Luftwaffe: Secret Bombers of the Third Reich

newsdeskdan said:
I'm not so bothered about 1919 to 1938 but beyond that there are a few interesting tailless things that I don't think have been seen before...
The bit that interests me is how the theory developed and how that led to the various designs. Much of the significant design data came from wind tunnel testing and suchlike, and seeing that story brought to life in the accompanying text would be ideal (hint!).
 
PaulMM (Overscan) said:
Orionblamblam said:
newsdeskdan said:
What do you suggest?

"Secret Nazi Faster-Than-Light, Antigravity and Time Travel Projects of World War II, 1946-2017."

You *know* it would sell.


"Hitler's Secret Stealth, Hypersonic, Faster-Than-Light, Antigravity and Time Travel Projects" would be even better.

I could do U-boat periscope stealth, Lippisch on supersonics and a Focke-Wulf machine designed to destroy bombers using powerful gusts of wind? Sadly, better writers than myself have already covered the various fields you mention in exhaustive detail.
 
newsdeskdan said:
PaulMM (Overscan) said:
Orionblamblam said:
newsdeskdan said:
What do you suggest?

"Secret Nazi Faster-Than-Light, Antigravity and Time Travel Projects of World War II, 1946-2017."

You *know* it would sell.


"Hitler's Secret Stealth, Hypersonic, Faster-Than-Light, Antigravity and Time Travel Projects" would be even better.

I could do U-boat periscope stealth, Lippisch on supersonics and a Focke-Wulf machine designed to destroy bombers using powerful gusts of wind? Sadly, better writers than myself have already covered the various fields you mention in exhaustive detail.
Nobody has mentioned the flying saucers. Why not? What are you all trying to hide? :)
And for the steampunks among us there is the (genuine) work on coal-burning ramjets to attain such speeds.
 
newsdeskdan said:
I could do U-boat periscope stealth, Lippisch on supersonics and a Focke-Wulf machine designed to destroy bombers using powerful gusts of wind? Sadly, better writers than myself have already covered the various fields you mention in exhaustive detail.

powerful gusts of wind in "exhaustive" detail? That would be a blast, boom! boom! :p
 
As to future projects, I'd say if Crecy ever wants to revamp the German Secret Projects series, then you would be the ideal candidate in my view.
Comparing your two bookzines to some of the speculative and inaccurate GSP entries which are big on colour artists impressions but little real detail, shows what those books could, and should, have been.
 
Do not make the mistake I made of getting the Kindle Edition of LSB. It's like buying a Playboy and only getting only the text when you really bought it for the pictures. I was shopping Amazon and saw LSB and went for it without looking at a sample first. It has only 26 pictures from the same family as the small thumbnails at the lower end of the front cover. You are generally able to return most things to Amazon, but I haven't found a way to get a refund on a Kindle item yet.

I did finally get the proper digital edition of LSB from Pocketmags ( https://pocketmags.com/us ) who I also use for my digital Aeroplane, Flypast, and several other Brit magazine subscriptions. They look great on a 24" monitor and have no physical storage weight or size. Weight has started to become an issue because part of my house has a pier and beam floor and I had to move some stacks recently when I noticed a dip in the floor near a 7' bookcase and some floor stacks. Most of my magazines are now digital and my books will follow as they become available.
 
Hood said:
As to future projects, I'd say if Crecy ever wants to revamp the German Secret Projects series, then you would be the ideal candidate in my view.
Comparing your two bookzines to some of the speculative and inaccurate GSP entries which are big on colour artists impressions but little real detail, shows what those books could, and should, have been.
Amen.
 
Skyraider3D said:
Hood said:
As to future projects, I'd say if Crecy ever wants to revamp the German Secret Projects series, then you would be the ideal candidate in my view.
Comparing your two bookzines to some of the speculative and inaccurate GSP entries which are big on colour artists impressions but little real detail, shows what those books could, and should, have been.
Amen.

