Fail Safe is a very good film.
Dr.Strangelove - historical aspects and discussion
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Fail Safe is a very good film.
Dr. Strangelove also showcased the influence of German technology. Why would someone with a "kraut name" be in such a position? Along with the "surprise" launch of Sputnik in the late 1950s, it was German rocket technology that was developed, not American or Russian.
Few "nuclear war" movies compare to "By Dawn's Early Light." Perhaps even more relevant today.
pathology_doc
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Oh come on, you know who he's really supposed to be.
I haff no idea. The wheelchair?
BlackBat242
OK, I changed my personal text ;)
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martinbayer
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If you really want to get a good look behind the curtain of certain post WWII German born megalomaniac Machiavellians, try this one on for size: https://www.google.com/search?lr=&safe=images&as_qdr=all&q=monty+python+"henry+kissinger"&tbm=vid&sa=X&ved=2ahUKEwjz3d_J3sn_AhVWPUQIHbTMDuMQ0pQJegQICBAB&biw=1920&bih=955&dpr=1#fpstate=ive&vld=cid:ae110f50,vid:SVGV6lvNTR4
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Remember Patrick MacGoohan's line in Ice Station Zebra (released 4 years after Dr Strangelove) to Rock Hudson outlining the backstory of why they are at the North Pole; "The Russians put our camera made by our German scientists and your film made by your German scientists into their satellite made by their German scientists."
The scale models of the MiG 21 fighters are the best of the film.
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American technology? I don't think so.
Henry Kissinger just turned 100. He was a member of the Office of Strategic Services. Mr. Kissinger was born in 1923.
Henry Kissinger’s Documented Legacy | National Security Archive
Washington D.C., May 25, 2023 - As Henry Alfred Kissinger (HAK) reaches 100 years of age, his centennial is generating global coverage of his legacy as a leading statesman, master diplomat, and realpolitik foreign policy strategist. “Nobody alive has more experience of international affairs,” as...
nsarchive.gwu.edu
martinbayer
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Post WWII referred to the period when he acted as a megalomaniac Machiavellian on the world stage, not to his birth date. Pardon my English.
Henry Kissinger just turned 100. He was a member of the Office of Strategic Services. Mr. Kissinger was born in 1923.
Henry Kissinger’s Documented Legacy | National Security Archive
Washington D.C., May 25, 2023 - As Henry Alfred Kissinger (HAK) reaches 100 years of age, his centennial is generating global coverage of his legacy as a leading statesman, master diplomat, and realpolitik foreign policy strategist. “Nobody alive has more experience of international affairs,” as...
Kissinger was about 15 when his family fled Nazi Germany in 1938. Most of his life until he gained any sort of influence was in the US.Post WWII referred to the period when he acted as a megalomaniac Machiavellian on the world stage, not to his birth date. Pardon my English.
Henry Kissinger just turned 100. He was a member of the Office of Strategic Services. Mr. Kissinger was born in 1923.
Henry Kissinger’s Documented Legacy | National Security Archive
Washington D.C., May 25, 2023 - As Henry Alfred Kissinger (HAK) reaches 100 years of age, his centennial is generating global coverage of his legacy as a leading statesman, master diplomat, and realpolitik foreign policy strategist. “Nobody alive has more experience of international affairs,” as...
The Counter-Intelligence Corps, OSS and the British T-Force engaged in cooperative operations during the war.
apnews.com
Former Special Agents of the Army's Counterintelligence Corps Gather With AM-War, Bjt
BOSTON (AP) _ Fifty years after the start of World War II, the white-haired men who have gathered here for a weekend reunion hold the key to one of the military's best kept secrets: the Army's clandestine Counterintelligence Corps.
apnews.com
BlackBat242
OK, I changed my personal text ;)
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You completely missed his satirical comments about the origin of the technology.
"Well, it was the great enormous superiority of American technology, of course, as provided by our great American scientists, such as Dr. Werhner von Braun!"
You see, WvB was German born & raised, and was brought over from Germany after the war, and was not an American at all - thus linking his "American-ness" to that of the technology.
The original line he wrote (and recorded) was: "Well, it was good old American know-how, that's what, as provided by good old Americans like Dr. Werhner von Braun!".
