Northrop Aircraft (NORAIR) Project Designations

OK Stargazer, here are some accurate (documented) Northrop designations for you.

The P700 was the ND-102; as far as I know no N3XX number was assigned.
P900 was used in conjunction with Bud Nelsons's little fighter that he started at Boeing and continued at Northrop under various names.

N338 Navy HATOL Dorsal Inlet design
N353 Northrop designation for Bud Nelson's design (-4 in 1985) (Compact Efficient Fighter, Mission Adaptive Fighter etc.)
N354 Two Place F-5G/F-20 1982
N369 STOVL/CAS concept for a USAF Study 1985

Agile +, the Supercruise design, the Dorsal Inlet Air-to-Surface design and the various ATF study designs like the Baseline cranked delta Multi-Role design would have had N3xx numbers but I do not know what they were.
 
Correction. Tom Wier's drawing of HATOL that overscan posted in the Northrop dorsal inlet thread clearly shows its designation as N336-12 (or -7 on the inboard profile). The Harlan Krug color painting of it could also read N336-12 if you squint at it enough.

I have taken another look at the photos taken in Advanced Design that I posted last year. I have three each slightly different from slightly different angles, so I scanned them at 600 dpi and worked on the best in Photoshop. My best guess is that the model which I think is the USAF Air-to-Surface design is designated N333-14 or possibly N343-14.
 

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Bill, you have been mixing up HATOL and VATOL in the past few posts.

HATOL was the 1978 RALS proposal while VATOL was the one in your pictures... ;)

And of course, as I mentioned in another topic, I do believe too that the painting has "N336-12".
 
BillRo said:
My best guess is that the model which I think is the USAF Air-to-Surface design is designated N333-14 or possibly N343-14.
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Definitely N333-14 as far as I'm concerned.
 
I have an official Northrop Aircraft (NORAIR) Project Designations document and the numbers run from N-1 thru N-315. -SP
 
OMG, you're a lucky man!

Northop's most comprehensive list on my hands is N-1 to N-160 from "Les Avions et Engins Northrop. Alain Pelletier. Minidocavia #21"
Your list almost double this one so it should end with projects designed in the 90's, is that right?. So is there the "N" number for the P-530?
The higher number I know is Northrop N-267 from 1971
 
Here's the list I've begun. -SP
 

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A Northrop list going up to 315 would of course not be complete, but it would be a tremendous improvement on what's available now.

What I have is N-1 to N-160 (minus N-108 and N-120), then N-164, 165, 167, 173, 176, 180, 184, 191, 201, 205, 214, 217, 249 (unsure), 250, 251, 267, and then a whole range of designations from N-285 to -322, 333, 336, 350, 351, 353, 354, 363 (unsure), 369, 371, 381, 382, 400 (unsure).
 
Here's my list now minus N-215 thru N-249. -SP
 

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Steve Pace said:
Here's my list now minus N-215 thru N-249. -SP
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A large part of your list is the same as mine, word for word... A few remarks though:
  • N-137: Conflict here: I had this as a USAF TS6-6010 70mm rocket launcher
  • N-138: USAF F-89H all-weather fighter/interceptor proposal with "Falcon" missiles
  • N-140: I had only the mention "accelerator"...
  • N-144: huge long-distance interceptor project developed from N-126 design
  • N-146: Launcher, radar and firecontrol system for the XM3 Hawk missile made by Raytheon
  • N-148: I have this as counter measures systems for bombers
  • N-151: I have this as an XQ-4A drone modified to test Boeing IM-99 Bomarc J83 engine
  • N-286: I have this as a projected stretched version of F-5E
  • N-299: I have the G.E. Model J-1A as the J100, not the J85.
Also, there are quite a few missing designations AFTER N-250 in your list...
 
Many thanks Steve and Stephane, that list is a treasure.
 
From Tony Buttler:


Many thanks Steve for the list - a most valuable addition to the materials available. I can confirm, however, that the Long Range Interceptor to WS-202A was the N-144, as shown by the following documents from NARA College Park (which in fact gives a complete list of the contenders)
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Tony supplied the relevant list of submissions to WS-202A which I've posted here.
 
