Airborne Aircraft Carriers

[athpilot]

Here is an american contemporary counterpart. I don´t know if it should be carried by airship or plane. Does anyone have more information on this plane (and its carrier)?

Regards

 

[Antonio]

The carrier was to be an airship

 

[XP67_Moonbat]

Still like to hear more on Project Jupiter.

 

[Jemiba]

Does anyone have more information on this plane (and its carrier)?

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,10678.0.html

 

[athpilot]

Oh, thanks a lot Jemiba!

 

[borovik]

Hi!

The soviets had very fascinating ideas on that.

Good night
Athpilot

Towards reply #36 - All projects really existed.
Something that has been: http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,10585.0/all.html
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,6473.0/all.html

 

[iverson]

Here is an american contemporary counterpart. I don´t know if it should be carried by airship or plane. Does anyone have more information on this plane (and its carrier)?

Regards

The profiles are mine. The aircraft was intended to replace the Curtiss Sparrowhawk and was designed for a Ranger engine. That is all that I know about it.

 

[Stargazer]

While browsing through an old PDF file of a blueprint collection (probably SDASM) I came across the mention of three documents numbered "MICRO-1", "MICRO-2" and "MICRO-5" and depicting "Mass Air Launch & Recovery" aircraft. The comment says that this "appears to be a concept drawing showing 17 'manned micro fighters' carried in a C-5A" ("MICRO-5" has "'manned micro fighters' and drones"). An obvious competitor to the Boeing program.

 

[fightingirish]

B)
https://youtu.be/drnxZlS9gyw

https://youtu.be/drnxZlS9gyw

 

[Moose]

Nicely done video. Pretty cool looking renders of the aircraft.

 

[Mark Nankivil]

Agree, well done. My son actually sent me this about the same time you posted it. He is catching on!

Enjoy the Day! Mark

 

[LowObservable]

I believe that REALLY BAD THINGS would happen before the AAC reached this point. Cool graphics, however.

 

[alanqua]

Hello,
Interesting topic. I published a few years ago some illustrations for Le Fana de L'Aviation, a French aerospace magazine (I did the illustrations, I did not write the actual article). Here are in attachment, a simplified graphic of the interior of the 747, and a 3 views plan of one of the multiple projects of micro fighters supposed to be carried on board.
Regards
Alain

 

[hesham]

Amazing work Alanqua.

 

[alanqua]

Hello,
I had to choose among many other micro fighters projects. This 747 ACC was a very prolific study.
This is the first time I see a video on the topic. The quality is great.
Regards
Alain

 

[Deltafan]

Video that I posted too on the Boeing Microfighter topic (here for the Boeing 747 Airborne Carrier Concept) :

 

[Archibald]

That video is amazing. I'm intrigued by the rear launch door. In this concept it is used, of course, to drop the micro-fighter.
The door seemed to be molded on the fighter span of 17.5 ft.

But could it be fitted with a loading ramp, and basically turn a 747-200F into a kind of (poor's man) C-5 Galaxy ? no need for a 17.5 ft wide door, something narrower would do the job...

 

[fightingirish]

another case study, C-5 Airborne carrier with microfighters:
http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD=AD529372&Location=U2&doc=GetTRDoc.pdf
And the 747 case study:
http://www.dtic.mil/cgi-bin/GetTRDoc?AD=AD529372&Location=U2&doc=GetTRDoc.pdf

Key Aero published a web article out of these two study papers today. Never seen the C-5 Airborne aircraft carrier concept before.
Link: https://www.key.aero/article/boeings-airborne-aircraft-carrier-concept

 

[Grey Havoc]

From 1943:

https://www.reddit.com/r/RetroFuturism/comments/tz1zrj

View: https://www.reddit.com/r/RetroFuturism/comments/tz1zrj/the_airwing_an_aerial_aircraft_carrier_1943/

 

[riggerrob]

Here is an american contemporary counterpart. I don´t know if it should be carried by airship or plane. Does anyone have more information on this plane (and its carrier)?

Regards

That airplane sort of resembles the un-build Tucker XP-57 light fighter. However its engine and wings are more generic, so probably only a place-filler in a more complex project.
Using parasite fighters for anti-submarine work implies that they would be deployed from the US Navy blimps that escorted civilian convoys along the American Eastern Seaboard. Early in the war, U-boats learned to fear any convoy escorted by aircraft because even slow-moving blimps could quickly call on escorting naval vessels (corvettes and destroyers) to rain down torpedoes and depth-charges on marauding U-boats.
The USN continued flying blimps into the 1960s. In later years, USN Blimps were equipped with long-range radar and used as picket ships to detect incoming Soviet bombers (A-bombs) until replaced by satellites.

