous tomes.
I'd even buy an interwar projects book, but I suspect the bigger market would be WW1 (assuming not everyone is a Spitfire fanboy).

At least for British aircraft companies I suspect that the largest untapped period for as-yet 'unknown' projects is the inter-war years. But I would say that, I guess, as that is very much my area of interest.

 

[Justo Miranda]

BOT there are a huge number of Secret Project volumes possible. However I'd suggest that including some that are available in model-kit form in each volume would be a good move. The more obscure subjects could be produced in book form as the excellent 'The Secret Horsepower Race' from Morton's. Keep print run realistic so those that are interested will have an incentive to buy when available rather than wait for discounted books to become available. This reinforces beneficial behavior and deters activities that harm the producer.

As a final thought it may be worth looking at popular subjects in the massively popular on-line games for subjects that may have a larger interest. A lot of players have developed a keen interest in the vehicles in these games having started on first person shooter games and matured as they grew up.

I agree

 

[Bing]

BOT there are a huge number of Secret Project volumes possible. However I'd suggest that including some that are available in model-kit form in each volume would be a good move. The more obscure subjects could be produced in book form as the excellent 'The Secret Horsepower Race' from Morton's. Keep print run realistic so those that are interested will have an incentive to buy when available rather than wait for discounted books to become available. This reinforces beneficial behavior and deters activities that harm the producer.

As a final thought it may be worth looking at popular subjects in the massively popular on-line games for subjects that may have a larger interest. A lot of players have developed a keen interest in the vehicles in these games having started on first person shooter games and matured as they grew up.

I agree

Having been playing World of Tanks (and to an extent War Thunder) I would LOVE to see a book published on any of the tanks, possibly with Wargaming's (or Gaijin's) co-operation. Especially if it uses the official renders!
I know this sounds naive, and I have no idea whether they would have any interest, or if anyone here would write it, but it would be pretty awesome to see some of the great in-game work in a book.

 

[Jason Dykstra (Wyvern)]

That isn't a bad idea, I know Wargaming sponsors videos made by The Chieftain and I remember a while back when I was an avid player of WoT Blitz, that they used to make their own historical videos. Obviously, a book is quite different to a video, but, if the game developers and marketing teams understand their audience, then the book will definitely do well. Obviously, the book cannot be marketing for the game, but, if done properly, it could work well, providing valuable information to both the wargaming community, and the historical enthusiasts, who wouldn't necessarily be interested in the game itself. This might also bring players who weren't once interested in history, into the historical community, thus helping other authors, museums, etc.

I personally think it is a good idea, and that more authors should look into this.

 

[Bing]

That isn't a bad idea, I know Wargaming sponsors videos made by The Chieftain and I remember a while back when I was an avid player of WoT Blitz, that they used to make their own historical videos. Obviously, a book is quite different to a video, but, if the game developers and marketing teams understand their audience, then the book will definitely do well. Obviously, the book cannot be marketing for the game, but, if done properly, it could work well, providing valuable information to both the wargaming community, and the historical enthusiasts, who wouldn't necessarily be interested in the game itself. This might also bring players who weren't once interested in history, into the historical community, thus helping other authors, museums, etc.

I personally think it is a good idea, and that more authors should look into this.

The only problem is the language barrier, I belive they have already written a book, but it is in Russian and I cannot even work out what the title is.
Marketing is no issue, they have a YouTube channel with 136 thousand subscribers in the UK, and I'm sure people would be interested in a basic overview/historical run through of the tech trees, maybe seperate 'manuals' for each country/type etc. Anyway, it is worth someone getting in touch with them to see if they are interested.

Rafe

 

[newsdeskdan]

That isn't a bad idea, I know Wargaming sponsors videos made by The Chieftain and I remember a while back when I was an avid player of WoT Blitz, that they used to make their own historical videos. Obviously, a book is quite different to a video, but, if the game developers and marketing teams understand their audience, then the book will definitely do well. Obviously, the book cannot be marketing for the game, but, if done properly, it could work well, providing valuable information to both the wargaming community, and the historical enthusiasts, who wouldn't necessarily be interested in the game itself. This might also bring players who weren't once interested in history, into the historical community, thus helping other authors, museums, etc.

I personally think it is a good idea, and that more authors should look into this.