Hi All!
N-227---Project Mercury


Very, very good information, but there is some question: a program or competition?
N-168, SWOOSE ---?
N-169, EAGLE---? (competitors of Bendix X-AAAM-N-10 Eagle or ?)
N-184, lightweight medium-range interceptor--- ?
N-188, Medium Range Ballistic Missile---?
N-201, Long Range Missile Fighter System---?
N-202, Short Range Ballistic Missile---?

N-207, Aircraft Nuclear Propulsion---?
N-208, Supersonic Transport (SST)---?

N-212, BROOM---?

N-213, EAGLE---? (competitors of Bendix X-AAAM-N-10 Eagle or ?)
N-257, USAF Medium Range Ballistic Missile (MRBM)---?
 
There is a post by AM stating that N381 was a multi role carrier based flying wing aircraft and I can confirm that.

I was digging through a box and found a bunch of old Northrop company travel expense reports; before I tossed them I thought I would make a list to help with the chronology of the various projects. Attached to one of them was a piece of paper listing what we had done on the AMSS program (Advanced Multi-Sensor System). Apparently the bean counters wanted to track costs and it was attached to the report for a trip to Fokker in the Netherlands. We coordinated with them on the Fokker 100 COD (Carrier On-Board Delivery) version.

This apparently is what we did with the program:

Fokker F100 COD Aircraft / ASW / EW
3 NAD AD Configurations Target weight 60,000 lb
Skewed wing, Aft engines - too heavy (Jim W.)
Straight wing, aft engines - too heavy (Dave B.)
Lifting body, twin engined, high tail - OK but politically/legally No (John B.)

AD N381 config through - 13 versions. Tail less all wing design, LE wing Inlets, 4 seats, 2 verticals
subsonic 0.8M EW/ASW/A6 missions/COD Version (John B.)

Clearly the N381 is the only design that received a designation and judging by the number of versions, John worked on it for a while.

Unfortunately I have no drawings of it which is why I posted here.

BillRo
 
Way cool! Any approximate date? I would guess circa 1988-89, but it would be best to have a confirmation.
 
Steve Pace said:
Here's my list now minus N-215 thru N-249. -SP
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My only comment is that, from the drawings I saw while there, the N-3 was a land-plane and the N-3PB was a floatplane derivative.
 
elmayerle said:
the N-3 was a land-plane and the N-3PB was a floatplane derivative.
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Which makes perfect sense. The "-3PB" was only the patrol bomber version of the basic "-3" design.

It's nice to hear, really, because I have been toying for a while with the notion of a landplane variant of the "Norse Seaplane" and the fact that it actually existed on Northrop's drawing board makes it even more interesting...
 
The realisation that the N-3 project was real led me to complete an unfinished piece of work I did two years ago...

Here it is: http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,14720.msg189656.html#msg189656
 
So far a straight copy of the Word doc. Need to add or revise entries, add links to known projects, etc.
 
Stargazer2006 said:
elmayerle said:
the N-3 was a land-plane and the N-3PB was a floatplane derivative.
Click to expand...

Which makes perfect sense. The "-3PB" was only the patrol bomber version of the basic "-3" design.

It's nice to hear, really, because I have been toying for a while with the notion of a landplane variant of the "Norse Seaplane" and the fact that it actually existed on Northrop's drawing board makes it even more interesting...
Click to expand...
Once upon a time, Northrop, or a group of Northrop employees, sold to employees a set of basic three views of several unbuilt designs including the original N-3. If I could find where I had these buiried, I'd be glad to scan them for you. Unfortunately, I've no idea where they are.
 
elmayerle said:
Once upon a time, Northrop, or a group of Northrop employees, sold to employees a set of basic three views of several unbuilt designs including the original N-3. If I could find where I had these buiried, I'd be glad to scan them for you. Unfortunately, I've no idea where they are.
Click to expand...