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The ideas that get repeated most often are what remain. I grew up in the 1960s with good, old American know-how. Later, I discovered the most popular stories were stories. The truth was quite different. It was not just the more well-known names like von Braun but Walter Dornberger and Krafft Ehricke, and many others, who provided the know-how. The U.S. used German technology to get to the Moon in 1969. Today, Elon Musk launches a rocket larger than the Saturn V and it blows up shortly after launch. If I was in astronaut training, I think I would consider doing something else.
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Also being of German parentage, I have zero tolerance for Nazi and fascist ideology but accept that my grandfather fought in the Wehrmacht. Could it all have been avoided? Maybe.
OliverSedlacek
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One of my favourite Tom Lehrer songs.
Did anyone understand the entire picture at the beginning? Hitler wanted "living room." The French would get no more money. Everyone would get jobs. Then we had the DAK and the RAD, along with the BDM.
My father was drafted into the Polish Army. He said this about the recruiters who came to his village. "When they come, you have nothing to say. You go." Loyalty to your country.
martinbayer
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My dad was drafted into the nazi WWII army, but since he was in the middle of becoming a catholic priest (which ultimately didn't happen), he was assigned to be a non-fighting paramedic in the Rommel African campaign (he told very few war stories, but one that stuck with me was about an Italian PTSD soldier with a live grenade on his body while being examined for injuries), and he eventually became an exchanged POW. After the war, because he had exactly zero involvement with the nazi bureaucracy, the US forces that were in charge of of re-cultivating Western Germany in our sector made him the Aschaffenburg (my home town, unsurprisingly) city librarian. He instilled in me a sense of decency and civic pride that I try to carry on (though I admittedly still may fall occasionally down on the decency part)...
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Er, actually American rocket technology had far surpassed German rocket technology BEFORE WvB was brought over. The initial idea was not to 'tap' the Germany knowledge but to put it in some out-out-of-way-corner of the country (first Texas and then New Mexico) under lock and key (the scientist and engineers were restricted to base 24/7, under guard, with a requirement they were not allowed to go anywhere without an escort) until such a time as their 'knowledge' was felt to be obsolete enough to allow them to be returned to Europe or released to industry. US post-war budget cuts (thanks Harry) were so severe that almost all the US rocket and missile work was stalled for lack of funding and when the Korean war changed things the USAF got the most missile funding and the US Army turned to try and exploit the Germans again.
The idea that it was "their German scientist" against "our German scientist" was Cold War propaganda in that in both cases ("ours" and "theirs") in fact the "German" scientists were mostly marginalized and isolated.
As usual popular media tends to use and stick to the popular "common knowledge" since more often than not the real 'facts' don't come out till much later.
WvB's "actual" contribution was really his ability to 'sell' the idea of missiles and space travel in a popular manner through proper contacts and media to the general public.
Randy
A certain marginally talented art student somehow gets accepted into art school. The Nazis remain a trivial bunch of street goons and soon fade from history.
Yay!
The communists take over all of Germany, however. France soon follows, as does Italy. Stalin has a front row seat to the English Channel. WWII begins a few years later, and involves beleaguered Britain and the distant US. Famine rampages across Europe as Lysenkoism is official agricultural policy, and Holodomors aplenty sweep the continent. So the western allies face a *huge* army of Soviets, but it's an army that's not only hungry, but internally fighting amongst themselves (go on, I *dare* you to suggest that French, German, Polish and Russian Commies would get along).
Indeed. The US had practical designs for orbital rockets via Douglas, Martin and NAA shortly after wars end, while the Germans did not have anything similar.
Along with my dad, I grew up around other veterans. They rarely talked about what they saw. When they did, it was usually pretty graphic. As he grew older, my father told me a few things. He spent most of the war in Germany as a forced laborer. Some of the published information available today does not mention certain things. The internal security inside Germany for one. My mother, also a forced laborer, was required to have a large letter P sewn on her coat (P for Polen). She had a rifle pointed at her while at a checkpoint. "You are the enemy! What are you doing in my country?!" Fortunately, this young soldier was corrected by the senior officer there.
After the war, the idiot Americans thought they could replace German party members with German speaking soldiers. When things were not getting done on time, they quietly put the "nazis" (Na-Zosialists) back in their positions to get everything moving again. Meanwhile, the "nazi resistance that never happened" had the Counter-Intelligence Corps tracking down Werewolves involved in assassination and sabotage, including using explosives disguised as a piece of coal.
