Unnerving. With stalemate in Ukraine I knew we would go after Syria sooner or later. When I read rumors yesterday morning of the open A10 attacks on Iraq/Iran reinforcements it spooked me good. Crazy times we live in.
 
That's the point, yes.

The A-10 is not a very survivable aircraft for a war with as much AA as this one. It wasn't a very survivable aircraft fourty years ago. Things have not gotten better.

It's good for moving dirt against dirt farmers.
The Sniper ATP-XR is able to spot targets at ranges the A-10 weapons system cannot kill them.

An easy choice to help fix this would be expediting AGM-179 integration (three shots per station, 12 on the A-10, same drag as an AGM-65K on a LAU-117) rather than going for a GBU-39 which is not really CAS compatible (too slow to target) and requires enormous altitude for useful glide range which the A-10 simply isn't good at.

A more effective solution would be Anduril's Barracuda or Northrop's Jackal which is getting on towards SPEAR-3 ranges of 100-140km.

The Ukrainians are getting their ears twisted by Russians because they won't fly at night and do not have a supporting network of low RCS drones with long range sensors and secure datalinks to provide picture. The Sniper will spot targets at 40nm and engage at 25nm. It has a very powerful, diode pumped, laser and third generation FPA for exactly that reason. In daylight, this is augmented by a pretty decent DTV sensor and some 'sillouhette marker' detection algorithms.

The problem is that it's a very narrow look and we don't have a WAS/MTI capacity _on the jet_ (ASQ-236) to make things better with a high standoff targeter (3-5,000ft) passing LINK-16 data to a low forward shooter (100-200ft) to cue the LDP. The A-10 can do this lolo mission, with ease, because it's slow and heavy controlled with a decent ride zone in the middle of the stick throw that allows for some precision control follow (they were flying it below the trees in the JAWS exercises, back in 76 or so. Scared the hydraulics out of the period Snake pilots). It could do it even better with a more decent autopilot and some PUP'd engines.

Right now, what we need to be aware of is that BRICS is an economic as much as military counter to the state of affairs that is the 'rules based order' and as such it is undermining, quite effectively, the USD. Which means we can no longer count on laying off massive debt as deficit spending via 'joint conference continuing resolutions' which avoid the reality of a budget such as everyone else uses, because BRICS users are simply no longer going through SWIFT portals but rather using alternate electronic 'wormholes' in which money is transferred as X currency to Y bank and then shows up in Z location as the agreed home-state currency value.

If you cannot control exchange ratios in a system you are completely excluded from, you cannot overvalue your overeased currency and with the BRICS users/applicants now making up more of the G20 than the G7 in terms of GDP/NPP, they can begin to push us out of key areas like rare earths, energy and food at an ever increasing pace.

We are in the position we once put the Russians, coming out of the Soviet era in that America simply cannot afford fleets of NGADs and does not have the stones to tell the fighter pilots to 'learn to code' in a massive flip to no-training UCAVs.

That leaves us, again like the Russians, with legacy fleet upgrades which add new tech to old. Like SVP-24, BARS and SOLT-25 putting integrated 4D spatial resolution bombing systems and new thermal optics into Su-25SM3. When combined with the Kh-38, this allows old-school Grachs to be quite effective in a Ukrainian environment, provided they know where the target is from Other Means.

They don't have quite the NCW drone networking and micro munitions which we do (though they are getting there with the I305 LMUR which is better than any Hellfire in terms of targeting flexibility and LOAL self homing...) but they have certainly turned make-do into make-better in ways that are surprising in both their ability to renew large chunks of the USSR air inventory at low cost for a high attrition war. And the ability to reach down, grab hard, and take the billy big balls step on things like ATC/ATA via 'AI' recognitive homing systems. Removing MITL as trigger control on the shooter unless absolutely necessary.

Retaining/ugrading the A-10 offers us a similar capability, especially if we insist on juggling three MRCs at once on a pauper's budget.

