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BLACK_MAMBA
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Great news if true, but I would prefer to wait for actual production photos...
aonestudio
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Would be a good fit to maximize the potential of 50-60 cm diameter class Radar on Tejas. The issue would then be cooling the array and how many modules can be packed.
aperture space utilization wise may favor tile architecture, but cooling may favor brick architecture.
aperture space utilization wise may favor tile architecture, but cooling may favor brick architecture.
Ainen
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They may be talking about air-cooled arrays.
Which, frankly speaking, looks like a very big thing for all light fighters and potentially drones.
Sure, it just took 18 years from 1983 to 2001 to get the first aircraft fly. So see you again in, what, 2040 ?
More akin to a flattened Mirage 2000 (rolled over by a truck ?)
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Ah, this might cap the cooling capacity tho to about 2.3 KW/sqm of antenna aperture. The design strategy then might be to maximize the amount of TRM that can be packed.
For 60 cm diameter aperture and frequency of 10 GHz it correspond to a maximum of 1258 elements, assuming 100% aperture area utilization. Tile architecture could be advantageous here. Going with the 2.3 KW cooling limit will put the average power limitation to 701 Watt. The module peak power will be dictated by the lowest duty cycle it could operate. If we assume 10% then the module peak power would be about 5.6 Watt.
Might not look much but GaN chip can perhaps be made smaller than same GaAs chip of the same power. Thus further facilitating tile architecture.
Range wise, the radar would be slightly above or generally comparable with AN/APG-83. with R90 (Range where probability of target detection is 90%) Is about 127 Km for 3 sqm target and Swerling 1 fluctuation model. The total frame time is 4.25 seconds (correspond to about 0.04 seconds dwell time/beam). If one willing to accept longer frame time e.g 6 seconds (about 0.06 second/beam dwell time), longer range can be attained with cost in update rates. The range would be 149 km for PD=90% with R50 of 219 Km.
bakofbakchods
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Sums up everything wrong with defence development in India. This is for the Kaveri engine program, which was originally aimed at powering the Tejas Mk1 but was decoupled very early on as the development was going nowhere. For a sake of comparison, the Indian government takes pride in spending a combined amount of ~$500 million over a 30 year period on the GTRE Kaveri program.
It seems like GTRE is saying that all issues on the Kaveri is solved. There were major screeching problems in the afterburner discovered during flight trails in Russia many years back. Creep and screech & combustion instability in the afterburner were major issues with the Kaveri. However, even if the Kaveri gets certified in the next few years, it still wont be used in any platforms. A Marine variant of the Kaveri is in development to power future warship projects
Projects taken with various institution.
Facilities
____
Some other slides about the Kaveri program which i took from twitter. This 15hr seminar took place over the last 2 days and was streamed on youtube for a while but it was removed yesterday. Maybe revealed too much stuff?
Comparing the kaveri engine with it's demonstrator
In house design methods developed and validated
There are some key gaps which need to be fulfilled and where investments have been made.
Material configuration of kaveri engine
•Kaveri problems
>These were the problems kaveri engine faced during its development time,but good news is all of these problems have been successfully solved
It seems like GTRE is saying that all issues on the Kaveri is solved. There were major screeching problems in the afterburner discovered during flight trails in Russia many years back. Creep and screech & combustion instability in the afterburner were major issues with the Kaveri. However, even if the Kaveri gets certified in the next few years, it still wont be used in any platforms. A Marine variant of the Kaveri is in development to power future warship projects
Projects taken with various institution.
Facilities
____
Some other slides about the Kaveri program which i took from twitter. This 15hr seminar took place over the last 2 days and was streamed on youtube for a while but it was removed yesterday. Maybe revealed too much stuff?
Comparing the kaveri engine with it's demonstrator
In house design methods developed and validated
There are some key gaps which need to be fulfilled and where investments have been made.
Material configuration of kaveri engine
•Kaveri problems
>These were the problems kaveri engine faced during its development time,but good news is all of these problems have been successfully solved
Cannonfodder43
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That's a remarkable amount of technical details to have so publicly revealed in a seminar.
That said, once the Key Gaps are addressed, it will be interesting to see where this goes. Developing prototypes is one thing, mass production is another. And given the nature of Indian Defense procurement, I am not sure if they can smoothly set up native production to eventually supplant the F404's as China is doing with the WS-10's and the AL-31s without strong, efficient planning and government backing.
I mean, in all likelihood given time they will, but the lack of visible applied progress is not inspiring.
