Artemis Moon Program

Byeman said:
c. And more so, there were no LEM pilots, only LM pilots.
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Hmm ...


The Apollo 13 Lunar Module (LM or LEM) was originally supposed to land at ...
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Apollo Lunar Module Documentation
LEM Guidance, Navigation, and Control Subsystem Study Guide March 1966 ( 8.4 Mb PDF )
includes good panel diagrams.
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15. Donald K. Slayton to ASPO, Attn.:William A. Lee, "Docking Operational Requirements," 2 Dec.1963; Kelly, "Technical Development Status," p. 29; "SomeNotes on Evolution of LEM," pp. 1-2; Sherman interview.

16. Joseph P. Loftus to Chief, Sys. Eng.Div. (SED) , "Disposition of TM-1 mockup review chit no.A9-4," 28 April 1964; Slayton to ASPO, Attn.: Maynard, "LEMoverhead window experiment," 6 May 1964; LEM PO,"Accomplishments," 14-20 May 1964.

17. Sherman interview; Kelly,"Technical Development Status," p.29; "Some Notes onEvolution of LEM," pp. 3-4.

19. Grumman Report no. 4, LPR-10-7, 10June 1963, p. 13; Robert A. Newlander to John W. Small and Walter J.Gaylor, "LEM Landing Gear," 8 May 1963;

Maynard memo, "Notice of LEM Structuresand Landing Gear meeting," 15 Dec. 1964


June 1965; Robert E. Lewis to Asst. Chief, SED, "OMSF specified LEMtilt angle on lunar surface, constraints imposed by G&C PerformanceRequirements," 20 May 1964; General Electric, "Study of thePostlanding Tilt Angle of the LEM," TIR 545-S64-03-006, 21 May1964; William Lee to Chief, SED, "LEM postlanding tilt angle,"2 June 1964; Maynard to LEM PO, "Exhibit E to LEM Statement of Work- Change to incorporate LEM lunar postlanding attitude," 11 June1964; Decker to Grumman, Attn.: Mullaney, "Landing Gear DesignDevelopment," 4 June 1964.

21. ASPO Status Reports for periodending 16 Oct. and for week ending 19 Nov. 1963; Grumman Report no. 10,pp. 2, 10, and no. 23, LPR-10-39, 10 Jan. 1965, pp. 1, 15; Rector memoto LEM Proc. Off., "Change from a 180" [457-cm] Tripod LandingGear to a 160" [406-cm] Cantilever Design," 13 April 1964;Robert E. Vale and Scott, telephone interviews, 20 March 1975; Rector toGrumman, Attn.: Mullaney, "Landing gear design criteria," 11Dec. 1964; abstract of LEM Structures and Landing Gear Systems Meeting,21-22 Dec. 1964, with encs.;
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https://twitter.com/x/status/1762111937490378942
View: https://twitter.com/int_machines/status/1762111937490378942


Odysseus continues to communicate with flight controllers in Nova Control from the lunar surface. After understanding the end-to-end communication requirements, Odysseus sent images from the lunar surface of its vertical descent to its Malapert A landing site, representing the furthest south any vehicle has been able to land on the Moon and establish communication with ground controllers. 1/5 (26FEB2024 0745 CST)
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Odysseus captured this image approximately 35 seconds after pitching over during its approach to the landing site. The camera is on the starboard aft-side of the lander in this phase. 2/5 (26FEB2024 0745 CST)
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As part of Odysseus’ descent onto the lunar surface, Hazard Relative Navigation algorithms detected nine safe landing sites within the targeted south pole region, which is an area that contains permanently shadowed regions that may be rich in resources, including water ice that could be used for future propulsion and life support on the Moon. 3/5 (26FEB2024 0745 CST)
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Images from NASA’s Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter Camera team confirmed Odysseus completed its landing at 80.13°S and 1.44°E at a 2579 m elevation. After traveling more than 600,000 miles, Odysseus landed within 1.5 km of its intended Malapert A landing site, using a contingent laser range-finding system patched hours before landing. Image credit: NASA/Goddard/Arizona State University. lroc.asu.edu/posts/1360 4/5 (26FEB2024 0745 CST)
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https://twitter.com/x/status/1762111945291755652
View: https://twitter.com/int_machines/status/1762111945291755652


Flight controllers intend to collect data until the lander’s solar panels are no longer exposed to light. Based on Earth and Moon positioning, we believe flight controllers will continue to communicate with Odysseus until Tuesday morning. Image credit: NASA/Goddard/Arizona State University. 5/5 (26FEB2024 0745 CST)
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That is really good news that the lander is still in contact with ground control, though it will be sad if they lose contact due to the fact of there being no power or lack of power due to the solar panels getting light from the Sun.
 
southwestforests said:
Hmm ...







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All those sources were OBE after:

The Apollo Spacecraft - A Chronology - Volume 4​

May 12, (1966)​

"A memo to KSC, MSC, and MSFC from the NASA Office of Manned Space Flight reported that the NASA Project Designation Committee had concurred in changes in Saturn/Apollo nomenclature recommended by Robert C. Seamans, Jr., George E. Mueller, and Julian Scheer:
  • lunar excursion module to be called lunar module.
  • Saturn IB to become the "uprated Saturn I." This is a misprint (flipped around)
The memo instructed that the new nomenclature be used in all future news releases and announcements."