The only question is whether things like generator power, display compatibility (HRDS thankfully) and sensor mask angles as well as single-seat doctrinal flexibility (sensor operator and pilot, non-VLO) allows us to make the jet capable of sufficient operational autonomy to handle the likes of a Bandit Boat War, similar to Prime Chance, which the fast movers are not fit for purpose (too fast, too little persistence) or too busy, elsewhere, to undertake.

Our _obsession_ with 'Joint Fires' doctrine as a way to buy everyone into the latest big-budget ante program on a shoestring of servicing and inventory budgeting (no more 25,000 Maverick buys...) has led to some serious shortages in both munition stockpile depth and mission platform autonomy for lower tier threats. This is crippling to our multi-domain ability to respond, rapidly, with small task forces.

We can do better but we need to get off our high horse on CCA-not-NGAD when pilots would as soon make it 'NGAD and no CCA' and we need to accept regional service responsibilities which include deep X wide inventory supply chains of capable standoff shooters that avoid the LOS threat while delivering overwhelming numbers of small powered munition alternatives to the current, &*$#!! Stealth-Only, emphasis on J-series glide bombs.
 
It looks like the A-10 has been busy recently in Syria, from Defense Updates:


Late last month, the Syrian Civil War, which had been in a prolonged stalemate, reignited as rebel groups, led by Hayat Tahrir al-Sham (HTS), launched a fresh offensive. Within 72 hours, the group stormed the city of Aleppo and advanced toward the central city of Hama. Ultimately Assad regime fell and he has taken refuge in Russia.
Following the fall of Aleppo and the rebels’ vow to intensify their fight against Assad’s forces, hundreds of Iran-backed Iraqi militias reportedly entered Syria overnight to support the government. According to unnamed Iraqi and Syrian sources cited on December 2, nearly 300 militants used dirt roads to cross from Iraq into Syria, bypassing official border checkpoints.
Iran, like Russia, has been a steadfast ally of Bashar al-AssadSocial media reports claim that these Iran-backed forces have already been targeted by the United States, allegedly using A-10 Warthog strikes.
In this video, Defense Updates analyzes how the A-10 Warthog is proving its worth in Syria?
Chapters:
00:11 INTRODUCTION
02:18 WARTHOG IN ACTION
04:32 A-10 WARTHOG
07:51 ANALYSIS
 
Certainly there can be rotary shotguns like rotary cannons ?
There can, but the shell design causes issues internally (rimmed shells means you have to pull the shell backwards out of the belt/feed and then push it forward into the chamber) and the shot cup etc would make nasty FOD risks.


And what about a GAU-8 30mm shell adapted with a canister filled with flechette? Drones would fall shred in pieces.
FOD issues.

It's the same reason the 25mm and 30mm guns on the ground use APDS while the GAU8 uses a DU core in an aluminum bullet.



Not sure if this has been asked before, but apologise if it has, if the cold war had continued to this day what do people thing would have begun replacing the A-10s now ? A new build/rebuild or something completely different (or F-35( ?
In the 1990s, either A-7F or a new build plane. A-7s could do stuff that A-10s could not, and A-10s could do stuff that A-7s could not. The A-7F was a lot closer to what the A-10 could do (more efficient engine and more fuel tanks without totally killing weapon capacity), and the F-35 is basically a stealthy A-7.

2000s, probably an LO-shaped but no RAM "something completely different".

Today, I suspect that the Army getting a Tilt-rotor to replace the Apache will buy about 1100-1600 of those and take the actual CAS role away from the USAF. F-35s will fly Battlefield Air Interdiction behind the enemy lines, but the Army tiltrotor will fly up to and on top of the lines.
 
The A-7F was a lot closer to what the A-10 could do (more efficient engine and more fuel tanks without totally killing weapon capacity), and the F-35 is basically a stealthy A-7.
Are you saying that the A-7F had the more efficient engine? If so, could you explain how the F100 was a more efficient engine (I assume measured by SFC or total fuel flow) than two TF34s? Or are you saying that the F100 was more efficient than the TF41 as installed in the A-7D/E?
 