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klem
I really should change my personal text
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www.cairn.info, publishes a collective work on "Représentations de l’arme nucléaire dans l’art et la culture" in ( https://www.cairn.info/imaginaries-nucleaires--9782738155047.htm ) where Michel Ciment treats the subject "Le conflit entre rationalité et pulsions à l’origine de l’apocalypse nucléaire : une lecture du film de Stanley Kubrick" ( https://www.cairn.info/imaginaires-nucleaires--9782738155047-page-87 .htm )-( https://www.jbjv.com/-Imaginaires-nucleaires-.html)
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the delightfully The Mouse on the Moon" 1963 has also spoof Germans scientists on both side of Iron curtain...
Now Peter Seller had to play the President, Strangelove, Mandrake, Major T. J. "King" Kong (including Texas Accent)
For me is unclear what happen, but Seller sprained his ankle and ended up in this Wheelchair.
you notice that at certain point in Movie this three roles are mostly sitting.
His Strangelove accent, he got from Austrian-American photographer Arthur Weegee Fellig,
who worked for Kubrick as a special photographic effects consultant on set.
Fellig voice
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iP4Y_fAvOgY
The black glove is from Kurbrik, who use them to check light bulb on set, who used only one, Seller the other one.
This photo show Strangelove sit in normal chair (im center of picture) Prior to accident ?
The Wheelchair came by accident, literally
Now Peter Seller had to play the President, Strangelove, Mandrake, Major T. J. "King" Kong (including Texas Accent)
For me is unclear what happen, but Seller sprained his ankle and ended up in this Wheelchair.
you notice that at certain point in Movie this three roles are mostly sitting.
His Strangelove accent, he got from Austrian-American photographer Arthur Weegee Fellig,
who worked for Kubrick as a special photographic effects consultant on set.
Fellig voice
The black glove is from Kurbrik, who use them to check light bulb on set, who used only one, Seller the other one.
This photo show Strangelove sit in normal chair (im center of picture) Prior to accident ?
A hundred years today is like 65 years of the last century, in my opinion, if Kissinger watches his diet and performs Pilates exercises he can still prevent the United States from winning another war.Kissinger was about 15 when his family fled Nazi Germany in 1938. Most of his life until he gained any sort of influence was in the US.Post WWII referred to the period when he acted as a megalomaniac Machiavellian on the world stage, not to his birth date. Pardon my English.
Henry Kissinger just turned 100. He was a member of the Office of Strategic Services. Mr. Kissinger was born in 1923.
Henry Kissinger’s Documented Legacy | National Security Archive
Washington D.C., May 25, 2023 - As Henry Alfred Kissinger (HAK) reaches 100 years of age, his centennial is generating global coverage of his legacy as a leading statesman, master diplomat, and realpolitik foreign policy strategist. “Nobody alive has more experience of international affairs,” as...
Yup, I can definitely hear Dr. Strangelove in Fellig's voice. Appropriate that the character was based, at least in part, on a news photographer.
Rhinocrates
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martinbayer
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How convenient...
I was born in Mont de Marsan, only a mile away from the air base where the first squadron of Mirage IVA stood alert in 1964.
Mont-de-Marsan Air Base - Wikipedia
I often have that suspicion the Soviets would have nuked the base and city in WWIII. Luckily my parents moved 30 km away in the remote countryside. Still, we would have been drenched in fallout.
More generally, south-west France being a sparsely populated and the farthest from (East) Germany - a 1000 km diagonal - a lot of test and training bases are there: missiles, parachutists, helicopters, bombing ground... they are scattered between Bordeaux, Toulouse, and the spanish border. My homeplace.
So we would have not seen Soviet tanks for a veeeeery long time, but air attacks and/or nukes would have carpeted our little corner of France.
And if you want a glimpse at "life" in rural France after nuclear WWIII, this is a must read. It scared the living shit out my little self a few months ago.
Malevil - Wikipedia
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Thought Dr. Strangelove was modelled after John von Neumann? The acknowledged to be, by the other Manhattan Project scientists, the smartest one of them.