The Lunar Module acronym is LM, which is pronounced "lem". Because? It is not "lam", "lim", "lom" or "lum". Just because it is pronounced 'lem", it is not written "lem" since 1966.
 
Byeman said:
A "Lunar Excursion Module" never flew,
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That is an interesting thing to maintain insistence of when NASA's own documentation on nasa dot gov says things such as,

science.nasa.gov

Apollo 11 Landing Site From Dawn to Dusk - NASA Science

Views of the Apollo 11 landing site from NASA's Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter, taken on separate occasions when the Sun was at different points in the sky over the site.
science.nasa.gov science.nasa.gov

Astronauts Neil Armstrong and "Buzz" Aldrin landed the Apollo 11 Lunar Excursion Module (LEM) in Mare Tranquillitatis on July 20, 1969.
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New images from the Odysseus lander have been released, from the Space Bucket:


After around 4 days since the Odysseus lander made contact with the Moon, we have finally received some actual images of the lander on the surface. This includes distant images from NASA’s Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter along with some onboard cameras. Unfortunately, the quality is still far from ideal.
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That being said, it gives us more insight into the current state of the lander along with what to expect in its final days. Here I will go more in-depth into the new images, what they tell us, the upcoming lunar night, and more.
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Full article here - https://thespacebucket.com/new-images...
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Byeman said:
Just because it is pronounced 'lem", it is not written "lem" since 1966.
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Which is an interesting thing to assert give things such as this from 2009, and the above from September 7, 2023

appel.nasa.gov

Son of LEM: Lunar Lander Design Today | APPEL Knowledge Services

By John F. Connolly A typical NASA project begins with a set of requirements that describe all the functions and performance a spacecraft must possess. A vehicle is then designed to satisfy those requirements. This process produces a design that initially attempts to meet all requirements...
appel.nasa.gov appel.nasa.gov

Son of LEM: Lunar Lander Design Today​

September 1, 2009
John F. Connolly
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The author appears to be familiar with NASA terminology,

John F. Connolly leads vehicle design and engineering for NASA’s Altair Lunar Lander Project Office at Johnson Space Center. Prior to joining the Constellation program, he served two years at NASA Headquarters as the deputy of the Exploration Systems Architecture Study team, leading the definition of the lunar architecture that is now the basis for NASA’s exploration planning.
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As a point of trivia, that "LEM" acronym also is employed by a totally different and much more recent NASA project,

www.nasa.gov

Landform Evolution Modeling (LEM) Group - NASA

Jeff Moore
www.nasa.gov www.nasa.gov

Landform Evolution Modeling (LEM) Group​

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Anyway, available NASA material indicates that LEM for the lunar lander remains in at least occasional use in to the 21st century by NASA personnel and publications.
 
southwestforests said:
That is an interesting thing to maintain insistence of when NASA's own documentation on nasa dot gov says things such as,

science.nasa.gov

Apollo 11 Landing Site From Dawn to Dusk - NASA Science

Views of the Apollo 11 landing site from NASA's Lunar Reconnaissance Orbiter, taken on separate occasions when the Sun was at different points in the sky over the site.
science.nasa.gov science.nasa.gov
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NASA public affairs and outreach is not an official source. They post a lot of errors.
 
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southwestforests said:
Which is an interesting thing to assert give things such as this from 2009, and the above from September 7, 2023

The author appears to be familiar with NASA terminology,
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Did you read the article? LEM is only used in the title and it is appropriate. The discussion is about the early design processes for the Altair lander. When the LM was in the same design stage, it was the LEM.

But it doesn't matter what you find, official Apollo documentation didn't use LEM after 1966.
 
FighterJock said:
That is really good news that the lander is still in contact with ground control, though it will be sad if they lose contact due to the fact of there being no power or lack of power due to the solar panels getting light from the Sun.
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Just like gymnasts on Earth, on the Moon you're in trouble if you don't stick the landing...
 
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Also, this seems like an abject lesson that desperately trying to *reinvent* a previously *repeatedly* successfully demonstrated concept in *more creative (other ways of knowing?) approaches* may backfire - Intuitive Machines indeed, my Equus Africanus...
 
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As a US taxpayer, I am truly sickened by the fact that NASA awarded a task order to that wretched loser unproven idiot *Texas* yahoo outfit.
 
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Surveyor were extrem simple, compare to modern Nova-C & co.
Launch by Atlas-Centaur to direct landing trajectory, use Solid rocket motor to reduce speed to 110 m/s
From here it use three vernier engines for landing

But it worked (Surveyor 3 visit by Apollo 12 crew)
1280px-Surveyor_3_on_the_Moon.jpg
 
Michel Van said:
Surveyor were extrem simple, compare to modern Nova-C & co.
Launch by Atlas-Centaur to direct landing trajectory, use Solid rocket motor to reduce speed to 110 m/s
From here it use three vernier engines for landing

But it worked (Surveyor 3 visit by Apollo 12 crew)
1280px-Surveyor_3_on_the_Moon.jpg
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Hello Michel, thanks for the truly elucidating picture - now THAT is how you design a lander to deal with uneven terrain!
 
martinbayer said:
Hello Michel, thanks for the truly elucidating picture - now THAT is how you design a lander to deal with uneven terrain!
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And yet two Surveyors failed (while costing far more than IM-1 did). If IM has a string of failures, then it’s time to complain.
 