Are you saying that the A-7F had the more efficient engine? If so, could you explain how the F100 was a more efficient engine (I assume measured by SFC or total fuel flow) than two TF34s? Or are you saying that the F100 was more efficient than the TF41 as installed in the A-7D/E?
I think SK meant "more efficient" as in regard to how the SLUFFF (yes triple F) flew like an elegant butterfly while the Hog is underpowered as heck since TF34 is designed to an operating regime so different from the A-7's that any comparison might as well be meaningless.
 
Are you saying that the A-7F had the more efficient engine? If so, could you explain how the F100 was a more efficient engine (I assume measured by SFC or total fuel flow) than two TF34s? Or are you saying that the F100 was more efficient than the TF41 as installed in the A-7D/E?
It could loiter (older A-7s could not effectively loiter), it could get down in the weeds and hunt tanks, it could do most everything the A-10 could.
 
Most importantly the A7s had terrain avoidance radars among other sensors so can fly in weather, of type common in Europe, that the A10 cannot.

Apperantly they also looked at sticking a ground search radar on the A7 as well so that instantly puts it above the A10 in my book.
 
TFR capable pod?

file.php


 

That's a LITENING FLIR targeting pod (not LANTIRN) with the optics ball stowed to protect the lens. The LANTRIN targeting pod looks similar, but has a lot more fasteners on the ball, useful as a recognition feature. The LANTIRN navigation pod with TFR radar and a fixed navigational FLIR was never carried on A-10s, AFAIK.

They did experiment a little with a pre-LANTIRN TFR pod on the A-10, with the idea of eventually integrating the system into the Night/Adverse Weather variant, but that all came to naught.
 
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Also didnt become a thing for the A10 til the late 90s after a upgrade which was well after the A7 had similar gear call the TRAM and got retired.
 
Also didnt become a thing for the A10 til the late 90s after a upgrade which was well after the A7 had similar gear call the TRAM and got retired.

The TRAM (Target Attack Recognition Multi-sensor) was the FLIR/laser system in the A-6 Intruder*, not the A-7.

The A-7E got the Texas Instruments AN-AAR-45 LANA (Low-Altitude Night Attack) pod, which was a FLIR system in a pod that hung from the starboard inner weapons pylon - the first squadron equipped with it was VA-81 in July 1979.

The USAF's A-7Ds only got a fixed-mount AN/AAS-35 Pave Penny laser spot tracker under the intake to allow it to drop LGBs on targets that were being "illuminated" by a forward air controller or another aircraft.

The A-10 also got Pave Penny mounted on a short pylon under the cockpit in 1978 - the pylon was removed in the early 2000s in favor of mounting a Litening or Sniper pod on an underwing pylon - which is carried only when operating at night or when carrying LGBs.


* Hughes AN/AAS-33A. How do I know this so well? Because my time in the USMC (6/81-6/89) after basic and field-related schools was spent repairing the FLIR/laser turret and some of the associated avionics boxes for the USMC's two west-coast A-6E squadrons. When I deployed to Iwakuni Japan in 1984 for 6 months I also worked with VA-105 (USN A-7Es assigned to a land-based far east deployment) - which had LANA pods!


LANA:

A-7E with Texas Instruments AN-AAR-45 LANA (Low-Altitude Night Attack) Forward Looking Infra-R...jpg

A-7E with AN-AAR-45 1 Feb 1982.jpg

USAF A-7D with Pave Penny under the intake:

A-7D with Pave Penny under intake.jpg

A-10 with Pave Penny:

A-10A of 91st TFS flies over French Pyrennes Mountains along French & Spanish border in 1987.jpg

A-6E with TRAM turret installed in the nose below the radar (the turret could be removed and a blank plate installed for flight, but this was rarely done) - the turret has been rotated out of its stowed position (which brings the lenses up to where they are protected from the air-flow):

A-6E on display.jpg

TRAM system:

TRAM installation.png

TRAM installation oblique.png

Turret (receiver group) components:

Receiver Group.gif
 
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Guys, none of this concerns TFR ;)

(You also have to love Grumman 3D sketches. Always among the best long before 3D CAD - If you haven't yet, get a chance to see F-6 Hellcat manufacturing drawings).
 