That said, once the Key Gaps are addressed, it will be interesting to see where this goes. Developing prototypes is one thing, mass production is another. And given the nature of Indian Defense procurement, I am not sure if they can smoothly set up native production to eventually supplant the F404's as China is doing with the WS-10's and the AL-31s without strong, efficient planning and government backing.
I mean, in all likelihood given time they will, but the lack of visible applied progress is not inspiring.
Last edited:
isayyo2
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Indian LCA combat aircraft now being armed with American JDAM precision bombing kits
New Delhi [India], March 29 (ANI): In a major capability boost for the indigenous LCA Tejas combat aircraft, the Indian Air Force is equipping them with American Joint Direct Attack Munition (JDAM) kits which would help them target enemy positions with pinpoint accuracy. The Indian Air Force had...
theprint.in
For some reason I'm really interested on the original 3 tejas from the beginning of the program (TD-1, TD-2 & PV-1). Here is TD-1 in 2009 time after ceasing operations. An unidentified tejas closer to the camera.
This is a pseudo repost of a detailed list i posted in another forum, showing all the prototypes, limited series and...well, every plane of the "test fleet". Hope you like it!
Testing Wings over india - Prototypes, pre-series and others
From the total airframes made till date of the indian LCA, only 24 belong to the two operational squadrons, this two being Sqd. 18 and Sqd. 45...but what about the 16 that remain...?
The answer to our question....a test fleet!
A bit of historical context
The final design of the LCA was consolidated by the end of the 80s much like the work that was undergone to familiarize with its power-plant (the F404 engine, india purchased 6 in 1986), the LCA program was taking shape. With the beginning of the 90s HAL would begin work on the initial examples, this being Technology Demonstrators (not prototypes).
Its worth noting that this extremely ambitious program brought with it a massive jump for the Indian Aeronautical industry, this meant millionaire investments in equipment, tech, training and infrastructure in efforts to face the production of the Tejas.
When the first demonstrator was about to be finished, the nuclear tests done at Pokhran stopped all work that was being done by US and other western companies, leaving HAL to "deal" with the incomplete fighter (at the long run, this would be beneficial for HAL). Years later in 2001 India would be able to put its first demonstrator on the air, marking a milestone on the LCA program, a year from that moment, a second demonstrator would rise to the sky.
With the lifting of the US embargos, HAL would start receiving spares and other equipment that would ease the production of aircraft, from that point on HAL would produce a large number of test units, even to this day. The reasoning behind the large number of units of this class might be given to the fact that multiple of this have different testing objectives (whether a radar, a refueling probe or any other system)
And the aircraft are:
Technology Demonstrators
(Name-markings)
TD-1 (KH-2001)
The first example to be built of the LCA, this started operations in 2001 and ceased years later after 233 sorties.
TD-2 (KH-2002)
Second Technology demonstrator, started operations in 2002 and ceased years later after 305 sorties.
PV-1 (KH-2003)
First actual prototype, underwent the first high performance and armament tests, started operations in 2003 and ceased in 2015 with a total of 245 sorties.
PV-2 (KH-2004)
Second prototype, started operations in 2005, currently grounded after 222 sorties.
PV-3 (KH-2005)
Third example with the prototype designation, started operations in 2006, currently grounded after a total of 387 sorties. This was the first example to perform night operations.
PV-5 (KH-T2009)
First two seater/trainer prototype, started operations in 2009, currently flying with a total of 291 sorties.
PV-6 (KH-T2010)
Second trainer prototype, currently operational with a total of 391 sorties.
Pre-Series
LSP-1 (KH-2011)
First pre series example, started operations in 2007 and ceased flying after 74 sorties, this particular example used a different variant of the F404 engine.
LSP-2 (KH-2012)
Second pre-series example, started operations in 2008 and still operational, amounting a total of 373 sorties. This example carried the definitive variant of the F404 that would be used in the series aircraft. (Today this plane is equipped with the UTTAM AESA radar)
LSP-3 (KH-2013)
First example to be equipped with the ELTA-2032 radar, started operations in 2010, it still flying amounting a total of 556 sorties. (Today is equipped with the UTTAM AESA radar)
LSP-4 (KH-2014)
First example to be equipped with the complete Mk.1 configuration, started operations in 2010, today it still flying, amounting a total of 532 sorties.
LSP-5 (KH-2015)
First example to consolidate the Inicial Operative Configuration (IOC), started its operations in 2010, today it still flying with a total of 573 sorties.
LSP-6 (KH-2016)
Currently being built.
LSP-7 (KH-2017)
Example used for tests regarding armament, it still operational with a total of 436 sorties.
LSP-8 (KH-2018)
Example that achieved the Final Operational Clearance (FOC), started operations in 2018, it still flying today after 348 sorties.
