China's PLAN Type 075 LHD & future Type 076 LAH

Anymore news on whether the PLAN are going to be designing a VSTOL fighter anytime soon? It would give the LHDs some more offensive capability instead of just using them for helicopters.
 
No vstol fighter jets, but rumors are abound that the follow up design, the 076, will be designed to use unmanned strike aircraft (among other types)
 
In_A_Dream said:
What is China planning to do with these ships?
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The usual, hosting a beach party on the island of Formosa.


Moose said:
In-deck rather than deck-edge elevators and long, skinny island bring to mind the SCS/Príncipe de Asturias.
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About 50% bigger displacement, though.


FighterJock said:
That is bad news, anyone know how the fire started?
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My money would be on hot work. Welding sparks found something sufficiently flammable.

One refit, we had a welded on my sub catch his jeans on fire. They'd absorbed enough oil to be extra flammable. He was happy the fire watch yelled "spot fire, spot fire" and hosed him down with a CO2.


uk 75 said:
How many ships would it take to lift a PLA armoured or mechanised division?
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One LHA like that typically carries one company and a couple platoons of battalion support company.


uk 75 said:
I think my question is relevent. The number and capability of PLAN amphibious shipping is being treated as if it matches US capabilities. It clearly does not. Moreover the US has WW2 and Korean experience of forced antry and over 70 years experience of unopposed sealift. China has zilch.
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On an individual ship level, I think it does match the US various LHAs. Just doesn't have the mass shipping side of it yet, though I bet the PLAN could press-gang a whole bunch of big Ro-Ros if they needed to.


Archibald said:
gimme a break... the chinese put a miniature EMALS on a LHD to launch drones - because it would take too long to develop a VSTOL F-35 look-alike ?

My mind is blown.

That's a whole new take at the "escort carrier" &"CVL" concepts harcking back to WWII... weird idea. Time will tell if there is any pertinence to it, or if it was just an idiotic move...
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Escort carriers typically carried ASW planes, and that's a place the Chinese are really lacking right now.

In a declared war, the US would be able to absolutely strangle any ships delivering raw materials to China.
 
FighterJock said:
Anymore news on whether the PLAN are going to be designing a VSTOL fighter anytime soon? It would give the LHDs some more offensive capability instead of just using them for helicopters.
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VSTOL jets are a pain in the ass to design and build. How long did it take to get Harrier or F35B working?

A more likely option would be a tiltrotor of some kind, or maybe a reach way back to the F5U Flying Flapjack. Plus you don't need supersonic flight from a vertical takeoff but maybe 0.1% of all flights, so sticking with a subsonic aircraft is better use of designers time.


Moose said:
Curious that neither appears to have any aviation onboard at all during this shoot.
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Ships rarely do have aircraft onboard for sea trials. Barring maybe a helicopter for hauling people around. Lots of pictures of the Ford with a bare flight deck doing max turns and stuff.
 
Scott Kenny said:
Ships rarely do have aircraft onboard for sea trials. Barring maybe a helicopter for hauling people around. Lots of pictures of the Ford with a bare flight deck doing max turns and stuff.
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It may shock you to learn that I'm familiar with sea trials. However, 31 was commissioned in '21 and 32 in 22. The photos FL posted aren't from a sea trials, they're from a PHOTOEX shot during/around a recent exercise. Normally, during such a shoot, PLAN like other Navies will pose aircraft on the decks. It's unusual that they'd put the two ships into formation and do the media thing with bare decks.
 
Moose said:
It may shock you to learn that I'm familiar with sea trials. However, 31 was commissioned in '21 and 32 in 22. The photos FL posted aren't from a sea trials, they're from a PHOTOEX shot during/around a recent exercise. Normally, during such a shoot, PLAN like other Navies will pose aircraft on the decks. It's unusual that they'd put the two ships into formation and do the media thing with bare decks.
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Ah, missed that those were not sea trials, my bad!

Yeah, that is weird. I'd expect a representative deck load for photo ops...
 
FighterJock said:
Never say never Scott Kenny about the PLAN VSTOL, they may design and build a VSTOL fighter in total secrecy and reveal it when we least expect it.
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Possible but unlikely.

I'd sooner expect an Osprey clone as the AEW platform.
 