The original Midland Publishing GSP trilogy is fascinating, particularly how Schick, Herwig and their editors and translators handled the material, what they used and what they evidently had to hand but chose not to use. Although the three volumes are nicely tied together by their English edition cover artwork, really they're quite different from one another in character.
Luftwaffe Secret Projects Fighters 1939-1945 by Walter Schick is easily the best. Schick has done some research and presents a reasonably accurate set of information about the fighters and their background; but he fails to make clear the narrative structure into which they fit. For example, he discusses the Heinkel P 1078 on p151 and states that it resembles the B&V P 212 but does not state that it actually competed against it, despite mentioning the February 27/28 meeting at which they were compared.
This makes more sense when you consider that Schick originally wrote the German edition of the book in 1994. In his Messerschmitt Geheimprojekte, published two years later, he makes the link much more overt and on p83 shows the six 1-TL-Jager designs that were competing in January 1945. He's done more research, he understands it better (though he still doesn't seem to quite grasp the evolving nature of the competition) and he makes it clearer. But he's run out of time - he had died in the meantime, in 1995 aged 47.
A year after that (1997), the English edition of the 1994 work appears, edited by Ken Ellis and translated by Elke and John Weal, with additional input from Tony Buttler, Martin Derry and Jay Miller. It takes no account of the updates Schick made via Messerschmitt Geheimprojekte but nevertheless, it stands up pretty well overall considering.
Then four years after Schick's first volume, in 1998, the 72-year-old Dieter Herwig adds a second: Luftwaffe Secret Projects Strategic Bombers 1935-1945. I would suggest that Herwig is less interested in examining the bomber projects in context than he is in simply presenting as many as possible along with their projected dimensions and performance. In fairness to him, where most of Schick's 3-views were re-draws (something he corrects in Messerschmitt Geheimprojekte), most of Herwig's appear to be real-deal reproductions of originals. Yet sadly he demonstrably makes stuff up too. For example, the infamous map of New York on p46 is the one lifted from Sanger's rocketbomber proposal - yet it's presented as "an original OKL map dating from 1943".
His history of the Ju 287 on p50 is woeful and his account of the 'Daimler-Benz projects' on p77 betrays a fundamental misunderstanding of how the 'projects' were intended to work. Ditto the account of the He 343 on p81. On p102, some of the material on the Arado E 470 is accurate but then he tacks on the line "this project series, too, was rejected by the RLM without any further reason being given", which again indicates a misunderstanding of the original material.
The English language version duly followed two years later in 2000, translated by Elke and John Weal, and the factual anomalies of the original German version go unremarked upon.
Finally, we have Luftwaffe Secret Projects Ground Attack & Special Purpose Aircraft by Herwig. The German original appeared in 2002 and its content really only paid lip service to its title - most of it was about fighters or bombers that were missed out of the first two books. Basically he seems to have thrown in everything he had. He even has a second stab at the Arado E 560. In his bombers book, he'd written: "These project studies were among the last proposals to be submitted to the RLM in the final weeks leading up to the end of the war. Very few documents relating to them have survived." But then he goes right ahead and dates the E 560 designs as 1943/44 in the spec panels. Four years later (between German editions) on p102 of the Ground Attack book, he takes a much more detailed look at the E 560 (though he still doesn't really understand it).
What's most remarkable about this third volume, in the English version (2003), is Ted Oliver's input. Oliver not only translates it but also, for the first time, offers a running commentary which actually points out some of Herwig's errors and inconsistencies as it goes along. There's a 'publisher's note' on p7 which makes it plain that some of Herwig's original material was provably inaccurate, necessitating "some significant changes in sequence and content". Oliver doesn't seem to have had access to any original documents, but does have an encyclopedic knowledge of everything that's been published so far by everyone else - some of which is apparently much more convincing than Herwig's material.
Then five years later (2008) Herwig himself died, aged 82 or thereabouts, bringing the series to an end as a trilogy.
Both Schick and Herwig did valuable work in bringing to light some projects which might otherwise have remained undiscovered but Herwig in particular also managed to muddy the waters with some glaring errors which have been repeated endlessly as fact by others ever since. He even included some of the dodgy 'animal names' Messerschmitt types in the ground attack book (p130-133). It's 20 years next year since the trilogy began (English version) and it'll be interesting to see what the future holds for these increasingly outdated, yet still undoubtedly popular, works.
 
steelpillow said:
:eek: ... :) ... and?

I think it's already printed. BSP5 was my ninth book length publication, Luftwaffe Secret Bombers was my tenth. My eleventh is another Mortons bookazine but it's not secret projects related. I don't know if I can say anything about it at this stage.
 
"Do not make the mistake I made of getting the Kindle Edition of LSB."

I made the same mistake. Whoever knocked up the Kindle edition should be TWEP'd.

Chris
 
CJGibson said:
"Do not make the mistake I made of getting the Kindle Edition of LSB."

I made the same mistake. Whoever knocked up the Kindle edition should be TWEP'd.

Chris

The papery version is the one I made. Beyond that format, over which I can exercise considerable control, I'm afraid I have absolutely no influence or control.
 
On a road trip from Georgia to Pennsylvania for Thanksgiving, I was determined to try every Barnes & Noble bookstore en route until I found it. I finally did on the second day at a B&N along I-75 between Cincinnati and Dayton. (I figured that the proximity to the Air Force Museum, which I was on my way to visit, might have made the difference.)

I didn't stop at any more stores during the trip, so I don't know how widespread the distribution was. But on my return to Atlanta, the first B&N I tried, a store that did not get the previous companion volume, had an ample supply, so this one may be easier to locate than the first one.

(Be forewarned that B&N seems to have it listed under an incorrect title, actually the title of the first volume (Secret Jets). But the on-sale date of 18 November 2016 gives it away as the new volume.)
 
