Standard Missile projects.

publiusr said:
Anyone ever hid a warhead in a nose-cone hoping to be ignored? For larger missiles.
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“Hmmm that contact is on a trajectory towards our airbase should we intercept it?”

“Nah, it’s just a nosecone.”

I don’t know if this has specifically been done but pen aids are fairly common with even smaller systems like Iskander deploying small rf decoys. The question of employment depends on how much spare throw/maneuvering bus weight you have.

There’s some fantastically complex pen-aid schemes in existence almost none of which we know anything more than rough outlines of.
 
A_Random_Guy said:
with even smaller systems like Iskander deploying small rf decoys.
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RF penaids like those carried by the SS-26 Stone wouldn't work against the SM-3's EKV as it uses a two-colour IIR seeker not an RF-seeker.
 
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NMaude said:
RF penaids like those carried by the SS-26 Stone wouldn't against the SM-3's EKV as it uses a two-colour IIR seeker not an RF-seeker.
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They wouldn’t but to my knowledge they’re also only for terminal stage though solely RF decoys could mess with cuing.

It’s a moot point because I don’t think the 9K720 has an apogee above the minimum SM-3 engagement altitude.
 
Something that occurred earlier today is that there's already been an opportunity for the USN to combat test the SM-3 Block-II and that's in the Red Sea intercepting ballistic missiles launched by Houthi terrorists.
 
NMaude said:
Something that occurred earlier today is that there's already been an opportunity for the USN to combat test the SM-3 Block-II and that's in the Red Sea intercepting ballistic missiles launched by Houthi terrorists.
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Those are far shorter range than the missiles Iran used in their attack. As such, if they ever do enter SM-3 engagement envelopes, cuing in time to hit them would be difficult.

Terminal interception is about all you can realistically do in that situation on the BMD side.
 
NMaude said:
Something that occurred earlier today is that there's already been an opportunity for the USN to combat test the SM-3 Block-II and that's in the Red Sea intercepting ballistic missiles launched by Houthi terrorists.
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You wouldn't waste an SM-3 on that sky trash.
 
NMaude said:
Something that occurred earlier today is that there's already been an opportunity for the USN to combat test the SM-3 Block-II and that's in the Red Sea intercepting ballistic missiles launched by Houthi terrorists.
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Those are probably too low of an altitude for SM-3 even if it was desirable. SM-6 apparently has been used there.
 
Here's an interesting video from the Naval News channel concerning several Raytheon projects including the SM-6:


Interview with Gerry Hueber, requirements and capabilities' vice president for the naval power business at Raytheon, during Sea Air Space 2024.
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Hueber sheds light on the following topics:
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01:29 - SM-6 including its latest at-sea test with the MDA
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02:51 - ESSM Block 2
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03:37 - Australia's Guided Weapons Explosive Ordnance Enterprise
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04:45 - Challenges to ramping up missile production in the US
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I think this is the right thread to post it in anyway here's this interesting Defense Updates video about the USN re-arming at sea:


There has been a lingering concern regarding the inability to reload missiles in US warships at sea.Currently, the warships have to return to base for this purpose.
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This issue has again come into focus with the US Navy’s recent operations in the Red Sea.Arleigh Burke-class destroyers had fired more than 100 Standard family surface-to-air missiles from Mk-41 cells at Houthi missiles and drones for interception.This clearly indicates that against a near-peer adversary like China, in a large-scale conflict, frontline American warships could run off of missiles very quickly.
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In this video, Defense Updates analyzes why Congress is pushing the US Navy on ‘At-Sea’ rearmament ?
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#defenseupdates #usnavy #usmilitary
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Chapters:
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00:11 INTRODUCTION
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01:42 Mk-41 VLS RELOAD
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03:13 CONCERN RAISED
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04:02 US NAVY’s EFFORTS
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05:42 TRAM (Transportable Re-Arming Mechanism )
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07:10 ANALYSIS
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Defense Updates has just uploaded a video concerning the recent test-firing of a PAC-3 MSE interceptor from a Mk-70 containerised launcher:


