British AEW Projects

[northerndancer2000]

Chris has been working on what looks like a wonderful book, Battle Flight: RAF Air Defence Projects and Weapons Since 1945 for Crecy. It is discussed in the Bookshelf forum at http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,15716.0.html . As you can see from the listing of the chapter topics there will be substantial coverage of AEW topics in Battle Flight. Crecy is quoting a 31 OCT 2012 release date and you can pre-order it at http://www.crecy.co.uk/product_info.php?cPath=13&products_id=634 . (Amazon.co.uk also lists it but without a release date. It has been my experience that Amazon UK can take a long time to actually get specialist books in stock.)


However, the downside to this is that the release date of AEW and the Air Staff has been pushed back to allow Chris to complete the Battle Flight book. See the last page of the discussion at http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,7045.0/all.html .

 

[hesham]

Hi,


I know that topic is for British aircraft,but I found this Boeing C-97,as it was an AEW
aircraft,intended for UK,was this a real project or not ?.


http://www.freightdogmodels.co.uk/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=3&products_id=873&osCsid=qncwvunzokulfm

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,17958.0.html


See page 6 of the book "The Air Staff and AEW" by Chris Gibson. Yes, a real project.

 

[Stargazer]

Can't even start to conceive the innumerable monickers that would have been assigned to that beast, had it been procured...

 

[hesham]

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,17958.0.html


See page 6 of the book "The Air Staff and AEW" by Chris Gibson. Yes, a real project.

Thank you my dear Paul.

 

[fightingirish]

What-If -Forum > Boeing XEC-97 & Stratoseeker AEW2 B)



Freightdog 1/72 Buccaneer P.139/2 AEW project conversion set

Resin cast conversion set to 1/72 scale, for use with the Airfix Buccaneer S.2 base kit (not included).


Intended as an AEW platform for the Fleet Air Arm, the set includes two belly mounted large antennae and pylons applicable to the proposal, plus replacement nose, tailplane and wing mounted RWR fairings from our earlier improvement sets. Note no cutting required.


A paper project only, more information can be found on this fascinating subject in The Admiralty and AEW by Chris Gibson, published by Blue Envoy Press. Illustration by Adrian Mann, Decals not included.

 

[CJGibson]

Errrrrr...no.

Quote

What-If -Forum > Boeing XEC-97 & Stratoseeker AEW2 B)


Nice build, but the AEW C-97 had nothing to do with Boeing and I'd thank you not to perpetuate the view that the US invented AEW as a means of co-ordinating fighters.

Chris

PS Cadillac? Was to detect and give warning of surface ships, the aircraft aspect only came later.

 

[famvburg]

Who was going to build the AEW C-97 if not Boeing? I was under the impression it was a Boeing but modified by the Brits to AEW spec.

 

[Rickshaw]

I think you'll find that while Boeing may have built the airframes the British aircraft industry was more than capable of modifying it to mount an AEW radar.

 

[ouroboros]

Hi,


I know that topic is for British aircraft,but I found this Boeing C-97,as it was an AEW
aircraft,intended for UK,was this a real project or not ?.


http://www.freightdogmodels.co.uk/product_info.php?manufacturers_id=3&products_id=873&osCsid=qncwvunzokulfm

Hrm, cockpit right in front of the upper radome. Must not need cockpit heaters during a mission...

 

[hesham]

From Air International,


a clearer pictures to P.139 Model and 3-view.

 

[fightingirish]

Does anyone have a 3-view and specifications of the related HS125 COD proposed for CVA.01?
Thank you.