Naval aircraft...
NP-1 (KHN-T3001)
A Mk.1 trainer that underwent a major modification for its "Navalization", started operations in 2012, today it has amounted 200 sorties.
NP-2 (NAVY-3002)
Second trainer modified for naval operations, this particular one had its second seat removed, started flying in 2015, to date it amounted 156 sorties.
The total sorties of all test fleet aircraft amounts...5321 sorties!
hope you like the images !
Testing Wings over india - Prototypes, pre-series and others
From the total airframes made till date of the indian LCA, only 24 belong to the two operational squadrons, this two being Sqd. 18 and Sqd. 45...but what about the 16 that remain...?
The answer to our question....a test fleet!
A bit of historical context
The final design of the LCA was consolidated by the end of the 80s much like the work that was undergone to familiarize with its power-plant (the F404 engine, india purchased 6 in 1986), the LCA program was taking shape. With the beginning of the 90s HAL would begin work on the initial examples, this being Technology Demonstrators (not prototypes).
Its worth noting that this extremely ambitious program brought with it a massive jump for the Indian Aeronautical industry, this meant millionaire investments in equipment, tech, training and infrastructure in efforts to face the production of the Tejas.
When the first demonstrator was about to be finished, the nuclear tests done at Pokhran stopped all work that was being done by US and other western companies, leaving HAL to "deal" with the incomplete fighter (at the long run, this would be beneficial for HAL). Years later in 2001 India would be able to put its first demonstrator on the air, marking a milestone on the LCA program, a year from that moment, a second demonstrator would rise to the sky.
With the lifting of the US embargos, HAL would start receiving spares and other equipment that would ease the production of aircraft, from that point on HAL would produce a large number of test units, even to this day. The reasoning behind the large number of units of this class might be given to the fact that multiple of this have different testing objectives (whether a radar, a refueling probe or any other system)
And the aircraft are:
Technology Demonstrators
(Name-markings)
TD-1 (KH-2001)
The first example to be built of the LCA, this started operations in 2001 and ceased years later after 233 sorties.
TD-2 (KH-2002)
Second Technology demonstrator, started operations in 2002 and ceased years later after 305 sorties.
PV-1 (KH-2003)
First actual prototype, underwent the first high performance and armament tests, started operations in 2003 and ceased in 2015 with a total of 245 sorties.
PV-2 (KH-2004)
Second prototype, started operations in 2005, currently grounded after 222 sorties.
PV-3 (KH-2005)
Third example with the prototype designation, started operations in 2006, currently grounded after a total of 387 sorties. This was the first example to perform night operations.
PV-5 (KH-T2009)
First two seater/trainer prototype, started operations in 2009, currently flying with a total of 291 sorties.
PV-6 (KH-T2010)
Second trainer prototype, currently operational with a total of 391 sorties.
Pre-Series
LSP-1 (KH-2011)
First pre series example, started operations in 2007 and ceased flying after 74 sorties, this particular example used a different variant of the F404 engine.
LSP-2 (KH-2012)
Second pre-series example, started operations in 2008 and still operational, amounting a total of 373 sorties. This example carried the definitive variant of the F404 that would be used in the series aircraft. (Today this plane is equipped with the UTTAM AESA radar)
LSP-3 (KH-2013)
First example to be equipped with the ELTA-2032 radar, started operations in 2010, it still flying amounting a total of 556 sorties. (Today is equipped with the UTTAM AESA radar)
LSP-4 (KH-2014)
LSP-5 (KH-2015)
First example to consolidate the Inicial Operative Configuration (IOC), started its operations in 2010, today it still flying with a total of 573 sorties.
LSP-6 (KH-2016)
Currently being built.
LSP-7 (KH-2017)
Example used for tests regarding armament, it still operational with a total of 436 sorties.
LSP-8 (KH-2018)
Example that achieved the Final Operational Clearance (FOC), started operations in 2018, it still flying today after 348 sorties.
Naval aircraft...
NP-1 (KHN-T3001)
A Mk.1 trainer that underwent a major modification for its "Navalization", started operations in 2012, today it has amounted 200 sorties.
NP-2 (NAVY-3002)
Second trainer modified for naval operations, this particular one had its second seat removed, started flying in 2015, to date it amounted 156 sorties.
The total sorties of all test fleet aircraft amounts...5321 sorties!
hope you like the images !
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siegecrossbow
I really should change my personal text
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Drop it from orbit.