 

[Nik]

Those monoplane designs with the big hook...
Not a lot of clearance from the prop-disk given some wriggly flying...

I would not care to land-on a sea-going carrier at night, at least a flying carrier would have lower relative speeds. Still, given the issues around mid-air refuelling...

 

[iverson]

Those monoplane designs with the big hook...
Not a lot of clearance from the prop-disk given some wriggly flying...

I would not care to land-on a sea-going carrier at night, at least a flying carrier would have lower relative speeds. Still, given the issues around mid-air refuelling...

I think that the actual hook and latch are back by the canopy. The thing over the propeller is a fender to keep the launch/recovery trapeze from fouling the propeller.

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

In Search of a Good Host:A Study of Airborne Aircraft-Carriers

https://apps.dtic.mil/sti/pdfs/AD1112586.pdf

 

[The K2]

In the anime series Yukikaze, there was a flying aircraft carrier which carried standard sized fighters code named Banshee. It had a wingspan of 4200 ft.
Attached is an illustration posted on a site called Gears Online.

 

[dan_inbox]

Meanwhile, in France, a different sort of aircraft carrier flew many years ago.

(For the French: C'est l'embryon de la Breizh Atao Air Force!)

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

...

Micro-Fighter Design Tested
Micro-fighter aircraft designed by Air Force Flight Dynamics Laboratory is representative of a low-profile program that updates the concept of airborne carriage and launching of small fighters from large, long range aircraft. Design pictured here could be air-recovered and also could land on conventional runways. Wind tunnel model (above) has been tested at Arnold Engineering Development Center at subsonic to supersonic Mach numbers. Three view drawing (below) is similar to wind tunnel model except that twin vertical tails are substituted for larger single tail. FDL and Boeing together are studying the use of wide-body transports such as the 747 and the Lockheed C-5A to carry micro-fighters or RPVs to distant areas where they would be launched and recovered (AW&$T May 14, 1973, p. 44).

Source: AWST 7 Jan 1974 (h/t to @boxkite for the issue reference)

 

[Archibald]

Meanwhile, in France, a different sort of aircraft carrier flew many years ago.

(For the French: C'est l'embryon de la Breizh Atao Air Force!)

Le pilote avait un regard de breizh (runs for cover)

I remember reading about that one in Science & Vie Junior, back in the day: 30 years ago (doesn't makes me any younger, damn).

Funny idea and concept, perfect for airshows. What happened to the team ? are they still active ?

 

[overscan (PaulMM)]

747 Launch, Recovery of RPVs Studied
By Philip J. Klass

Boeing is investigating possible use of a modified 747 airframe to carry either remotely piloted vehicles or small “microfighters” to a distant theater of operations where they could be launched and recovered. In the case of the RPVs, the vehicles could be refurbished on board the 747 and re-launched.

The Boeing micro-fighter study is being conducted at Seattle and funded by USAF, while the RPV air-carrier study is being company funded at the Wichita Div. A recent request for expressions of industry interest in the use of a wide-body transport as an RPV carrier, issued by the USAF Flight Dynamics Laboratory, brought responses from approximately half a dozen companies, including Boeing and Lockheed.

Whether there will be sufficient funds in the Fiscal 1974 budget to permit the laboratory to sponsor a funded study of the RPV carrier is uncertain. The concept of launching a small fighter aircraft from a larger, longerrange aircraft dates back to the late 1940s when USAF sponsored the development of the XF-85 “parasite fighter” at McDonnell Aircraft. The concept was to carry the small fighter aircraft in the bomb-bay of the General Dynamics B-36 to provide air defense near the target area.

XF-85 had a 21-ft. wingspan, a 15-ft. fuselage and was powered by a Westinghouse J34. The program was later canceled after one unsuccessful and one successful launch and recovery from a Boeing B-29 (AW&ST Sept. 27, 1948, p.13).

In one sense, the new concept has an even earlier heritage that dates back to the U. S. Navy dirigibles, the Akron and Macon, which could carry, launch and recover fighter aircraft.

Renewed interest in the concept of an airborne aircraft carrier has emerged as a result of two factors:

• Increased interest in RPVs, for a variety of military missions, whose size could allow a significant number of them to be carried in a wide-body transport. Even larger numbers could be carried if an RPV were especially designed for this concept.
• Growing concern over the possible loss of overseas bases and the rising cost of maintaining such bases with a devalued dollar (AW&ST Apr. 30, p. 67).

Lockheed was one of the first companies to conduct in-house studies of the concept, prompted by the hope of finding new applications for its USAF C-5A. However, these studies were cut sharply in 1971 when Lockheed encountered serious economic difficulties.