Finally got mine here in El Paso, TX. Dan, I have to say you did a great job! Outstanding!
 
Where some books that cover this subject recite details of design and development, the ‘who’, ‘when’, ‘where’ and ‘what’ of a narrative, the most useful and illuminating answer the question ‘why’? Dan Sharp’s new book is one of these and it brings the clarity of context to the subject matter. The writing is informed and clear and the information extremely interesting and useful.

The book is inexpensive and my only complaints have to do with the choices made in designing it. The book is rich in detail but the design feels cramped because of the amount of information jammed into the pages. Many of the reproduced original documents require strong lighting and a magnifying glass for old eyes such as mine but I must caveat that complaint by noting that the quality of the printing is high, so even under a magnifying glass information is legible. It is also priceless to have reproductions of the original documents to hand. However I would rather have paid twice as much and had the illustrations produced on a larger scale. Perhaps that’s just me.

Perhaps something similar to what Paul Martell-Mead and Barry Highgate did with Camm’s Last Fighter Projects could be accomplished where details that had to be left out of the finished book were made available online with proof of purchase? In this case larger scale reproductions of documents might be made available online with proof of purchase?

The cover design is, erm, striking and I know it would have been designed to promote sales but this book is essentially a scholarly work. You wouldn’t know that from the front which (I assume) is designed to attract attention on a magazine stand.

Also, book publishers, repeat after me; ‘WE must never, ever EVER put an illustration across the gutter’.

Anyway enough of my complaining! On balance I would recommend this book highly. Even if you have a lot of books on the subject matter Mr. Sharp’s brings new information and, crucially, insight based on an understanding of the political and strategic imperatives that drove the design processes. The cover price is worth it for the transcript of Goering’s speech on pages 54-57 alone!
 
Nick Sumner said:
The design feels cramped because of the amount of information jammed into the pages. Many of the reproduced original documents require strong lighting and a magnifying glass for old eyes such as mine... I would rather have paid twice as much and had the illustrations produced on a larger scale. Perhaps that’s just me.

Perhaps something similar to what Paul Martell-Mead and Barry Highgate did with Camm’s Last Fighter Projects could be accomplished where details that had to be left out of the finished book were made available online with proof of purchase? In this case larger scale reproductions of documents might be made available online with proof of purchase?

Also, book publishers, repeat after me; ‘WE must never, ever EVER put an illustration across the gutter’.

Thanks for the review Nick - I'm pleased you enjoyed it. The full transcript of Göring's Carinhall address was something I felt needed to see the light of day (though I'd rather it hadn't eaten up four whole pages). So many other works make reference to it but none that I've seen offer more than a line or two of the actual text. And even those that do offer a quote, without citing any examples, seem sometimes to... bend the phrasing a little.
Before I address your other points, it's worth mentioning that this is a bookazine, rather than a book. Whenever anyone asks me, I define a bookazine as the contents of a book in a glossy magazine format. However, in truth the nature of bookazines is more complex than that rather glib summary might suggest. They are commissioned, created and distributed in a way that might seem alien to book authors and I am grateful to Mortons for allowing me the opportunity to present my work via this format - and for giving me a free hand to write and arrange it as I see fit.
The first volume in this little series - Luftwaffe: Secret Jets of the Third Reich - sold out as a hard copy some time ago and is now only available in digital format. Unlike books, bookazines very seldom get reprinted - so if you do have a copy it's perhaps worth holding onto.
As to the design...
My objective, rather than presenting a portrait of each German WW2 bomber project in turn, was to set each of them in the correct historical context. In attempting to do this, my research of the original documents produced some surprising findings which unfortunately seemed to run contrary to the established 'facts' regarding German secret projects.
As a result, I have attempted to squeeze in as much corroborative evidence as possible to support my assertions. But a bookazine also needs to be fully illustrated if it is to sit alongside its contemporaries and competitors in the magazine rack. The byproduct of this tension, therefore, is the admittedly rather cramped layout you mention.
Finally, I'm afraid that making the documents available at a higher resolution is not something that has been considered for Luftwaffe: Secret Bombers of the Third Reich.
 
I reckon what would be great is once you've done a number of these excellent bookazines, to re-edit the contents into a large-size hardcover "proper" book, indeed with key drawings being allowed more space.
 
My copy finally arrived from the UK after the Christmas rush and I have to say I find it a most enlightening and enjoyable read with lots of new information (at least to me). Bravo, sir!
 
elmayerle said:
My copy finally arrived from the UK after the Christmas rush and I have to say I find it a most enlightening and enjoyable read with lots of new information (at least to me). Bravo, sir!

Thanks - some of it is new information to everyone, I think.
 
Really great work! and as it was previously commented "...it a most enlightening and enjoyable read with lots of new information..."
Congratulation!
 

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