The only problem is the language barrier, I belive they have already written a book, but it is in Russian and I cannot even work out what the title is.
Marketing is no issue, they have a YouTube channel with 136 thousand subscribers in the UK, and I'm sure people would be interested in a basic overview/historical run through of the tech trees, maybe seperate 'manuals' for each country/type etc. Anyway, it is worth someone getting in touch with them to see if they are interested.

Rafe

There is already the World of Tanks Roll Out - Commander's Guide hardback from 2016 and PC Gamer did a 'bookazine' with Wargaming a few years ago called World of Tanks Your Definitive Guide. I think the latter most closely meets your requirement - it profiles 53 different tanks - but I don't believe either did especially well at retail. The former is easy to get hold of while the PC Gamer one is practically impossible to find now.

 

[Jason Dykstra (Wyvern)]

That isn't a bad idea, I know Wargaming sponsors videos made by The Chieftain and I remember a while back when I was an avid player of WoT Blitz, that they used to make their own historical videos. Obviously, a book is quite different to a video, but, if the game developers and marketing teams understand their audience, then the book will definitely do well. Obviously, the book cannot be marketing for the game, but, if done properly, it could work well, providing valuable information to both the wargaming community, and the historical enthusiasts, who wouldn't necessarily be interested in the game itself. This might also bring players who weren't once interested in history, into the historical community, thus helping other authors, museums, etc.

I personally think it is a good idea, and that more authors should look into this.

The only problem is the language barrier, I belive they have already written a book, but it is in Russian and I cannot even work out what the title is.
Marketing is no issue, they have a YouTube channel with 136 thousand subscribers in the UK, and I'm sure people would be interested in a basic overview/historical run through of the tech trees, maybe seperate 'manuals' for each country/type etc. Anyway, it is worth someone getting in touch with them to see if they are interested.

Rafe

There is already the World of Tanks Roll Out - Commander's Guide hardback from 2016 and PC Gamer did a 'bookazine' with Wargaming a few years ago called World of Tanks Your Definitive Guide. I think the latter most closely meets your requirement - it profiles 53 different tanks - but I don't believe either did especially well at retail. The former is easy to get hold of while the PC Gamer one is practically impossible to find now.

I think that neither sold particularly well as they were written for a specific community; the gaming community, their own in particular. However, if the book is sponsored in part by the game developers, and is aimed at not just the gaming community, but also the historical community, then it might do rather well.

 

[newsdeskdan]

That isn't a bad idea, I know Wargaming sponsors videos made by The Chieftain and I remember a while back when I was an avid player of WoT Blitz, that they used to make their own historical videos. Obviously, a book is quite different to a video, but, if the game developers and marketing teams understand their audience, then the book will definitely do well. Obviously, the book cannot be marketing for the game, but, if done properly, it could work well, providing valuable information to both the wargaming community, and the historical enthusiasts, who wouldn't necessarily be interested in the game itself. This might also bring players who weren't once interested in history, into the historical community, thus helping other authors, museums, etc.

I personally think it is a good idea, and that more authors should look into this.

The only problem is the language barrier, I belive they have already written a book, but it is in Russian and I cannot even work out what the title is.
Marketing is no issue, they have a YouTube channel with 136 thousand subscribers in the UK, and I'm sure people would be interested in a basic overview/historical run through of the tech trees, maybe seperate 'manuals' for each country/type etc. Anyway, it is worth someone getting in touch with them to see if they are interested.

Rafe

There is already the World of Tanks Roll Out - Commander's Guide hardback from 2016 and PC Gamer did a 'bookazine' with Wargaming a few years ago called World of Tanks Your Definitive Guide. I think the latter most closely meets your requirement - it profiles 53 different tanks - but I don't believe either did especially well at retail. The former is easy to get hold of while the PC Gamer one is practically impossible to find now.

I think that neither sold particularly well as they were written for a specific community; the gaming community, their own in particular. However, if the book is sponsored in part by the game developers, and is aimed at not just the gaming community, but also the historical community, then it might do rather well.

Video game developers don't sponsor books, in part or otherwise. There is a licensing process where the publisher pays the video game developer to use their IP - not the other way around. And in order to use the IP, the publisher will typically have to sign contracts which tie them in to handling the IP in a particular way. There are usually long lists of what can and cannot be done with the IP. Even the use of nothing more than the World of Tanks logo would require discussions about its placement, colours, surrounding imagery etc.
So assuming a publisher was willing to pay Wargaming for the use of their IP, and to adhere to the rules of using that IP, and create a product Wargaming was happy to sign off on, how likely is it that the historical community (as opposed to the video gaming community) will then go and buy that product?

