Patriot SAM replacement

totoro said:
Question is - does the main rocket motor ignite right afterwards?
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If you've watched the videos of an SM-2/3/6 launch there is a very small delay between the separation of the Mk-72 booster and the Mk-104 sustainer firing (Just enough of a delay to get sufficient clearance between the booster and the missile's boat-tail).

totoro said:
And once ignited, is its thrust constant or does it have some sort of boot-sustain configuration as well?
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The Mk-104 DTRM sustainer has a boost/sustain burn configuration (Dual Thrust Rocket Motor).
 
totoro said:
if 6 seconds for the booster is true, and if missile's max velocity with the booster is anywhere between Mach 3.5 and 5 - then after those 6 seconds the missile should be roughly at 6000 meters of altitude. If the missile goes up completely vertically. So, with some horizontal movement, perhaps closer to 5000 meters? And then the booster is jettisoned right in the 7th second - that seems logical.
Question is - does the main rocket motor ignite right afterwards? And once ignited, is its thrust constant or does it have some sort of boot-sustain configuration as well?
I always wondered, if the missile would not accelerate right away after booster separation, using its main motor, how quickly would it really shed speed? Would it reach like 10 km in altitude while still going over mach 2?
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Looks like maybe a fraction of a second? It's not immediate though (though I suppose below could be a test of the booster, with an inert upper stage):

separ2.jpg
 
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Army doubles IBCS development funding in new five-year plan; ties in F-35, THAAD, more​

By Jason Sherman / April 10, 2024

The Army is doubling funding in its updated five-year budget plan for the Integrated Battle Command System in an effort to expedite development of software needed to integrate a list of new sensors, including the F-35 Joint Strike Fighter, the Terminal High Altitude Area Defense system, the Remote Interceptor Guidance-360 and more. The Army’s fiscal year 2025 budget request proposes $2.1 billion for system development and demonstration funding over five years, a substantial increase compared to the FY-24 five-year plan...

https://insidedefense.com/daily-new...nding-new-five-year-plan-ties-f-35-thaad-more

Patriot Mods program big winner in new Army five-year plan, nearly $3 billion boost | InsideDefense.com

The Army has set new plans to triple annual spending on Patriot Modifications in fiscal year 2027 as part of a $3 billion increase over five years to improve the capability and readiness of the air defense system, a 174% hike compared to the current future years defense program.
insidedefense.com insidedefense.com
 
I'm not that clued up on the state of Israel's Patriot batteries, they're apparently upgraded to GEM+ standard with missiles upgraded as well to GEM-T.

Seems an unusual time to be considering mothballing them, particularly after the recent expenditure of so many SAM's....

Could the US 'buy' them back, and their missiles, and pass them on to Ukraine? Apparently there are 10 batteries worth...thats 60 launchers (if they're configured per US practice).

 
timmymagic said:
I'm not that clued up on the state of Israel's Patriot batteries, they're apparently upgraded to GEM+ standard with missiles upgraded as well to GEM-T.

Seems an unusual time to be considering mothballing them, particularly after the recent expenditure of so many SAM's....

Could the US 'buy' them back, and their missiles, and pass them on to Ukraine? Apparently there are 10 batteries worth...thats 60 launchers (if they're configured per US practice).

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It is unclear what will happen with the Patriot batteries, which are highly sought by Ukraine as it seeks to defend its skies against Russian missiles.
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:cool:
 
timmymagic said:
Seems almost too good to be true....Europe and the US struggling to find enough Patriot batteries spare....and missiles...and suddenly 10 whole batteries with, no doubt, a substantial number of missiles are suddenly, potentially, available...
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And to add a potential upside....3 of the Batteries (there's some debate on numbers, some are saying that its only 7 in total not 10, but each with 8 launchers for a total of 56 launchers) are not owned by Israel....they were on long term loan from....the German's. Who also transferred a significant number of missiles....

I guess the German's could just ask for them back....you'd hope the US could make a nominal 'offer that couldn't be refused' to the Israeli's for the other ones...all that political and financial support has to count for something...
 
Defense Updates has put out a video about how a Patriot battery was used to shoot down a Beriev A-50U Mainstay AEWACS a few months ago:


On January 14, a Russian A-50 Mainstay airborne early warning and control (AEW&C) aircraft was shot down over the Sea of Azov.
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This is one of the most significant hits Ukraine has been able to execute since the conflict started. There was a lot of speculation about how Ukraine managed to do this since this was a long-range hit.According to a U.S. Army officer, a U.S.-made Patriot air defense system was used for this.
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In this video, Defense Updates analyzes how the U.S.-made Patriot air defense system was able to take out a Russian A-50
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?#defenseupdates #ukrainerussiawar #ukrainevsrussiahttps://www.youtube.com/hashtag/ukrainevsrussia
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Chapters:
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00:11 INTRODUCTION
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01:37 U.S ARMY INSIGHT
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02:53 BERIEV A-50 OVERVIEW
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05:34 PATRIOT AIR DEFENSE SYSTEM
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07:04 ANALYSIS
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Inside Defense write-up of their interpretation of the GAO report​

LTAMDS, IBCS failed to intercept classified ballistic missile target, GAO reveals​

By Jason Sherman / June 21, 2024 at 2:44 PM

A classified ballistic missile target was able to sneak by the Army’s newest radar and integrated battle command system during an operational assessment last year, a setback the service did not disclose -- but which came to light in a new report by congressional auditors on the Lower Tier Air and Missile Defense Sensor (LTAMDS). The Government Accountability Office, in its annual report on selected weapon system programs , notes this development in its review of the LTAMDS multifunctional radar,...
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Cordy said:

Inside Defense write-up of their interpretation of the GAO report​

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All depends what that classified ballistic missile target was. If it was some kind of HTV-2 successor or TBG development, then that could be seen in a positive light, because an adversary would likely have similar/even worse problems.
 
Apso depends on why as well.

Did the Target have decoys or ECM gear? Sone type of stealthing? Was it hit to kill only but past close enough that a Pac3 warhead could still pop it? Was it a program issue on the radar or datalink end?

We dont know.


Remember seeing the same type of writing for... Well every other ABM type missile the US had.

Including the old Nike one.

But once it cane to prime time...
 
"Army takes delivery of first production IBCS set, including new 'survivable' mobile antenna
By Jason Sherman/Inside Defense / June 25, 2024
The Army has taken delivery of the first complete set of hardware needed for next-generation air and missile defense capabilities -- including a more mobile Integrated Fire Control Network Relay redesigned at the 11th hour to reflect lessons from the war in Ukraine -- a kit potentially available for deployment to Guam. Northrop Grumman, prime contractor for the Integrated Battle Command System, has delivered the first IBCS Engagement Operations Center (EOC) and IFCN Relay, capping delivery of the first full... "

Anyone have info on what the changes were to make the antenna survivable?
 

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