KRIEGSMARINE CENTRAL - KM Ship Plans/Discussion

[alexi]

Look for RM20/2443 if you have not already. I haven't been able to give it a close look, but I believe it is the same version from Appendix

They're quite different in some areas and what @drwells42 mean is he want the plan directly from the archives but the said plan (very likely in RM 7) which many haven't digitalized yet.

 

[drwells42]

They're quite different in some areas and what @drwells42 mean is he want the plan directly from the archives but the said plan (very likely in RM 7) which many haven't digitalized yet.

Note the differences in the midships catapult, and the locations of the 105mm DP mounts. Hangars are different too. I think that Entwurf 3 is more logical.

DRW

 

[_Sarcasticat_]

Note the differences in the midships catapult, and the locations of the 105mm DP mounts. Hangars are different too. I think that Entwurf 3 is more logical.

DRW

It is also closer to O in appearance and layout. I wish the date on 3 was legible.
I just noticed the 3 hull-mounted torpedo tubes. Very close to O, I would say. I'd say this is one of if not the last designs for P before the swap to O (May '39).

 

[drwells42]

I don't have good access to my scanner right now, but Dulin & Garzke have a cross section of H-41 on pg 321 which shows the armor improvements. 150 mm deck armor. . "Battleships: Axis & Neutral Battleships in World War II"

DRW

OK, it only took a month, but I got to my scanner. Here's the H-41 cross section from Dulin & Garzke, pg 321.

 

[alexi]

Check RM7/2359 if you haven't, 13500t light carrier plan can be found here and there are several preliminary schemes with different elevator arrangements, flight deck length and position of trolley catapults, also Wilhelm Hadeler's 19250t carrier data as well which pretty much the Graf Zeppelin.

Here's one of the preliminary scheme show a trolley catapult mounted under the flightdeck in the hangar deck allowing carrier to launch aircraft in a quick successions.

 

[Roodbaard1958!]

For unrelated German/KM stuffs, there are also carrier conversion plan for French cruiser Foch of Suffren-class and Dutch cruiser Tromp, these are black and white prints, likely are photographed by German invasion forces, i will post them later.

I am very curious to see the conversion plan for the Dutch cruiser Hr.Ms. Tromp

 

[Roodbaard1958!]

Ah, sorry for my bad english, there's carrier conversion for French heavy cruiser Foch, not Tromp.

No problem, thx for response

 

[alexi]

No problem, thx for response

My bad again, isn't Foch carrier conversion, is PA16 aircraft carrier construction plans (Joffre-class), the said documents are full of photographed ship plans but they're in messy orders (these are either captured or copied plans), two plans for Joffre-class carrier, several plans of Foch (her armor layout distribution, cut-sections hull for turret, machinery, catapults and her hull armored bulkheads), Tromp have the most ship plans.

 

[Sanglune]

Haven't touch on invenio for months, there are a lots of new digitalized documents and files, here's the already know Dutch battlecruiser project, pretty straight forward, for the source is RM 20/1912, it also contains Z-plan schedule boards (the warships construction dates, planned commissions and laid downs etc, i will post them later).
I was going to download whole of them but my third world toaster can't handle it, sorry for the images quality.

My bad again, isn't Foch carrier conversion, is PA16 aircraft carrier construction plans (Joffre-class), the said documents are full of photographed ship plans but they're in messy orders (these are either captured or copied plans), two plans for Joffre-class carrier, several plans of Foch (her armor layout distribution, cut-sections hull for turret, machinery, catapults and her hull armored bulkheads), Tromp have the most ship plans.

I had requested both earlier this year. The stuff that came out of everything was mostly already known. The only significiant finding worth sharing was a Lyon-class which I at the time just posted on my blog.

Source:
RM 3/23509 - Skizzen von Linienschiffen und Kreuzern verschiedener Länder
https://invenio.bundesarchiv.de/invenio/direktlink/9dd9f440-134a-4c5e-9407-1ce442b759d9/

 

[Force Lord]

Do I need to register with Invenio to see these documents?

@alexi Do you know when that 13500t carrier was designed?

 

[alexi]

I had requested both earlier this year. The stuff that came out of everything was mostly already known. The only significiant finding worth sharing was a Lyon-class which I at the time just posted on my blog.

Is possible if you can find any scans of German exported battleships for Dutch navy @Sanglune?

Do I need to register with Invenio to see these documents?
@alexi Do you know when that 13500t carrier was designed?

Some scans are available for public, just click on "Digitalisat anzeigen", the only matter if you know how to navigate the archives.
Haven't got the time to read it yet, but the preliminary schemes of the 13500t carrier are dated around 1938.

 

[odd.ben]

Hei

Jeg har lett her og i bundesarchiv, men jeg finner ikke en generell ordning for Tirpitz malm Blucher.
Does anyone have a scanned file og that?

 

[_Sarcasticat_]

Check RM7/2359 if you haven't, 13500t light carrier plan can be found here and there are several preliminary schemes with different elevator arrangements, flight deck length and position of trolley catapults, also Wilhelm Hadeler's 19250t carrier data as well which pretty much the Graf Zeppelin.
View attachment 744129
Here's one of the preliminary scheme show a trolley catapult mounted under the flightdeck in the hangar deck allowing carrier to launch aircraft in a quick successions.
View attachment 744130

That 13,500t plan looks essentially to be Flugdeckkreuzer EIV - though more likely a variation, as there are some minor differences. Still very interesting.

 

[Sanglune]

Is possible if you can find any scans of German exported battleships for Dutch navy @Sanglune?

Some scans are available for public, just click on "Digitalisat anzeigen", the only matter if you know how to navigate the archives.
Haven't got the time to read it yet, but the preliminary schemes of the 13500t carrier are dated around 1938.

I have 3 pictures of GW 772 from Klaas Meijer's twitter.
There's also B&V Design C from Warship International, N°4, 1989.
Then there's another drawing from WI N°3 1970.
A bunch of pictures of frames that I don't remember (probably attachements with the articles)
And some low res plans from "1915", I think I got them from Maritiem Digitaal

That's about everything I have from German battleship drawings.

However, I do know where they're stored at in the Dutch archives.

Pieces pertaining a battleship tender Blohm & Voss, Germaniawerft, contains 15 ship blueprints
NIMH 057 Losse Stukken 2604

Pieces pertaining a battleship tender Krupp (dust jacket drawings 772 20700t, 743 21300t, 753 22000t, dust jacket with drawings and proposal 806 25000t, dust jacket drawings 806 25000t, construction manual 806)
NIMH 037 Scheepsbestekken en -Deviezen 1904 - 1909

Although I am currently somewhat in a position to go to these archives there are a few issues.
- The archives currently fall under export control measurements due to a certain incident in the east of Europe, so I will have to sign an NDA preventing me from even telling what I find let alone taking pictures like I normally would.
- They currently have technical issues with their depôt
- Even if I could visit, it's still a bit of a jaunt to go there so they're currently not my top priority in lieu of more active research targets.