Why would the PLAN develop an Osprey clone and use it as a AWE platform when they are about to field the KJ-600 AWACs that will be based on the Type 003 aircraft carrier, somehow I very much doubt the PLAN will develop yet another AWACS aircraft.
 
sferrin said:
Possibly when a US SecDef is in town after saying it would take them 20 years to pull it off. :p
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Said SecDef would have to have really pissed off his Chinese counterparts to have them do that.

That's a whole lot of "not giving the SecDef any face" which is generally not something done in Asian cultures (edit) no matter how much they don't like you as a person. (/edit)

I'd still laugh my ass off if they did, mind you.


FighterJock said:
Why would the PLAN develop an Osprey clone and use it as a AWE platform when they are about to field the KJ-600 AWACs that will be based on the Type 003 aircraft carrier, somehow I very much doubt the PLAN will develop yet another AWACS aircraft.
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To be able to use their STOVL LHAs as ASW carriers and their Type 03s as attack carriers.
 
Scott Kenny said:
Said SecDef would have to have really pissed off his Chinese counterparts to have them do that.

That's a whole lot of "not giving the SecDef any face" which is generally not something done in Asian cultures (edit) no matter how much they don't like you as a person. (/edit)

I'd still laugh my ass off if they did, mind you.



To be able to use their STOVL LHAs as ASW carriers and their Type 03s as attack carriers.
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If I remember correctly, the first prototype of the J-20 (2001) had its maiden flight (or was it unveiled) when the US secretary of defence was visiting China.
 
FighterJock said:
Never say never Scott Kenny about the PLAN VSTOL, they may design and build a VSTOL fighter in total secrecy and reveal it when we least expect it.
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Incredibly unlikely. Their CATOBAR aircraft developments are out in the open, and the huge technical challenges of STOVL are not worth the effort for them. There have only been three operational STOVL types.
 
I think that now also Josh-TN, it will just be far too dificult an operation for the PLAN to design and build a VSTOL type aircraft and as you have rightly said there have only been three operational aircraft in aviation history the Harrier Forger and the F-35B. So they might take another look at the concept and stick with CATOBAR type carriers from now on and leave the LHDs to be used as helicopter carriers.
 
Latest update on the first 076 currently under construction at HZ's Changxing Island facility.and as it seems, the bow section or the forward flight deck element has been attached .

(image via @伏尔戈星图 from Weibo)

IMG_4692.jpeg
 
That chinese navy gonna be very impressive when they finish all those big ships. Can't help thinking they are achieving USSR navy dreamed plans of the 1980's...
 
No nuclear cruisers yet though (that we know of at least).
 
After a quite blurry update yesterday, here a very clear image on the 076 LHD and the three 054AG/-mod FFGs revealing some interesting details:It seems to have only one EMALS catapult (port side only) but it seems to have the same length like the one on the Fujian.

(Image via @伏尔戈星图 from Weibo)

IMG_1487.jpeg IMG_1486.jpeg
 
FighterJock said:
An EMALS catapult on an LHD Deino? That would be a world first. I take it that it will be launching UCAVs?
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Chinese pragmatism... they have noted that the USN has turned its largest amphibs into "auxiliary carriers", thanks to the VSTOL F-35B. Since the Chinese have no VSTOL whatsoever (not that they can't do one: rather, lack of interest ?), they put drones instead of F-35Bs, on their big amphibs: to gain some kind of fast-jet capability (strike, for example).

Maybe they are also considering this.
en.wikipedia.org

Unmanned Carrier-Launched Airborne Surveillance and Strike - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Boeing_MQ-25_Stingray

EMALS is really a game-changer for catapults, and the chinese are going all out exploring that new paradigm.
 
That was also my general thinking too Archibald. It would also be capable of operating the new Z-21 attack helicopter since that is also going to be large and heavy from what I have seen on the Z-21 thread.
 
Latest update on the first Type 076 LHD and now it is clear there is indeed only a single EMALS catapult.

(Image via Ricky Un on Facebook)

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Obviously the PLAN are keeping the two catapults for the aircraft carriers and only one for the Type 076 LHD, that would make a lot of sense for the different type of mission that each will perform.
 
Forward island superstructure has been installed...

TaPBgLI.jpeg


Edit:
https://twitter.com/x/status/1839196853121716442
View: https://x.com/RupprechtDeino/status/1839196853121716442
 

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