The in-house studies at Boeing’s Wichita Div., which began in the fall of 1971, were similarly prompted by hope of finding new applications for the 747. However, the company also studied other possible airframes. The Boeing project bears the name ACLAR, an acronym derived from airborne carriage, launch and recovery.

On Oct. 30, 1972, the Strategic Air Command issued a Required Operational Capability (ROC) No. 16-72 for an RPV air carrier of this type. The idea
so far has encountered a mixed reaction in the Pentagon. The Fiscal 1974 budget reportedly provides only limited funding for exploratory studies.

Some observers, including segments of the Boeing management, see the RPV air carrier as a potential competitor to the long-range, long-endurance Compass Cope drone vehicle being developed by Boeing and Teledyne Ryan (AW&ST Jan. 22, p. 38).

Trapeze Arrangement

The Boeing-Wichita studies indicate that a 747 airframe can carry six standard Teledyne Ryan BGM—34 type drone RPV vehicles within its fuselage. They would be launched individually from a folding trapeze arrangement located in the forward belly of the 747, with a separate recovery trapeze in the tail.

To test the launch-recovery techniques, Boeing investigated the possibility of using a USAF/Lockheed C-141 or a Boeing KC-135, with a single tail mounted trapeze that would be employed both for launch and recovery. To fit the BGM-34 into the C-141 fuselage, it would need to be rotated approximately 45 deg. about its longitudinal axis.

In an operational 747 configuration, the separate launch and recovery trapeze mechanisms would permit convenient refurbishment of recovered vehicles on an assembly line inside the aircraft so they could be re-launched on additional missions if required.

In an operational configuration, Boeing analyses indicate, six RPVs could be launched at 15-min. intervals and recovered at the same intervals. Barring the need to fix severe battle damage, the air carrier could launch, recover, refurbish and re-launch almost continuously within the endurance of the
carrier itself.

Trade-off Studies

Boeing has done range/endurance trade-off studies, showing the number of RPV launches and recoveries that can be accomplished with corresponding ranges and endurance for the air carrier. For extremely long-range missions, the launching air carrier could return to base and another carrier sent to retrieve the RPVs following their missions. Based on the extremely high reliability figures for aerial refueling that have been achieved'both by SAC and by the Tactical Air Command, Boeing engineers are confident that they can achieve a very high success rate in RPV launch and recovery, in view of the basic similarity of the techniques involved. The company has devised an ingenious means of using an ordinary television camera, in combination with a simple digital computer, to ease RPV recovery by automatically determining critical vehicle parameters. These include such things as slant range, relative azimuth, elevation angles, RPV yaw, roll and pitch angles, and rate of change of these parameters. The technique has been demonstrated in laboratory simulation at Wichita.

To locate returning vehicles initially, Boeing proposes to equip each RPV with a Tacan-type beacon to enable the carrier to determine its relative bearing and distance. Proponents of the air carrier concept believe that ultimately an entirely new RPV swept-wing airframe, designed solely for air-launch and recovery at approximately Mach 0.8, could permit a 747~size aircraft to carry 20 vehicles. They point out that existing RPVs must be designed for a much wider range of operating airspeeds, especially in instances where they will be required to land on airstrips.

Recently, USAF ’s Armament Development and Test Center has begun to consider the possible use of RPVs to deliver cargo to friendly forces inside an enemy defended area. ADTC invited industry to submit its ideas for such logistics use of RPVs, while cautioning that it currently has no funds to support outside studies (AW&ST Mar, 26, p. 9). Boeing responded with an informal proposal based on use of its 747 ACLAR technique.
Modified Boeing 747, designed to transport remotely piloted vehicles to distant theatre of operations, then launch and recover them, is under study by Boeing’s Wichita Div. Studies indicate the 747 could carry six standard Teledyne Ryan BGM-34 vehicles, or up to 24 of a smaller, swept-wing RPV designed especially for this mission, as shown in sketch above.

Recovery of RPV using a trapeze-like mechanism suspended under tail of 747 would be accomplished by a recovery operator from aft-station, using TV camera and computer processing of TV signal to obtain information on RPV attitude, range and closing rate.

Source: AWST 14 May 1973

 

[dan_inbox]

Funny idea and concept, perfect for airshows. What happened to the team ? are they still active ?

I don't know for today. In 2012, the Cri-Cri was converted to electrical engines, and sponsored by Cristalline waters.
The Broussard was sponsored by Groupe Tranchant.
... and the show was called La navette bretonne ...! (The Breton Shuttle)

 

[hesham]

I confirm that,one of my projects was to build an aircraft carrier,with two main
concepts,this makes the launch and get back of airplanes so easy and more
practical,in anew design,maybe based on Bo-747.