Hawker Hunter Precursor and Follow-on Projects

[Arjen]

The Putnam Hawker by Francis K Mason also has XF378 as the P.1109B.

 

[yellowaster]

Thanks for the replies and additional info. Yes - XF378 - a typo on my part.

AI Mk 20 was a pretty basic radar which must have contributed (in some way) to the non-takeup of the P.1109. However, AI Mk 20 was built to the same form factor as AI Mk 23 so, in theory the P.1109 could have been fitted with the latter radar. That would have produced a much more formidable all-weather fighter. Of course, I imagine cost and availability (I presume all AI Mk 23 production was spoken for) would have made that a non-starter. I don't suppose anyone knows how much an AI Mk 23 set cost ? Or a Hunter F.6 ?

 

[Hood]

WW594 and WW598 were definitely in an F.6 serial block.

The latest Air Britain round up of F.6 Hunters has the following for XF378:

XF378 A/Cn 30-8-55 Hawker 29-9-55 arr 29-9-55 - AI testbed possibly at Baginton, transfer against quota in exchange WW594 18-4-56 to 3-12-56. TI PFC system improvements AAEE 30-5-57 arr 21-10-57. TI PFC system Hawker Dunsfold 1-1-58 arr 2-1-58. Flight trial aileron control system. Port u/c up ldg Dunsfold 1-4-59 (DBR rear fuselage fire). Sold Hawker 8-7-59 (Said to be P1101B).

I believe P.1101B is a typo for P.1109B. But interestingly Keith Wilson-Clark in his entry does not confirm the subsequent history.

There was no XF398, that fell in the security blank block between XF389 and XF414 of the Armstrong Siddeley F.6 batch of 100 (the latter blocks being XF373-389, 414-463, 495-527).

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

From Tony Buttler:

"I have checked my book 'The Design and Development of the Hawker Hunter' (History Press 2014 - cannot believe it is nearly 6 years old!) and it appears that all three P.1109s were built as standard Mk.6s, but converted very quickly. Dates are included. Blatant advertising I know, but the book contains a pretty full and in depth review of the P.1109 programme."

 

[SpaceRanger]

Are there any published dimensions for the P.1091 Delta Hunter?

 

[lostcosmonauts]

Are there any published dimensions for the P.1091 Delta Hunter?

I've got a 3 view drawing of the delta P.1092 which has a scale bar and gives an overall length of 55ft 0inches but can't find anything on a P.1091. Were they related enough to compare the drawings and figure out the P.1091?

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

Checking. While you wait, here's a canard delta Hunter

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

P.1191

F.3/48 Hunter with 60° delta wing, one reheated 8,000lb (35.6kN) Sapphire 4, four 30mm Aden cannon, 15.10.51. Max. speed Mach 0.98, span 33ft (10.Im), length 41.92ft (12.8m), wing area 510ft (47.4m). Study undertaken with Avro (presumably to use the sister company's delta experience).

Source: Tony Buttler, British Jet Fighters Since 1950

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

Checking. While you wait, here's a canard delta Hunter

As Ralph Hooper said to me - "it must have seemed like a good idea at the time"

 

[TsrJoe]

now that is very different, the canard is a new one to me is there a P. number or date for the drawing, or any noted dimensions

cheers, Joe

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

It was on P.10 of my P.1121 book Its a Ralph Hooper sketch from 1953 according to some text on the original drawing I just noticed. It went no further than that, no P. number I know of. Ralph couldn't remember it, so it didn't make much impression even on the person who drew it

It was in the Hendon collection, and appears to have been marked up use for a brochure by whiting out all the details.

 

[Hood]

You can certainly see the roots of the P.1121 in this sketch, not much of the Hunter lineage left in it for sure!

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

Yeah it's actually got nothing Hunter specific left other than a basic family resemblance.

 

[blackkite]

Hi! P.1100.
https://uamf.org.uk/viewtopic.php?f=357&t=14398

 

[blackkite]

Hi!

 

[Jason Dykstra (Wyvern)]

Interesting, I never knew that the P.1083 had been in the beginning processes of construction. Are there any photos of it? What was constructed, and what percentage of it was completed?

 

[blackkite]

Hi!

 

[TomcatViP]

Lebanese (indefatigable) Hunter to be reborn (again) for an aggressor private company in Canada:

The commander of Lebanon’s Air Force, Brig. Gen. Ziad Haikal, recently told Defense News that Lortie Aviation had been in discussions with the service to procure the jets following a visit by company officials.
“After their procurement, the jets will be used as enemy fighters in training with the U.S. Air Force. The Hawker Hunter is a powerful aircraft and very maneuverable, and it fits this type of training,” he said.

Canadian firm begins negotiations to buy Lebanese Hawker Hunter jets

Lortie Aviation was the only bidder for the Hawker Hunters in the third auction that was held Aug. 12.

www.defensenews.com

 

[hesham]

From, Hawker Hunter A Biography of Thoroughbred

 

[F.L.]

According to this article, the Hunter FGA.9 of Zimbabwe AF are still in service ! (It's "Oryx" so really be careful). But one can see them on GoogleMap.
Really the Hawker Hunter will never die !!!

Flying History: Zimbabwe’s Proud Aircraft Tradition

www.oryxspioenkop.com

Thornhill Air force · GVX5+MWG, Gweru, Zimbabwe

âââââ · Ãcole

www.google.fr

-19.444302917458376, 29.85623671734621

 

[hesham]

From this book,have a good night.

 

[hesham]

From this book,have a good night.

I hope someone can do a new book about Hawker Hunter,with acquicition
or review the company's archive, to be such like this great book;

https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/english-electric-lightning-genesis-and-projects-by-tony-wilson.36361/

 

[TsrJoe]

Hawker P.1083 'Super Hunter', ref. Royal Air Force Flying Review, January 1958

 

[F.L.]

Does the Hunters have already been tested with Red Top or Firestreak ?

 

[PMN1]

Does the Hunters have already been tested with Red Top or Firestreak ?
View attachment 712524

I remember reading a phrase a while back on adding a missile to another aircraft, cant remember offhand which and which but it went 'it was like adding an anchor to the aircraft'.......this could apply here.

 

[Apophenia]

Does the Hunters have already been tested with Red Top or Firestreak ?

Yes. Work on Hunters armed with Blue Jay (later Firestreak) missiles began in 1953. Originally, four missiles per aircraft were planned. That was later reduced to twin, underwing Blue Jays and a nose-mounted AI.20 radar. The aerodynamic testbed for the radar nose was Hunter WW594 (aka P.1109A).

Hunter XF378 (P.1109B) had a functioning AI.20 set as well as other changes. To accommodate the weight and forward fuselage reshaping dictated by the search radar, two of the ADEN guns were deleted (along with the 'Sabrinas'). The wing leading-edge 'saw tooths' were also removed. Successful live-firing trials were conducted in 1957 but no orders for Firestreak-armed Hunters followed.

Hunter F.4 XF310 was also converted to P.1109B standards. It was declare surplus to requirements in 1958 and Hawkers converted it to 2-seat T.7 standard for re-delivery the following year. Red Top didn't enter service until 1964.

 

[Jason Dykstra (Wyvern)]

Does anyone have the performance for the P.1083 as built with the Avon RA.7R? All the sources I have found show the performance for the production version with the RA.29, which was never built.