Source: Source: Interavia Germany, February 1974, page 115

 

[AEWMan]

Hi all,

What a pity that I have missed this thread's progress for such a long while. But I have been busy finishing my book. For those who might be interested there is a really nice sneak preview of my new book - Beyond the Horizon - The History of AEW & C Aircraft here :

http://www.harpia-publishing.com/galleries/AEW/index.html

The book is being launched at the Scale Model World 2014 IPMS UK Show at Telford on 8th & 9th November where I will be doing a book signing. It contains for the first time the full story of the RAF's Secret 1453 Flt and their battle to get AEW to work, the real reason that the Nimrod AEW was cancelled and the full story of Iraq/Iran's attempt at AEW & C with Baghdad 1 & 2 and the Adnans. A juicy book for secret project fans to get their teeth into.

Cheers

Ian

 

[Rickshaw]

Price, please. None of the stockists for your publisher seem to have a price for a copy of this book.

 

[AEWMan]

These guys - http://www.aero-spezial-modellbauversand.de/Books/Harpia-Publishing/HP015-Beyond-the-Horizon-The-History-of-AEW-C-Aircraft::11354.html?language=en

are selling it for 35.95 Euros plus postage. Which is the usual Harpia cover price, they are also stating they have it in stock!

Cheers

Ian

 

[zebedee]

Some interesting illustrations from a Hawker Siddeley brochure dated 1974 entitled Nimrod: Multi Role Aircraft. Of interest is the alternative AEW radar fit with a radome above the rear fuselage and the addition of Hose and drogue pods for air to air refuelling...

Zeb

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

Lovely pics, and a lot more attractive than the AEW Mk.3 for sure!

 

[CJGibson]

Zebedee, is this a Brough brochure? There was a multirole Nimrod punted at Canada, but that was based on the MR.2 and from Woodford. These pics could be it.

The background to the rotodome Nimrod is in 'The Air Staff and AEW'. Brough drew up at least three dorsal antenna studies, one with a 40ft rotodome, one with a smaller (probably E-2 based) rotodome and one with a small teardrop-shaped fixed shell.

Chris

 

[zebedee]

Apologies for the delay... Address on the back of the brochure is Hawker Sidderly Aviation, Greengate, Middleton Manchester...

Zeb

 

[zebedee]

Four engined HS 748 AEW Model at the Avro Museum...

Zeb

AEW Hawker Siddeley HS748 by Martin Winchester, on Flickr

 

[Riaino]

Hope this thread is not too old to necro.

The Wiki page for the Gannet AEW3 says that there were two proposals from BAC to update the Gannet AEW; the much loved AEW7 with the rotodome and other major structural changes and a minimum change version of the existing AEW3 with updated radar and systems.

Does anyone know anything about the 'minimum change version of the existing AEW3 with updated radar and systems'?

Thanks.

 

[JohnR]

What is the proposed life span of the E3 Sentry in UK service? Is there any proposals for a replacement?

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

Hope this thread is not too old to necro.

The Wiki page for the Gannet AEW3 says that there were two proposals from BAC to update the Gannet AEW; the much loved AEW7 with the rotodome and other major structural changes and a minimum change version of the existing AEW3 with updated radar and systems.

Does anyone know anything about the 'minimum change version of the existing AEW3 with updated radar and systems'?

Thanks.

On this forum there's no such thing as a too old topic - we encourage reuse of old topics where appropriate.

 

[Silencer1]

Hello!
Anyone could tell more about white canard-shaped 4-engined model in the lower-right part of photo?

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

Avro 721 low altitude bomber to B.126T (OR.314) - 1952

 

[Thorvic]

The Avro 721 was built by Duncan (Overkiller) a few years ago and presented to Avro Heritage along with the Avro 730 he built. Nice to see it on display in the new Museum B)

 

[Silencer1]

Dear PaulMM and Geoff_B!

Thank for clarification - this project was unknow for me.
There were not too much canards among the bombers
Am I right, that in this exhibition certain examples have been build as company' presentation models in corresponding years, and others is produced not so long ago - just for visualization?

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

Most of them are original manufacturer models.

 

[Caravellarella]

Most of them are original manufacturer models.

Most of them are Space Models Ltd originals made for the manufacturer......