I entirely understand the sentiment you're expressing though - it's a nice idea.

 

[JohnR]

I was having a pre-Christmas look on Amazon (I'll hopefully be getting vouchers for Christmas), and I had an epiphany. I was looking at books by Norman Friedman and glanced at his British Cruisers WWII and After, which I have. However, I was rather unimpressed by the paucity of the GW projects. But lately I have been looking at Tzoli's excellent thread on that subject and wondered if he, or someone would consider producing a book on that subject.

 

[Thos9]

New book proposal

Postwar Luft 46 technology proof-of-concept prototypes, weapons and operational airplanes:

Rear swept wing and the jet air intake mounted in the nose configuration of the Blohm und Voss project P.211-01 Volksjäger, Focke-Wulf Volsflugzeug, Focke-Wulf Ta 183 and Messerschmitt P.1101.

After the war ended, the Allied powers raced to size aeronautic technology in occupied Germany and the aerodynamic configuration of these German projects was used in the first generation of the Cold War jet fighters: North American F-86 Sabre, Mikoyan Gurevich MiG-15, Lavotckin La-15, Dassault MD 450 Ouragan, Dassault MD 452 Mystère, Nord 2200 and Tank IAE 33.

The delta wing configuration of Lippisch DM-1 and Messerschmitt P.1112/S2 was used in the Convair XF-92, Convair F-102, Nord 1402 Gerfaut, Sud Est S.E. 212 Durandal, Dassault Mirage I, Avro 707, Boulton Paul P.111, Boulton Paul P.120, Handley Page H.P.115, Fairey Delta 1, Fairey Delta 2, BAC 221 and Short SC.1.

The maximum speed of the first prototypes XF-92 and YF-102 was limited to Mach 0.98 due a transonic drag much higher than expected, but the problem was solved on December 1954 using the aerodynamic principle named area rule, patented by Junkers on March 1944.

Swept wings with two trailing-edge fin and rudder units configuration from Arado E.583 and Junkers EF.128 project was used in the Chance Vought F7U Cutlass naval fighter.

The “bat wing” of the Messerschmitt Me P.1109-01 and Blohm und Voss P.208 projects was used in 1996 in the prototype Boeing Bird of Prey.

The oblique scissors wing of the Messerschmitt Me P.1109-01 and Blohm und Voss P.202 projects was flight tested in 1979 with the NASA Ames AD-1 research airplane.

The forward-swept wing of the German projects Heinkel He 162 D, Blohm und Voss P.209.02, BMW Strahlbomber II and Focke-Wulf P. 03028, was flight tested with the Grumman X-29 research plane in 1984.

The butterfly tailplane of the Heinkel P.1079A and Messerchmitt P.1110 projects was used in 1951 in the Supermarine Type 508 prototype and in the Fouga CM.170 jet trainer in 1952.

The Versuchsflugel II crescent wing of the Arado Ar 234 V16 project was used in the Handley Page H.P.88 research plane in 1951 and in the Handley Page Victor strategic bomber in 1952.

The tailless configuration of the Messerschmitt Me 163 Komet was flight tested in the research planes de Havilland D.H.108 in 1946, Northrop X-4 in 1948, and Payen Katy in 1954 and in the Douglas F4D Skyray naval fighter in 1951.

The double-delta configuration of the Henschel P.130 project was used by SAAB in their J35 Draken jet interceptor in 1955.

The jet/rocket mixed propulsion system of the Messerschmitt prototype Me 262 V074 and the Focke-Wulf Projekt VI Flitzer was used in the French interceptor Dassault Mirage IIIC in 1961 and in the British research airplane Saunders-Roe S.R. 177 in 1947.

The variable-geometry wing of the Messerschmitt P.1102-05 was used in the Bell X-5 and Mirage G prototypes, in the Grumman F-14 Tomcat naval fighter, in the MiG-23 fighter-bomber and in the Panavia Tornado bomber.

The radar AWACS rotating antenna of the airborne early warning airplanes Grumman E-2 Hawkeye and the AWACS Boeing E-3 Sentry, was developed in 1944 for the Arado Ar 234 C-3, to track a bomber stream up to distances of 45 km using a FuG 244 Bremen 0 radar set with a rotating disc above the fuselage.

The annular wing developed by von Zborowski for the Heinkel Wespe VTOL project, was flight tested in 1958 with the French prototype SNECMA Coléoptère.