Could that have played a small part of what happened during the landing? Just a thought that I have got.
 
From the link above:

The founder and chief executive of Intuitive Machines, which for a few days this month has been the epicenter of the spaceflight universe after landing the first commercial vehicle on the Moon, invited me to the company's nerve center in Houston to set some things straight.

"You can say whatever you want to say," Altemus said. "But from my perspective, this is an absolute success of a mission. Holy crap. The things that you go through to fly to the Moon. The learning, just every step of the way, is tremendous."
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Aaah the Startups and their self complacent CEOs...

Remind me, how much did the American public invests in that project?

Oddly enough and as a fun coincidence for us, the same day, on the other side of the pond, Lilium also posted this nugget on the same tone:

3000x2000_FY-23-min.jpg


(notice the vast empty space and the gigantic size of the workshop, the lack of a surfaced smooth finish or electrostatic flooring, the basic CFRP airframe without any subsystems fitted (cheap), the lack of any tooling to move the crated fuselage around (but, hey, they are supposed to promote battery powered a/C not EV), the slave like usage of manpower (because nobody cares and their managers probably have a very undemocratic view of blue collars), the architectural details of the facade that denotes a lack of deep academic know-how and long term investments, etc...).
 
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Gotta love that near B/W minimalist, existentialist aesthetic vibe - this looks more like a 1960's abstract "art" installation than a 21st century engineering project...
 
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TomcatViP said:
Aaah the Startups and their self complacent CEOs...

Remind me, how much did the American public invests in that project?
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you mean what happen to Astra and there Rocket 3.3 and running out of money with mockup rocket 4 ?

and can we return to Artemis Moon Program ?
were deviate from topic
thanks
 
The Merlin nozzle has a stiffening ring. If there was a hoop running through the landing feet of all the legs, might it and a tether cord break instead of any one landing legs?

The hoop might keep things upright even if one leg was gone?

Perhaps the science package isolated from legs in a suspension....
 
If the goal was to be successful by only throwing something, somehow at the moon, yes, the mission is a a success.
But let's not call it a Lander.
 
I'd call it a "semi crasher" LMAO. Or a "half-between-hard-and-soft lander"

All those soft-crashed landers reminds me of this (watch until the end)

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=dQ2ufIOm7u0

SLIM landed upside down; IM-1 landed sidewards; but poor astronauts there landed doing barrel rolls LMAO.
 
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Now that Odysseus has shutdown the Space Bucket has put out a video about it:


After just about a week on the Moon’s surface, the Odysseus lander is officially out of power as the long lunar night begins. In the last few days, we received even more images showcasing its position on the surface, broken landing legs, and tilt. This comes in addition to another press conference revealing what payloads were affected and the state of the lander.
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While it’s possible that Odysseus survives the lunar night, teams at Intuitive Machines didn’t design the lander to do so which means the mission has likely come to an end. Here I will go more in-depth into the new images, the lander’s power, final operations, and more.
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Full article here - https://thespacebucket.com/the-odysse...
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Huh, Texas - who knew. Well, I recon that's what you get from a lone (out of five) star state that thinks everything has to look like a ten gallon hat (minus that overcompensating brim, mind you). Maybe they should have snuck one of them thar fabulated blue pills on board of that gosh darn lander just to keep that wretched contraption erect through touchdown, but boy howdy now we'll never know fer sure...
 
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Phillip Sloss has a new video out concerning the current status of Artemis and SLS:


This update on the Artemis Moon to Mars programs covers future SLS upgrades highlighted by NASA.
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SLS Booster prime contractor Northrop Grumman posted an image of the first next-gen motor segment to complete the solid propellant casting process. The image shows the segment moving to a final assembly area at their Promontory facility in Northern Utah. The next-gen boosters are being developed as part of NASA's Booster Obsolescence and Life Extension (BOLE) program.
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Pictures and video taken in December of an Exploration Upper Stage weld confidence article finally completed the legal clearance process for publication. The liquid hydrogen (LH2) tank dome test article is validating prime contractor Boeing's friction-stir weld tools and settings at the Michoud Assembly Facility in New Orleans.
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Another RS-25 Retrofit 3b hot-fire test was conducted on February 29 at NASA Stennis Space Center. This was the eighth in a series of 12, with a duration of 615 seconds. Engine 0525 is helping to certify the restarted of Aerojet Rocketdyne's engine component production lines.
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There are also a few other Artemis-related news items to note but could use additional information and context that we'll have to look for in the future.
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And while we're still waiting for more clarity on how the delays to Artemis II and III have changed their plans, another recap of questions and watch items.
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