Speaking of physicists has there ever been a higher concentration of genius as what appeared in Hungary late 19th early 20th century like ever?
Speaking of physicists has there ever been a higher concentration of genius as what appeared in Hungary late 19th early 20th century like ever?
Rhinocrates
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The Fermi Paradox solved!
Leo Szilard, who jokingly suggested that Hungary was a front for aliens from Mars, used this term. In an answer to the question of why there is no evidence of intelligent life beyond Earth despite the high probability of it existing, Szilárd responded: "They are already here among us – they just call themselves Hungarians." This account is featured in György Marx's book The Voice of the Martians.
The Martians (scientists) - Wikipedia
martinbayer
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Where would Finns then fit in that whackajob thought model?
Rhinocrates
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People usually make the link with Edward Teller. There's even a biography of him that says this in its subtitle.
Edward Teller: The Real Dr. Strangelove: Goodchild, Peter: 9780674016699: Amazon.com: Books
Buy Edward Teller: The Real Dr. Strangelove on Amazon.com ✓ FREE SHIPPING on qualified orders
www.amazon.com
According to Wikipedia, Kubrick was in contact with Herman Kahn and met.
Herman Kahn - Wikipedia
Along with John von Neumann, Edward Teller and Wernher von Braun, Kahn was an inspiration for the character "Dr. Strangelove" in the eponymous film by Stanley Kubrick released in 1964. After Kubrick read Kahn's book On Thermonuclear War, he began a correspondence with him which led to face-to-face discussions between Kubrick and Kahn. In the film, Dr. Strangelove refers to a report on the Doomsday Machine by the "BLAND Corporation". Kahn gave Kubrick the idea for the "Doomsday Machine", a device which would immediately cause the destruction of the entire planet in the event of a nuclear attack. Both the name and the concept of the weapon are drawn from the text of On Thermonuclear War. Louis Menand observes, "In Kahn’s book, the Doomsday Machine is an example of the sort of deterrent that appeals to the military mind but that is dangerously destabilizing. Since nations are not suicidal, its only use is to threaten."
The author of the joke was the nuclear physicist Phil Morrison of Los Alamos, in 1946 he wrote the procedure by which the Martians were invading us: they disguised themselves as humans. They could only be discovered by three details: their nomadic nature (the Hungarian gypsies), their language (Hungarian has no relation to any Indo-European language) and they have superior intelligence (Leó Szilárd, Edward Teller, Eugene Wigner, John von Neumann, Dennis Gabor, George de Hervesy and Theodore von Karmán were all born in Budapest).The Fermi Paradox solved!
Leo Szilard, who jokingly suggested that Hungary was a front for aliens from Mars, used this term. In an answer to the question of why there is no evidence of intelligent life beyond Earth despite the high probability of it existing, Szilárd responded: "They are already here among us – they just call themselves Hungarians." This account is featured in György Marx's book The Voice of the Martians.
The Martians (scientists) - Wikipedia
en.wikipedia.org
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It really is a freakish geographic concentration of genius.The author of the joke was the nuclear physicist Phil Morrison of Los Alamos, in 1946 he wrote the procedure by which the Martians were invading us: they disguised themselves as humans. They could only be discovered by three details: their nomadic nature (the Hungarian gypsies), their language (Hungarian has no relation to any Indo-European language) and they have superior intelligence (Leó Szilárd, Edward Teller, Eugene Wigner, John von Neumann, Dennis Gabor, George de Hervesy and Theodore von Karmán were all born in Budapest).The Fermi Paradox solved!
Leo Szilard, who jokingly suggested that Hungary was a front for aliens from Mars, used this term. In an answer to the question of why there is no evidence of intelligent life beyond Earth despite the high probability of it existing, Szilárd responded: "They are already here among us – they just call themselves Hungarians." This account is featured in György Marx's book The Voice of the Martians.
The Martians (scientists) - Wikipedia
Maybe they were deposited by aliens as babies (or even artificial insemination). They were all super geniuses but would only be able to use “earth knowledge/science known at the time. Maybe this happened at other times during earth’s scientific development like in Egypt (pyramids) Greece (Aristotle Socrates Plato) and The Renaissance, Tesla/Edison etc.
Elon anyone? I’m mean sometimes Zuckerberg looks like an alien “play acting” as human.
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