The French DEFA and British ADEN 30 mm cannons were developed from the German Mauser MG 213C.

The Mighty Mouse air-to-air unguided rockets fired by the all-weather interceptors Lockheed F-94 Starfire, Northrop F-89 Scorpion and North American F-86 D Sabre Dog during the Cold War, were developed from the Rheinmetall R4M Orkan 55 mm rocket and their automatic firing radar system probably was a development of the German FuG 222 Pauke S fire control radar with Oberon-Elfe predictor system.

The ramjet propulsion of the German projects Lippisch P.13a, Skoda-Kauba SK P.12, Heinkel P.1080, Focke-Wulf Ta 283 and Messerschmitt P.1101L was flight tested by the North American F-51D c/n 44-63528 in 1946, the Lockheed F-80 Trijet in 1948, and the French prototypes Leduc 021 and Sud Ouest SO 9000 Trident in 1953.

The turboprop configuration of the Focke-Wulf P.0310226-17 project was flight tested in 1953 with the McDonnell XF-88B prototype and in 1955 by the Republic XF-84 H Thunderscreech research plane in 1955.

The canard foreplanes of the Blohm und Voss P.217 and Messerschmitt P.1110 (Feb 12, 1945) projects was used by the Dassault Mirage III Milan in 1969.

Several versions of the Fieseler Fi 103 (V-1) cruise missile were manufactured in USA, as Republic-Ford JB-2 Loon, in France as ARSAERO CT-10 and in the USRR as the Izdeliye 10.

The EMW V-2 ballistic missile were manufactured in the USRR as the R-1 in 1948, in USA as RTV-G-4 Bumper and developed as the PGM Redstone rocket of the Mercury project in 1958.

The Rheinmetall-Borsig Rheintochter surface-to-air missile concept inspired the Soviet SA-2 (1960) and the US Nike Ajax (1954).

The Doblhoff WNF 342 jet propelled rotor concept was used in the Hiller YH-32 Hornet helicopter in 1950, in the American Helicopter XH-26 Jet Jeep in 1952, in the Fairey Rotodyne compound gyroplane in 1957 and in the Fairey Gyrodyne prototype in 1957.

The SNECMA Atar 101 French turbojet was developed of the BMW 018 axial-flow turbojet ???

The SNECMA Atar 101 French turbojet was developed of the BMW 018 axial-flow turbojet ???

The Atar 101 was designed in early 1945 by BMW as the P.3306, an enlarged and refined derivative of the BMW 003. The German designers found employment at SNECMA postwar.

 

[Antonio]

I was having a pre-Christmas look on Amazon (I'll hopefully be getting vouchers for Christmas), and I had an epiphany. I was looking at books by Norman Friedman and glanced at his British Cruisers WWII and After, which I have. However, I was rather unimpressed by the paucity of the GW projects. But lately I have been looking at Tzoli's excellent thread on that subject and wondered if he, or someone would consider producing a book on that subject.

"British Cruisers Two World Wars and After" is a great book but for post WWII RN unbuilt designs I better recommend "Rebuilding the Royal Navy". I have both.
My dream book would be a mixture of all the contents of books in my bookshelf with Tzoli's research and drawings.

 

[Hood]

Naval secret projects is a genre that hasn't yet made it to mainstream press, though the French Z-Plan book posted here recently shows there is a trend forming perhaps?

 

[sgeorges4]

the french Z plan book come out and I remarked that when it come to proejct/prototype ,the most popular are often plane and tank while ship/submarine get ignored (particulary by model making company ,the only Z plan ship in injection for now are 2 innacurate aircraft carrier by trumpeter and a H39 by veryfire)

 

[JohnR]

I was having a pre-Christmas look on Amazon (I'll hopefully be getting vouchers for Christmas), and I had an epiphany. I was looking at books by Norman Friedman and glanced at his British Cruisers WWII and After, which I have. However, I was rather unimpressed by the paucity of the GW projects. But lately I have been looking at Tzoli's excellent thread on that subject and wondered if he, or someone would consider producing a book on that subject.

"British Cruisers Two World Wars and After" is a great book but for post WWII RN unbuilt designs I better recommend "Rebuilding the Royal Navy". I have both.
My dream book would be a mixture of all the contents of books in my bookshelf with Tzoli's research and drawings.

