GA-ASI MQ-9 Reaper

Kat Tsun said:
Losing the drone is preferable to spending money on survivability tbh.
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Disagree, not least because installing the RWR with a recorder now tells you what types of Air Defense system(s) the bad guys are flying.

That's a really important detail for anyone physically flying into that airspace.

And I suspect that the RWR/MAWS pod (without decoys) came up to something less than the load rating of the centerline pylon, so they stuffed a couple sets of chaff/flare launchers into it to bring the pod up to weight.


Kat Tsun said:
The only problem is that Americans, and perhaps just Americans, have trouble making distinctions between mission planning and readiness training. Drones being treated as ammunition for mission planning means they get zero maintenance and crash, like DASH. Drones being treated as needing maintenance means they get survivability pods,
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Which is a cultural issue that needs correction, not a programmatic one.


Kat Tsun said:
which doubles the price of the drone, like Reaper.
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The survivability pod is $10+ mil? Really?
 
Scott Kenny said:
Disagree, not least because installing the RWR with a recorder now tells you what types of Air Defense system(s) the bad guys are flying.
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That's the job of a Rivet Joint, not a Reaper. A Reaper is the piece of easily shot bait that draws attention and allows for EOOB building. The only thing a Reaper can do for building a threat library is identify a particular system based on hyperspectral signature of the launch flare and contrail, which is done with a specific sensor payload and WFOV camera, like Gorgon Stare.

Scott Kenny said:
That's a really important detail for anyone physically flying into that airspace.
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It's also a specific mission.

Scott Kenny said:
And I suspect that the RWR/MAWS pod (without decoys) came up to something less than the load rating of the centerline pylon, so they stuffed a couple sets of chaff/flare launchers into it to bring the pod up to weight.
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It's not about the weight. Putting quality survivability features into a prop robotic aircraft like Predator/Reaper is putting lipstick on a pig.

Scott Kenny said:
Which is a cultural issue that needs correction, not a programmatic one.
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The Japanese had no problem separating the two ideas: DASH received good maintenance and was considered disposable in combat operations. America conflates these concepts. It's a bizarre cultural idea that is constantly reinforced here, and this isn't really helping by putting a protection pod or withdrawing operations from Yemen, or whatever. I suspect the actual reason is that U.S. defense budgets are relatively frozen.

Scott Kenny said:
The survivability pod is $10+ mil? Really?
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Reaper's flyaway costs are a rollercoaster ride, fluctuating from $60 mn/airframe to $15 mn/airframe, because they keep doing stuff to it using budgeted money that might be better allocated simply buying more robots for a war reserve fleet. I think the 2019-2020 jump was Block 50 GCS. I'm not sure what the allocation for 2022-2023 was but I assume that was the acquisition of Block 50 GCS that year.

Adding random survivability features to an ultimately disposable aircraft is kind of silly. Just buy more aircraft and really stretch those triple RPA flight setups the 50s have. Ideally the Reaper should be an American TB-2 or something that is useful for the initial phases of an LCSO before shifting to LIC in an adjacent secondary or tertiary theater.

That said I don't think the actual cost of the plane has ever spiked over $20 million. It's all the other stuff being budgeted for.
 
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Kat Tsun said:
That's the job of a Rivet Joint, not a Reaper. A Reaper is the piece of easily shot bait that draws attention and allows for EOOB building. The only thing a Reaper can do for building a threat library is identify a particular system based on hyperspectral signature of the launch flare and contrail, which is done with a specific sensor payload and WFOV camera, like Gorgon Stare.



It's also a specific mission.
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Which can be done by a Reaper, not just a Rivet Joint.

And I'd much rather risk a Reaper than a 60yo 707 with 30 people on board.


Kat Tsun said:
It's not about the weight. Putting quality survivability features into a prop robotic aircraft like Predator/Reaper is putting lipstick on a pig.
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I think that's the problem. You're seeing Reapers as disposable, while I'm seeing them as attritable. Attritable aircraft need defenses.



Kat Tsun said:
The Japanese had no problem separating the two ideas: DASH received good maintenance and was considered disposable in combat operations. America conflates these concepts. It's a bizarre cultural idea that is constantly reinforced here, and this isn't really helping by putting a protection pod or withdrawing operations from Yemen, or whatever. I suspect the actual reason is that U.S. defense budgets are relatively frozen.
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Right. Cultural problem, not program problem.


Kat Tsun said:
That said I don't think the actual cost of the plane has ever spiked over $20 million. It's all the other stuff being budgeted for.
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Exactly.
 
CIA's Reapers are now covertly flown unarmed over (Northern) Mexico.


The Central Intelligence Agency (CIA) has been conducting surveillance flights with drones over Mexico in partnership with the U.S. neighbor to the south, to gather intelligence on cartels and fentanyl laboratories, according to a senior U.S. official.

The Biden administration authorized the use of MQ9 Reaper drones, which the official said are not armed and "not lethal," over Mexico to focus on locating fentanyl labs and cartels.

President Donald Trump’s administration continued the program, which is being done in coordination with the Mexican government.

The intelligence is shared with the Mexican government, which in turn has the authority to act on shutting down any illegal activities associated with the cartels and labs.
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www.foxnews.com

CIA uses drones to sniff out cartels and fentanyl labs in Mexico: US official

The CIA has been flying MQ9 Reaper drones over Mexico to help sniff out dangerous cartels and fentanyl laboratories, in partnership with the country's government.
www.foxnews.com www.foxnews.com
 
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Scott Kenny said:
I think that's the problem. You're seeing Reapers as disposable, while I'm seeing them as attritable. Attritable aircraft need defenses.
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Question is, what you can really defend them from. Jammer isn't armor, jammer isn't interceptor.
Main threat to US drones, for last few years, were:
358 missile
Short/medium range SAMs in simple conditions
Or harrasement(rarely)

Jammer doesn't seem to be especially influential, but it'll add significant cost, power consumption(of which drone doesn't have much) weight and drag - and will take 1-2 hardpoints.
 

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