British T16/48 Spec.

[hesham]

Hi,

the Spec. T16/48 was issued for new piston-powered basic
trainer to replace the Percival Prentice,the contenders were;

Avro-714
Airtech
Air Service Training
Auster AOP A.9
Blackburn B-80
Boulton Paul P.115 & P.116
Chrislea
De Havilland
English Electric
Elliotts EoN 2
Fairey
Folland Fo.132
General Aircraft GAL-?
Heston JC.?
Handley Page Reading HPR.2
Miles M-?
Percival P.56 Provost (the winner)
Planet
Slingsby
Westland

I will explain the Blackburn B-80 and Boulton Paul P.115 & P.116
later,and we know very well the Percival P.56 and HPR.2 and for
Avro-714 it was based on Avro-701,but let us discovered the
other tenders;
for the Eliotts its project was side by side and was designed
by helping of Aviation & Engineering projects Ltd. company
and for the Auster I can't determine its type;
who want to discover with me ?.

 

[Jemiba]

For the Elliotts (EoN) entry, I think it was the EoN 2, AFAIK the only trip of this
company, much better known for their sailplanes, into the world of powered
aircraft. It was described some years ago in an issue of "Wingspan". One
prototype flew for several years, I think, but the production version, with
cut-down fuselage and "bubble canopy" never left the drawing board, IIRC.
Will look for this magazine tomorrow, it's on the attic, and it's too cold now !

 

[hesham]

Thank you my dear Jemiba,

and the most interesting entry as I think,was from English Electric.

 

[hesham]

I swear by my God,

exactly as I expected before,and from the member LAW,the Folland
proposal was Fo.132.

 

[hesham]

Hi,

as the member AM display a site for British Aviation,the Auster
proposal for T16/48 was A.9.

http://britishaviation-ptp.com/id131.html

Also the Avro-714 from Avro Heritage site.

 

[hesham]

Hi Fabulousfour,


the aircraft was built as EoN 1,one only,and after that redesigned as
EoN 2,with new engine,De Havilland Gipsy Major of 145 hp and
lengthened nose-wheel leg,so may be it was EoN 2.

 

[hesham]

Hi,

here is the Boulton Paul P.116 Project.

 

[hesham]

the Spec. T16/48 was issued for new piston-powered basic
trainer to replace the Percival Prentice,the contenders were;

Planet

Hi,

the Planet Company submitted a proposal for this competition,maybe developed
from Satellite ?;

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,1170.msg244361.html#msg244361

 

[hesham]

Hi,

here is the Blackburn B-80 proposal.

 

[Schneiderman]

Westland's project

 

[hesham]

Excellent Schneiderman,many thanks,

if you can help us in other unknown Projects,that will be great.

 

[Schneiderman]

This 1948 design from Fairey was probably their submission.

edit.....more here https://www.flightglobal.com/pdfarchive/view/1948/1948%20-%200163.html

 

[hesham]

Airtech
Air Service Training

Wow,amazing find my dear Schneiderman,

and can I ask you,what was those two companies,we never heard about them except in
this specification,and did they design any other aircraft or Projects ?,and thanks.

 

[Schneiderman]

After the war, and the cancellation of hundreds of contracts, anyone who could hold a pencil and spell the word aeroplane tried to get work by tendering to any specification that came along
Which two companies were you asking about.

 

[Hood]

A potted history of Air Service Training can be found on Wikipedia https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Air_Service_Training also Grace's Guide http://www.gracesguide.co.uk/Air_Service_Training.
Note there is a spurious reference in the Wiki article to AST having been previously Airwork Services but this is a mistake.
AST was founded by John Siddeley and later became part of Hawker Siddeley Aircraft. I don't think it ever designed its own products but perhaps they were offering refurbished or modified existing trainer stock?

A mere snippet of AirTech info can be found on Grace's Guide: http://www.gracesguide.co.uk/Airtech.
Again, they were probably offering some kind of refurb or modification deal.

 

[hesham]

Many thanks my dear Schneiderman and Hood,

but as my dear Schneiderman said and as I understand,maybe they have own
designs or as you said my dear Hood,just a conversions from un-owned real
airplanes.

 

[Schneiderman]

Sorry Hesham I missed where you had posted the names of the two companies.

More about Airtech here
http://www.haddenhamairfieldhistory.co.uk/airtech.htm
http://www.britishaviation-ptp.com/airtech.html

I agree with Hood, it seems unlikely that they had approved design capability.

 

[hesham]

Oh my God,amazing sites,thank you my dear Schneiderman,

there was also C4 for AST,as a high-speed winged target,that's new for me ?.

 

[hesham]

For Chrislea,did it develop a trainer Project from the aircraft actually built ?.

 

[robunos]

This, from 'British Sailplanes and Gliders', N.H.Ellison, 1970, page 116:-

"A two-seat side-by-side seating training aircraft, designed by Elliotts of Newbury and Aviation & Engineering Products Ltd., to the above specification in competition to the Percival P56, Handley Page H.P.R. 2 and the Auster A.9
projects. All metal light alloy stressed skin construction.
Wing span: 12.34 m., 40' 6". Length: 9'25m., 30’ 4”.
Wing area: 22.3 sq.m., 240 sq.ft. Aspect ratio: 6.83."


cheers,
Robin.

 

[hesham]

Nice find my dear Robunos.

 

[hesham]

From Air Pictorial 1949,

they talked about Handley Page HPR.1 & 3,as a project variants of HPR.2,
and my question,if they were wrong,OK,but if theywere right,could they
later re-allocated to another designs ?!.

 

[Arjen]

H.P.R.1 was the Marathon
H.P.R.3 was the 4 x Alvis Leonides Major Herald

 

[Arjen]

The H.P.R.1 Marathon preceded the H.P.R.2 basic trainer.
In 1948, Handley Page acquired the factory and design office of Miles Aircraft Ltd., with the new subsidiary company Handley Page (Reading) established in the old Miles facilities.
Aircraft from the subsidiary received H.P.R. identifications:
- H.P.R.1 Marathon
- H.P.R.2 basic trainer
- H.P.R.3 Herald, 4 x Alvis Leonides Major
- H.P.R.4 Herald, 2 x Napier Eland Herald, project only
- H.P.R.5 Marathon II, 2 x Armstrong-Siddeley Mamba, later re-engined 2 x Alvis Leonides Major
- H.P.R.6 Herald, 4 x Rolls-Royce Tyne, laminar-flow wing, blown flaps, project only
- H.P.R.7 Herald, 2 x Rolls-Royce Dart

 

[hesham]

Thank you my dear Arjen,

and of course I know that,but we can say,they are a variants,and always
I used the term; re-alloacted,if that's right only.