We have the same taste in books I have all four of Browns books on the development of the RN form the Victorian to the Post War Era. I also have a wide range of Norman Friedmans books including the Postwar Naval Revolution.

I look forward to an English translation of the Z Plan, I do feel it will be translated as the English Language market is much larger.

Regard

 

[Jason Dykstra (Wyvern)]

I'm currently drawing up a list for the book titles I have in my head, which I should have posted here by the end of next week. Once this list is drawn up, should threads be started to help gather information, or would it be unnecessary? I'll leave it to those who are more experienced in these matters than I am.

 

[Jason Dykstra (Wyvern)]

Here is a list of possible titles I've thought of:

Argentine Secret Projects 1: Fighter, Bomber and Strike Projects
Argentine Secret Projects 2: Transport, Passenger, Glider and Helicopter Projects

American Secret Projects 6: Airliner projects from 1945 - 1970
American Secret Projects 7: Airliner projects from 1971 - 2021
American Secret Projects 8: Army Helicopters
American Secret Projects 9: Navy Helicopters
American Secret Projects 10: Fighters since 1974
American Secret Projects 11: Bombers, Strikers and Patrol aircraft since 1974
American Secret Projects 12: Hypersonics, Ramjets and Missiles
American Secret Projects 13: Space Projects

British Secret Projects 6: Airliner projects 1945 - Present
British Secret Projects 7: Airliner Projects 1925 - 1945
British Secret Projects 8: Trainers, Strikers, Patrol Aircraft and Transports
British Secret Projects 9: Hypersonics, Ramjets and Missiles

French Secret Projects 5: Airliner projects from 1945 - Present
French Secret Projects 6: Airliner projects from 1925 - 1945
French Secret Projects 7: Hypersonics, Ramjets and Missiles

Italian Secret Projects: Fighters and Strikers from 1945 - Present
Italian Secret Projects: Transport, Trainer and Helicopters from 1945 - Present

Japanese Secret Projects: Fighters, Trainers and Attackers from 1945 - Present
Japanese Secret Projects: Airliner, Transport and Helicopter Projects from 1945

Korean Secret Projects: Fighters, Trainers and Helicopters since 1953

Brazilian Secret Projects: Fighters, Trainers, and Airliners since 1945

Soviet Secret Projects 1: Fighters from 1945 to 1967
Soviet Secret Projects 2: Bombers from 1945 to 1967
Soviet Secret Projects 3: Fighters from 1967 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 4: Bombers from 1967 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 5: Strike, Trainer and Patrol Aircraft from 1945 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 6: Fighters from 1930 to 1945
Soviet Secret Projects 7: Bombers from 1930 to 1945
Soviet Secret Projects 8: Airliners from 1945 to 1967
Soviet Secret Projects 9: Airliners from 1967 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 10: Transports from 1930 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 11: Helicopters from 1945 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 12: Hypersonics, Ramjets and Missiles
Soviet Secret Projects 13: Space Projects

Russian Secret Projects 1: Fighters since 1989
Russian Secret Projects 2: Bombers, Strikers, Trainers and Patrol Aircraft since 1989
Russian Secret Projects 3: Airliners and Transports since 1989
Russian Secret Projects 4: Hypersonic, Ramjets, Missile and Space Projects since 1989

Eastern European Secret Projects 1: Projects since 1945
Eastern European Secret Projects 1: Projects between 1925 - 1945

Swedish Secret Projects: Fighters since 1930
Swedish Secret Projects: Strike aircraft since 1930
Swedish Secret Projects: Airliners since 1945

South African Secret Projects: Aircraft and Weapon Projects since 1945

Canadian Secret Projects: Aircraft and Weapon Projects since 1945

Australian Secret Projects: Aircraft and Weapon Projects since 1945

Swiss Secret Projects: Aircraft and Weapon Projects since 1945

German Secret Projects: Fighter and Strike Aircraft since 1945
German Secret Projects: Helicopters since 1945
Germans Secret Projects: Transports and Airliners since 1945

These are the one I could think of. These titles come from the perspective of a reader, not an author, so I am unsure as to whether some of these will work. That being said, there is still a lot that could be written. Certain books (especially ones regarding topics after the 1970's) will most likely not have that much information about them currently, due to certain information being classified. That being said, who knows what will be declassified within the next 20-30 years. In BSP 1 for instance, there was a full blown chapter about the development of the Typhoon, even though quite a bit of information is still classified. Within another 20 years, there will definitely be more information about things like the F-15, ATF and ATB programs made public. It's only a matter of time, in my opinion. I hope I am not being too optimistic.