Are you sure?
Unless the A-10s were staffed/flown/maintained by "volunteers" with every cent of operational cost paid by donations, then yes. Ukraine is nearing exhaustion and is being logical by focusing its few resources on expanding their new F-16 fleet.

I do believe the A-10 in its current form has merit and can survive in a mid-high intensity area like Ukraine (though some on this board would disagree) and I will continue to argue in retaining the A-10 fleet. But forcing another platform with zero commonality onto Ukraine at this time is foolish.
 
Guys, none of this concerns TFR ;)
Well...it does only in the sense that none of the pictured systems actually were TFR, and that the A-10 never had it and probably wouldn't have benefited from it, since it wasn't fast enough to make pilot reaction time an issue. :p
 
I do believe the A-10 in its current form has merit and can survive in a mid-high intensity area like Ukraine (though some on this board would disagree) and I will continue to argue in retaining the A-10 fleet. But forcing another platform with zero commonality onto Ukraine at this time is foolish.

They would certainly be handy.

Ukraine is nearing exhaustion

Despite the damage Ukraine has taken it is far from exhaustion and his quite a few friends to help it, the same can't be said for Russia which has no friends and is facing burnout itself.

No - they have rejected any desire for them.

A pity, IMO the A-10 would be useful for supporting the Ukrainian army.
 
They would certainly be handy.



Despite the damage Ukraine has taken it is far from exhaustion and his quite a few friends to help it, the same can't be said for Russia which has no friends and is facing burnout itself.



A pity, IMO the A-10 would be useful for supporting the Ukrainian army.

The Ukrainian (and Russian) Su-25s have demonstrated why the modern battlespace is very, very dangerous for that sort of CAS aircraft. Forward air defenses have severely depleted both sides, to the point that they are reduced to being basically mobile rocket launchers firing volleys of unguided rockets in effectively indirect fire. That's harassment, not effective CAS.

There's no reason to think that the A-10 would fare any better. Sure, the A-10C can handle precision munitions, but so can the F-16 (and adapted Soviet types). The standard MO for those a/c seems to be to drop a couple of weapons and get the heck out of dodge very quickly, a tactic the A-10 does not excel at.
 
A pity, IMO the A-10 would be useful for supporting the Ukrainian army.
They'd rather adopt everyone's leftover Su-25s, since they know how those break and have spare parts for them.

Crud, if the A-10s go to places that currently have Su-25s, I suspect that those places will ship their Su-25s to Ukraine.
 
They'd rather adopt everyone's leftover Su-25s, since they know how those break and have spare parts for them.

I'm sure that any A-10s sent over would come with spare-parts also the A-10 is basically a flying-tank, it can take damage (And still complete its' mission) that would cripple or destroy other attack aircraft.
 
I'm sure that any A-10s sent over would come with spare-parts also the A-10 is basically a flying-tank, it can take damage (And still complete its' mission) that would cripple or destroy other attack aircraft.
Still works differently from the Su-25, and needs to be fixed differently.
 
The Ukrainian (and Russian) Su-25s have demonstrated why the modern battlespace is very, very dangerous for that sort of CAS aircraft. Forward air defenses have severely depleted both sides, to the point that they are reduced to being basically mobile rocket launchers firing volleys of unguided rockets in effectively indirect fire. That's harassment, not effective CAS.

There's no reason to think that the A-10 would fare any better. Sure, the A-10C can handle precision munitions, but so can the F-16 (and adapted Soviet types). The standard MO for those a/c seems to be to drop a couple of weapons and get the heck out of dodge very quickly, a tactic the A-10 does not excel at.

The issue there is that neither side has control of the air.
 

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