litzj said:German was favor for F-86, F-104G, Mako(mock-up trainer), and Eurofighter, (plus Bf109, Fw190) kinds of tactical short range interceptors, except F-4F.
It is interesting to me that Luftwafffe considered long-range interceptor.
litzj said:German was favor for F-86, F-104G, Mako(mock-up trainer), and Eurofighter, (plus Bf109, Fw190) kinds of tactical short range interceptors, except F-4F.
It is interesting to me that Luftwafffe considered long-range interceptor.
Silencer1 said:litzj said:German was favor for F-86, F-104G, Mako(mock-up trainer), and Eurofighter, (plus Bf109, Fw190) kinds of tactical short range interceptors, except F-4F.
It is interesting to me that Luftwafffe considered long-range interceptor.
Is it possible, that German general just want to see something, similar to Tornado - a swing-wing, two-engine combat aircraft and discuss it's advantages and disadvantages with the designers? It's not a big deal to made presentation patch, or even model
Of course, it's also possible, that Luftwaffe studied their future proposals and requirements.
Archibald said:I heard Germany also considered the F-15 and during in the prehistory of the Typhoon (1977) their absolute reference was the F-18L (reference in the sense: smallest and lightest twin jet high performance combat aircraft).
So I'm not surprised they considered the Tomcat at some point in the process.
I often wondered, why did Great Britain created the Tornado ADV alone ? Why was Germany not interested ? it would have been some improvement over the F-4F Phantoms...
Archibald said:I often wondered, why did Great Britain created the Tornado ADV alone ? Why was Germany not interested ? it would have been some improvement over the F-4F Phantoms...
Dynoman said:Its odd to me that the Luftwaffe would have considered the F-14 Tomcat and yet I've never seen anything about Germany consideration of the F-16 Fighting Falcon, especially in the light of sales to NATO countries, such as Belgium, Denmark, Norway, and the Netherlands, as well as other allied countries in the region that also operate the F-16, such as Poland, Greece, Italy, Portugal, and Romania. The only thing that I can think of is Germany's involvement in Europe's EFA program.
I'm still a bit bummed that the type is retired in the USN.
translation
Japanese F-15Js challenge USN F-14s back in 1980 in a mock fight
and F-15s lost
because the F-14s refused to dogfight and used AIM-54s
最強の戦闘機・F‐15のパイロット「イーグルドライバー」から"鷲神"と呼ばれるふたりの男|ニフティニュース
2020年度に、航空自衛隊からF-4EJファントム戦闘機が全機退役する。今、三沢基地で302飛行隊は、F-4からF‐35ライトニング2ステルス戦闘機に機種転換中である。だが、戦力化するにはまだ時間がか…news.nifty.com
How many squadrons would still be operational? Where would spare parts come from? I think the tomcat died the day Cheney ordered tools destroyed.I'm still a bit bummed that the type is retired in the USN.
That decision was pure idiocy.
How many squadrons would still be operational? Where would spare parts come from? I think the tomcat died the day Cheney ordered tools destroyed.I'm still a bit bummed that the type is retired in the USN.
That decision was pure idiocy.
Don't embarrass allies or potential allies or potential customers.BAROBA said:Same old story...
The US got its ass kicked by a backward-ally and now it needs the next-gen fighter to come in and even the score.
Preferably winning by a ratio of 100:1.
The same story has had the US Airforce with F-15's lose to the airforce of India so they needed the F-22.
Just my 2 cents
Rob
In that fight, between the USAF F-15's and Indian Su's, the F-15's were asked not to use their long range RADAR guided BVR missiles in the engagement. Of course they were going to lose against the Su's IR capability.
What was really funny, is later, when the Indians brought their Su's to Red Flag, there was a video of a mission debrief on YouTube of USAF F-16 pilots talking about how they owned the Indians in the sortie because the Indians didn't really know how to fight their Su's. The video was soon removed from the internet.
PaulMM (Overscan) said:There is nowhere implied here that the pilots they trained with shot down "U.S. Air Force and Israeli F-15s and F-16s" BEFORE training them.
Ahh I see. So not only is the skill and ability of the USN able to be transferred to the Iranians across space by their co-location but also backwards through time via previous association. It’s not as if fighter pilot chest thumping was a precarious enough argument to be involved in already but now we have “by association, backwards in time” to someone else… It’s one of the many, many ‘philosophical’ arguments made in the Middle East demonstrating how much better ‘they’ are to the Israelis that surprisingly has never actually been proven in any physical test.
But to the issue in hand the Iranians were training to be ‘competent’ in the F-14 weapon system and used it competently against enemy weapon systems that were far less effective. None of this however implies that they are an ‘expert’ operator of their weapon systems which enables weapon systems to be used to their full ability. As is seen in their results which included plenty combat successes though not without significant battlefield failures like no effective operations over water to defeat the extensive Iraqi aerial interdiction of Iranian oil export shipping. One can’t imagine how if the USN were flying those Tomcats based in Iran that the Iraqis would have launched a single successful strike against Iranian shipping.
Grumman F-14A Model Stores Investigation in the 9x7 Ft. Wind Tunnel (Test No. 97-446), 3/4 Front View, Top
1971
NARA