 

[hesham]

Here is a list of possible titles I've thought of:

Argentine Secret Projects 1: Fighter, Bomber and Strike Projects
Argentine Secret Projects 2: Transport, Passenger, Glider and Helicopter Projects

American Secret Projects 6: Airliner projects from 1945 - 1970
American Secret Projects 7: Airliner projects from 1971 - 2021
American Secret Projects 8: Army Helicopters
American Secret Projects 9: Navy Helicopters
American Secret Projects 10: Fighters since 1974
American Secret Projects 11: Bombers, Strikers and Patrol aircraft since 1974
American Secret Projects 12: Hypersonics, Ramjets and Missiles
American Secret Projects 13: Space Projects

British Secret Projects 6: Airliner projects 1945 - Present
British Secret Projects 7: Airliner Projects 1925 - 1945
British Secret Projects 8: Trainers, Strikers, Patrol Aircraft and Transports
British Secret Projects 9: Hypersonics, Ramjets and Missiles

French Secret Projects 5: Airliner projects from 1945 - Present
French Secret Projects 6: Airliner projects from 1925 - 1945
French Secret Projects 7: Hypersonics, Ramjets and Missiles

Italian Secret Projects: Fighters and Strikers from 1945 - Present
Italian Secret Projects: Transport, Trainer and Helicopters from 1945 - Present

Japanese Secret Projects: Fighters, Trainers and Attackers from 1945 - Present
Japanese Secret Projects: Airliner, Transport and Helicopter Projects from 1945

Korean Secret Projects: Fighters, Trainers and Helicopters since 1953

Brazilian Secret Projects: Fighters, Trainers, and Airliners since 1945

Soviet Secret Projects 1: Fighters from 1945 to 1967
Soviet Secret Projects 2: Bombers from 1945 to 1967
Soviet Secret Projects 3: Fighters from 1967 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 4: Bombers from 1967 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 5: Strike, Trainer and Patrol Aircraft from 1945 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 6: Fighters from 1930 to 1945
Soviet Secret Projects 7: Bombers from 1930 to 1945
Soviet Secret Projects 8: Airliners from 1945 to 1967
Soviet Secret Projects 9: Airliners from 1967 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 10: Transports from 1930 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 11: Helicopters from 1945 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 12: Hypersonics, Ramjets and Missiles
Soviet Secret Projects 13: Space Projects

Russian Secret Projects 1: Fighters since 1989
Russian Secret Projects 2: Bombers, Strikers, Trainers and Patrol Aircraft since 1989
Russian Secret Projects 3: Airliners and Transports since 1989
Russian Secret Projects 4: Hypersonic, Ramjets, Missile and Space Projects since 1989

Eastern European Secret Projects 1: Projects since 1945
Eastern European Secret Projects 1: Projects between 1925 - 1945

Swedish Secret Projects: Fighters since 1930
Swedish Secret Projects: Strike aircraft since 1930
Swedish Secret Projects: Airliners since 1945

South African Secret Projects: Aircraft and Missile Projects since 1945

Canadian Secret Projects: Aircraft and Missile Projects since 1945

Australian Secret Projects: Aircraft and Missile Projects since 1945

Swiss Secret Projects: Aircraft and Missile Projects since 1945

German Secret Projects: Fighter and Strike Aircraft since 1945
German Secret Projects: Helicopters since 1945
Germans Secret Projects: Transports and Airliners since 1945

These are the one I could think of. These titles come from the perspective of a reader, not an author, so I am unsure as to whether some of these will work. That being said, there is still a lot that could be written. Certain books (especially ones regarding topics after the 1970's) will most likely not have that much information about them currently, due to certain information being classified. That being said, who knows what will be declassified within the next 20-30 years. In BSP 1 for instance, there was a full blown chapter about the development of the Typhoon, even though quite a bit of information is still classified. Within another 20 years, there will definitely be more information about things like the F-15, ATF and ATB programs made public. It's only a matter of time, in my opinion. I hope I am not being too optimistic.

I did something like that before,in replies # 26,27 & 30 ;

https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/looking-for-authors.14674/#post-171265

 

[Jason Dykstra (Wyvern)]

Oh, one nation I forgot was India. A book for them could be:

Indian Secret Projects: Aircraft and Weapon Projects since 1947

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

A lot of those are unviable, there simply isn't enough projects to make a 200-300 page book. You'd be better off-lumping stuff together, geographically or thematically, these are way too small as topics.