Terry (Caravellarella)

 

[hesham]

In Aeroplane Monthly 8/2017,

they spoke about Vickers Varsity Project,intended for short-range Maritime Recce aircraft,
in late 1950s,that means OR.350 as I think,and distinguished by many features,has anyone
a drawing for it ?.

 

[Grey Havoc]

Sorry for off topic. I'm not sure the source book of this photo. But I thought that it's a interesting design which worth to post.
Four engined BAC-111 AEW type for the JSDF.

 

[CJGibson]

...and the source?

 

[blackkite]

The Air Staff and AEW?

 

[blackkite]

Developmental model of the Nimrod early warning aircraft, c 1970s.
UNITED KINGDOM - OCTOBER 16: This is a model of the Hawker Siddeley/British Aerospace Nimrod AEW3 aircraft. It has been clad in copper for the evaluation of radio/radar aerial polar diagram analysis and investigation. The Nimrod�s design was a development of the de Havilland Comet airliner of the 1950s. This object forms part of the Science Museum's Farnborough collection. (Photo by SSPL/Getty Images)

This is a model of the Hawker Siddeley/British Aerospace Nimrod AEW3...

This is a model of the Hawker Siddeley/British Aerospace Nimrod AEW3 aircraft. It has been clad in copper for the evaluation of radio/radar aerial polar diagram analysis and investigation. The...

www.gettyimages.co.jp

 

[blackkite]

Hi!

Index of /Images6/AN/AN83-11

 

[VictorXL188]

In Aeroplane Monthly 8/2017,

they spoke about Vickers Varsity Project,intended for short-range Maritime Recce aircraft,
in late 1950s,that means OR.350 as I think,and distinguished by many features,has anyone
a drawing for it ?.

As far as I understand OR.350 was issued following the NATO competition which led to the Breguet Atlantic, which was rejected by the RAF as being insufficiently advanced for its needs. Avro initially offered a modified variant of the Atlantic to the RAF, the Avro/Breguet 2A, which would have featured two auxiliary RB.153-61 engines fitted on underwing pylons and wing tip tanks. This collaboration ended due to Avro's concerns with the use of a honeycomb fuselage shell, which Avro felt could lead to corrosion problems in the MR environment, an assertion that was proved correct, according to Derek Wood in Project Cancelled. As a result of this OR.350 called for a higher spec aircraft. Hawker Siddeley's first efforts were directed at an aircraft powered by four Tynes, very similar to the Vanguard in layout. Later a twin Tyne-powered design was offered with the addition of a rear mounted RB.168 turbofan to boost the transit speeds. Later efforts from Avro in November 1961 saw the adoption of the Type 776, utilising the fuselage of the DH.121 Trident. The spec was replaced by OR.357. So the short answer is a Varsity derivative would not have met OR.350. Possibly a Viscount one may have?

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

Nimrod AEW article from Flight

https://cdn.rochesteravionicarchives.co.uk/img/catalog/ZZ_1367236172_DDBR0284+%28O%26A-1b%29.pdf

 

[Jason Dykstra (Wyvern)]

Here's something from Air International, circa 1983. I think I downloaded it from somewhere else on this site.

I wonder what it would have taken to make the HS 125 capable of operating from a carrier. There would have been the need for strengthening of the structure and landing hear as well as a redesign of the wings to allow them to fold. At that point, why would it even be considered?

 

[swerve]

Of course, India flew an AEW HS.748.

Which appears to have been rather too small for its radome, & was abandoned after a crash which killed some important members of the development team.

 

[swerve]

I am under the impression that fore and aft antenna configuration is actually better than the rotodome configuration for an AEW aircraft but what killed the Nimrod AEW was the integration of the information from the fore and aft antennas?

I recall reading that at the time, but I also recall reading that with the hardware available, there were serious difficulties in getting the necessary processing power aboard the aircraft, due to both weight & electrical power needs.

The complexity of integrating the information could have contributed to the processing & hence hardware needs, of course.