Wait, what did I miss? When did the development of UTTAM get completed? I've thought it's still on its prototype phase to go along with Mk.2
Im not sure if it got completed, but after being mounted on a testbed business jet, they proceeded to mount the UTTAM radar on 2 Tejas Mk.1 of the pre-series, they already showed pretty decent performance. The whole idea is to have UTTAM mounted on Mk.1A after the 20/21st production unit, Tejas Mk.2 will have a more capable version of the radar.
They sent a commission to evaluate the aircraft, nothing else.
martinbayer
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It's the only way to make sure?
the mk2 uttam is supposed to be delivered this or next month
Last month there were news about it being delivered, however the manufacturer itself came out and said they havent approved this news
dont know what that means ,but the tender delivery period is close
Thats right, apparently there was a leak or something, in the end its close to its delivery (if it wasn't done already).
Thats the aerodynamic model of Astra Mk.1, im not entirely sure, but apparently the missile has already being test fired...no video of that though.
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source might be a bit biased
but offering help with the Flankers does sound enticing, especially given some of the current or potential issues regarding supplies
economictimes.indiatimes.com
but offering help with the Flankers does sound enticing, especially given some of the current or potential issues regarding supplies
India emerges frontrunner for Malaysian fighter jet order
India has offered an attractive financial package for its Tejas Light Combat Aircraft (LCA) and has committed that it can keep Malaysia's fleet of Su 30 jets flightworthy, given the vast spares reserve and technical expertise available with Hindustan Aeronautics Limited (HAL).
It amuses me to no end that they seem genuinely surprised by this:
Power games: Australia may not accept India’s G2G trainer deal
Procurement bluesAustralia may not accept India’s G2G trainer deal Australia may not accept India’s government-to-government (G2G) defence deal offer for the su
www.newindianexpress.com
kaiserd
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It’s a bit like a football (soccer) news headline along the lines of “Team X didn’t win”.It amuses me to no end that they seem genuinely surprised by this:
Power games: Australia may not accept India’s G2G trainer deal
Procurement bluesAustralia may not accept India’s G2G trainer deal Australia may not accept India’s government-to-government (G2G) defence deal offer for the suwww.newindianexpress.com
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Also this.
India bids to sell fighter jets to Malaysia, says six other countries interested
India has offered to sell 18 light-combat aircraft (LCA) "Tejas" to Malaysia, the defence ministry said on Friday, adding that Argentina, Australia, Egypt, the United States, Indonesia, and the Philippines were also interested in the single-engine jet.
kaiserd
I really should change my personal text
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Australia and the “USA”? They don’t appear to be remotely realistic targets, even in an advanced trainer or fighter-lead-in trainer role. Boeing T-7 likely to eat it for lunch re: those countries in the trainer role, zero chance of purchase as a combat aircraft.Also this.
India bids to sell fighter jets to Malaysia, says six other countries interested
India has offered to sell 18 light-combat aircraft (LCA) "Tejas" to Malaysia, the defence ministry said on Friday, adding that Argentina, Australia, Egypt, the United States, Indonesia, and the Philippines were also interested in the single-engine jet.www.reuters.com
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Yeah I was especially mystified by the US as a possible customer comment.Australia and the “USA”? They don’t appear to be remotely realistic targets, even in an advanced trainer or fighter-lead-in trainer role. Boeing T-7 likely to eat it for lunch re: those countries in the trainer role, zero chance of purchase as a combat aircraft.Also this.
India bids to sell fighter jets to Malaysia, says six other countries interested
India has offered to sell 18 light-combat aircraft (LCA) "Tejas" to Malaysia, the defence ministry said on Friday, adding that Argentina, Australia, Egypt, the United States, Indonesia, and the Philippines were also interested in the single-engine jet.
kaiserd
I really should change my personal text
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Maybe by private companies for use in (contracted) aggressor role? Even that seems very unlikely given availability of other probably cheaper and/or more suited-to-or-capable-in-the-role “used” and new build airframes (F-16s, Gripens, the T-7, T-50s, some early-block F-35s in limited numbers, used F-18Es but probably not for a while yet, in theory even early-block Eurofighters may become available, etc. if looking at “current” combat types for re-tasking to this type of role).
TandemHEAT
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I think they included the US in there due to HAL offering the Tejas to the US Navy as a replacement for the T-45.
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Also this.
India bids to sell fighter jets to Malaysia, says six other countries interested
India has offered to sell 18 light-combat aircraft (LCA) "Tejas" to Malaysia, the defence ministry said on Friday, adding that Argentina, Australia, Egypt, the United States, Indonesia, and the Philippines were also interested in the single-engine jet.
Not sure what they smokes, but offering a certain product to everyone and then telling everybody is interested is just a fanny joke!
Since when is the USA interested in getting the Tejas??
Not that much...unless someone wants some new aerial targets
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