Don't forget the focus of the series is on projects submitted to official requirements. How many fighter competitions do you think there have been in Russia since 1989? How easy would it be to get the relevant material released ?

There also needs to be a market to sell them to, and an author willing to put in years of research, preferably located in the right country. I get your enthusiasm but really this is frankly all irrelevant.

 

[XB-35]

Some "Secret Projects" books about tanks and other military vehicles (WW2 and Cold War) would be an interesting addition as well as books about missiles and bombs.

 

[riggerrob]

Amazon also depends upon low wages, sometimes below local minimum wages.
The book "Nomadland" details the life-styles of American migrant workers who only work for Amazon during the Christmas rush season, then migrate on to harvest beets, clean camp grounds, etc. in other states.
Many of these nomadic workers are more than 60 years old, but never saved enough money to retire comfortably. Many others lost their savings during divorces (As I stare at the man in the mirror) or the economic collapse of 2008.
Nomadic workers are also often skilled construction workers who travel from one large project to the next. I lived in a VW van for a couple of years as the skydiving industry surged during the 1990s up until 2008. Living in a van helped me pay off my student loans and save up enough to by a camper trailer in "The Ghetto" near the Perris Valley, California skydiving center.

This life style reminds me of the harvest crews on the Canadian Prairies that my grandfather worked when he was a young man (1920s). This nomadic labor force also reminds us of all the Okies displaced during the Great Depression and Dirty thirties Drought.

 

[Archibald]

Amazon also depends upon low wages, sometimes below local minimum wages.
The book "Nomadland" details the life-styles of American migrant workers who only work for Amazon during the Christmas rush season, then migrate on to harvest beets, clean camp grounds, etc. in other states.
Many of these nomadic workers are more than 60 years old, but never saved enough money to retire comfortably. Many others lost their savings during divorces (As I stare at the man in the mirror) or the economic collapse of 2008.
Nomadic workers are also often skilled construction workers who travel from one large project to the next. I lived in a VW van for a couple of years as the skydiving industry surged during the 1990s up until 2008. Living in a van helped me pay off my student loans and save up enough to by a camper trailer in "The Ghetto" near the Perris Valley, California skydiving center.

This life style reminds me of the harvest crews on the Canadian Prairies that my grandfather worked when he was a young man (1920s). This nomadic labor force also reminds us of all the Okies displaced during the Great Depression and Dirty thirties Drought.

Steinbeck "grapes of wrath" comes to mind...

 

[Justo Miranda]

American secret projects (The Dark Side)

 

[foiling]

Here is a list of possible titles I've thought of:

Argentine Secret Projects 1: Fighter, Bomber and Strike Projects
Argentine Secret Projects 2: Transport, Passenger, Glider and Helicopter Projects

American Secret Projects 6: Airliner projects from 1945 - 1970
American Secret Projects 7: Airliner projects from 1971 - 2021
American Secret Projects 8: Army Helicopters
American Secret Projects 9: Navy Helicopters
American Secret Projects 10: Fighters since 1974
American Secret Projects 11: Bombers, Strikers and Patrol aircraft since 1974
American Secret Projects 12: Hypersonics, Ramjets and Missiles
American Secret Projects 13: Space Projects

British Secret Projects 6: Airliner projects 1945 - Present
British Secret Projects 7: Airliner Projects 1925 - 1945
British Secret Projects 8: Trainers, Strikers, Patrol Aircraft and Transports
British Secret Projects 9: Hypersonics, Ramjets and Missiles

French Secret Projects 5: Airliner projects from 1945 - Present
French Secret Projects 6: Airliner projects from 1925 - 1945
French Secret Projects 7: Hypersonics, Ramjets and Missiles

Italian Secret Projects: Fighters and Strikers from 1945 - Present
Italian Secret Projects: Transport, Trainer and Helicopters from 1945 - Present

Japanese Secret Projects: Fighters, Trainers and Attackers from 1945 - Present
Japanese Secret Projects: Airliner, Transport and Helicopter Projects from 1945