Wish there was an emoticon for "praying"... I'd be posting two full lines of them!!! ;D
 
According to my official Northrop documentation the N-3 is described as follows: N-3, single-engine float-equipped patrol bomber; N-3PB for Norway.
-SP
 
Nice job, Paul. I am still kicking myself for not making a copy of the Northrop AD "N #" log book when I was in charge of it!

BillRo
 
BillRo said:
Nice job, Paul. I am still kicking myself for not making a copy of the Northrop AD "N #" log book when I was in charge of it!

BillRo
Click to expand...

And you should!!! LOL ;D

Well, at least not all the data has disappeared; we have all collectively reconstructed quite a bit of the list already, and though all the various sub-versions will be more difficult to trace, most of the missing basic N- designations will eventually be found sooner or later I guess. When you see the stuff that shows up on eBay at times, you end up thinking nothing's impossible, really...
 
Hi All!
N-227
Project Mercury proposal
N-267
US Army VTOL Fan In Wing, based on T-38
N-350
VTX-TS proposal, USN
N-351
VTX-TS proposal, USN
N-366
Fighter Escort proposal , NASA/AMES and USN
N-382
STOVL Fighter proposal
 
Please use the Northrop designations in the "Designation Systems" section for discussing or submitting designations.

Paul's purpose in recreating a list in the "Forum Index" section may not be cristal clear, even to me, but let's leave him to finish the job so we can see where he's heading... ::)
 
The idea is to collect the data from the Designation Systems topics into (eventually) definitive lists, so the correct place to discuss mistakes and additions is there, not here. I'll make this part read-only to ordinary users.
 
From Flying Review 1/1965,


here is a more info about Northrop N.285A & N-285B.
 

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N-196: Northrop Aircraft, Inc.'s bid for the USAF's WS-131B (Weapon System-131B). Competition won by North American with what would become the Hound Dog missile.

http://ghostmodeler.blogspot.com/2014/02/northrops-n-196-passed-over-hound-dog.html
The N-196 was to be the joint effort of the Northrop Aircraft Inc.’s Aircraft Division, Radioplane Division and Anaheim Division, with program lead by Aircraft Division. By this time (July 1957), William F. Ballhaus had succeeded Edgar Schmued as engineering V.P. while retaining the Chief Engineer title. Welko Gasich continued as Preliminary Design Chief (see airspace. Sept. 2012).
Click to expand...
 
Last edited:
Hi
To all
I would like to ask to all of you, if any one knows a photo o draw of a Northrop N-3PB Nomand load with torpedo?
As far I know ( in most articules that I read the weapons load ), the AC have the hability to carry 1 torpedo. (2000pounds /910 kg torpedo)
But the only photo loaded, was with this stores that shows the photo (AC in the museum)
put this query here, because it is not necessary to open a thread
Thanks

noto.jpg
 
Maybe you could find a picture with torpedo, but I doubt it would be an operational case.
AFAIK the No 330 (Norwegian) Squadron RAF in Iceland only flew antisubmarine and convoy escort patrols. Hence depth charges and bombs.
 
dan_inbox said:
Maybe you could find a picture with torpedo, but I doubt it would be an operational case.
AFAIK the No 330 (Norwegian) Squadron RAF in Iceland only flew antisubmarine and convoy escort patrols. Hence depth charges and bombs.
Click to expand...
Thank dan-inbox
last question
The external store from the photo, are Deph Charges correct?
 
This seems to be as good a place as any to post this.... A late-'50s/early-'60s Northrop Corporation promotional film posted today (16-Dec-2021) to YouTube by Periscope Film. Among the Northrop divisions/projects mentioned are Nortronics and Radioplane, the SM-62 Snark, the T-38 Talon / N-156 (F-5), KC-135 and 707 subcontracting work, MIM-23 Hawk missile, and F-89 Scorpion.
YouTube - Periscope Film: "'CAPABILITIES' NORTHROP AIRCRAFT 1960s PROMO FILM SNARK MISSILE F-89 SCORPION T-38 TRAINER 79234"
 

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