Korean Secret Projects: Fighters, Trainers and Helicopters since 1953

Brazilian Secret Projects: Fighters, Trainers, and Airliners since 1945

Soviet Secret Projects 1: Fighters from 1945 to 1967
Soviet Secret Projects 2: Bombers from 1945 to 1967
Soviet Secret Projects 3: Fighters from 1967 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 4: Bombers from 1967 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 5: Strike, Trainer and Patrol Aircraft from 1945 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 6: Fighters from 1930 to 1945
Soviet Secret Projects 7: Bombers from 1930 to 1945
Soviet Secret Projects 8: Airliners from 1945 to 1967
Soviet Secret Projects 9: Airliners from 1967 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 10: Transports from 1930 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 11: Helicopters from 1945 to 1989
Soviet Secret Projects 12: Hypersonics, Ramjets and Missiles
Soviet Secret Projects 13: Space Projects

Russian Secret Projects 1: Fighters since 1989
Russian Secret Projects 2: Bombers, Strikers, Trainers and Patrol Aircraft since 1989
Russian Secret Projects 3: Airliners and Transports since 1989
Russian Secret Projects 4: Hypersonic, Ramjets, Missile and Space Projects since 1989

Eastern European Secret Projects 1: Projects since 1945
Eastern European Secret Projects 1: Projects between 1925 - 1945

Swedish Secret Projects: Fighters since 1930
Swedish Secret Projects: Strike aircraft since 1930
Swedish Secret Projects: Airliners since 1945

South African Secret Projects: Aircraft and Weapon Projects since 1945

Canadian Secret Projects: Aircraft and Weapon Projects since 1945

Australian Secret Projects: Aircraft and Weapon Projects since 1945

Swiss Secret Projects: Aircraft and Weapon Projects since 1945

German Secret Projects: Fighter and Strike Aircraft since 1945
German Secret Projects: Helicopters since 1945
Germans Secret Projects: Transports and Airliners since 1945

These are the one I could think of. These titles come from the perspective of a reader, not an author, so I am unsure as to whether some of these will work. That being said, there is still a lot that could be written. Certain books (especially ones regarding topics after the 1970's) will most likely not have that much information about them currently, due to certain information being classified. That being said, who knows what will be declassified within the next 20-30 years. In BSP 1 for instance, there was a full blown chapter about the development of the Typhoon, even though quite a bit of information is still classified. Within another 20 years, there will definitely be more information about things like the F-15, ATF and ATB programs made public. It's only a matter of time, in my opinion. I hope I am not being too optimistic.

I love many of your suggestions, Wyvern; anything on Russian, Soviet, American & British secret projects, especially bombers & civil aircraft.

 

[kaiserd]

There’s probably scope for a condensed European (not UK, France or Soviet Union) Secret Projects: Cold War fighter aircraft book. Not sure any (English language) book that goes for any one country (say Italy or Germany) will have enough content and/ or commercial appeal in this context.
Perhaps a slightly different focus (Western European, NATO member European countries) would produce a better more focused end product but hard to come up with coherent name so probably not the easiest sell (especially to likely UK and US concentrated English speakers).

Would love to see new editions of the Russian/ Soviet secret projects books but not sure there is necessarily new material or sufficient market demand for them.

 

[XP67_Moonbat]

Military Space Projects is definitely begging for an update. Lots of developments since 2008. Not the least of which is the creation of the USSF. Not to mention developments from Russia, China, and other space powers. As well as private corporations like SpaceX launching military payloads. Definitely room for an updated volume.

 

[XP67_Moonbat]

Oh, and @ JC, I just received my copy here in Texas last weekend. And I love it already!

 

[newsdeskdan]

The SNECMA Atar 101 French turbojet was developed of the BMW 018 axial-flow turbojet ???

The Atar 101 was designed in early 1945 by BMW as the P.3306, an enlarged and refined derivative of the BMW 003. The German designers found employment at SNECMA postwar.

Just noticed this. Development of the BMW 018 appears to have begun in 1938 as the P 3303. It was only, finally, given the 018 designation in June 1942. It was basically in development for the entire course of the war. Circa August 1944, it measured 5000mm long (it had been 4750mm in June 1942) with a maximum diameter of 1250mm (which remained the same from June 1942 to May 1945). Evidently it had been shrunk back to a length of 4200mm by May '45. Projected thrust was 3400kg.
The P 3306 was 3200mm long with a maximum diameter of 850mm and a projected thrust of 1700kg.
Apparently SNECMA's Atar 101C was only 3680mm long with a maximum diameter of 890mm and 2800kg thrust. I mean, I guess it could've been a miniaturised 018 development but it does seem more likely that it was actually a slightly enlarged and improved development of the P 3306.