Lockheed Martin has test-fired a Patriot PAC-3 MSE interceptor from a Mk 70-series containerized launcher and used it to down a mock cruise missile. A modular and scalable version of the company's combat-proven Aegis Combat System called the Virtualized Aegis Weapon System, was used to execute the launch.This has the potential to be a game changer since this combination offers a valuable additional air and missile defense option for use in a slew of existing and future launchers, and not just on ships.
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In this video, Defense Updates analyzes why the test-fire of an Patriot PAC-3 MSE interceptor from an Mk 70 launcher is a crucial development?
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#defenseupdates #PAC3MSEinterceptor #Mk70launcher
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Chapters:
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00:11 INTRODUCTION
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01:41 LOCKHEED MARTIN INSIGHTS
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02:48 PATRIOT PAC-3 MSE INTERCEPTOR
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04:21 MK 70 PAYLOAD DELIVERY SYSTEM
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05:30 VIRTUALIZED AEGIS WEAPON SYSTEM
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06:50 ANALYSIS
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F/A-18 spotted carrying a SM-6 for the 2nd time earlier today.
GPLQqdJasAcpe6U.jpeg
GPLQqdJakAEvTuQ.jpeg
GPLQqdJasAE_N_3.jpeg
GPLQqdKaMAAM8pm.jpeg
https://twitter.com/x/status/1797728633639108651
View: https://x.com/StinkJet/status/1797728633639108651
Posted by this user, just uploaded so if their tweet is deleted we still have these :)

First spotting was back in April: (already posted here but linked again for convenience)

The Weekly Debrief: Air-launched, SM-6-like Missile Exposed In New Test Photo | Aviation Week Network

A civilian photographer captured the photo in 2018 as the F/A-18F with the markings of VX-31 air test and evaluation squadron landed at Point Mugu, California.
aviationweek.com aviationweek.com
 
Forest Green said:
Was their two classified AAM projects? AIM-260 and something else?
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How would we know if there were?

AIM-260 is at least out in the open enough we know about it.

I would be surprised if there was not some kind of very long range missile program for the USAF. It appears SM-6 might fill that role for the USN.
 
Josh_TN said:
How would we know if there were?

AIM-260 is at least out in the open enough we know about it.

I would be surprised if there was not some kind of very long range missile program for the USAF. It appears SM-6 might fill that role for the USN.
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We do know that there is (or was) a separate Air Force program for a Long-Range Engagement Weapon, a long-range SAM that seems to be big enough to require external carriage on existing aircraft with internal weapon bays (F-22 and F-35) or the F-15. LREW was a Raytheon contract, so it's not impossible that it could be as mundane as an air-launched Active Standard, but the impression is that it's probably a new design.
 
TomS said:
We do know that there is (or was) a separate Air Force program for a Long-Range Engagement Weapon, a long-range SAM that seems to be big enough to require external carriage on existing aircraft with internal weapon bays (F-22 and F-35) or the F-15. LREW was a Raytheon contract, so it's not impossible that it could be as mundane as an air-launched Active Standard, but the impression is that it's probably a new design.
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Yes, that's what I was thinking of:

www.airandspaceforces.com

Fifth-Generation Weapons | Air & Space Forces Magazine

A new generation of precision weapons is needed to enhance modern strike capability and deter potential aggressors.
www.airandspaceforces.com www.airandspaceforces.com
Air-to-Air Missiles
AIM-260 Joint Advanced Tactical Missile (JATM). This radar-guided dogfight missile will be about the same size as the 30-year-old AIM-120 AMRAAM, but with considerably longer range. Built by Lockheed Martin it was first revealed in 2019. Little has been revealed since, but USAF has acknowledged that live tests were conducted in 2020 and 2021. The JATM’s enhanced range is greater than China’s PL-15—in many ways, an AMRAAM clone, restoring the “first shot, first kill” advantage to U.S. aircraft. The Navy and Army are said to be collaborating with USAF on JATM.
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Long-Range Engagement Weapon (LREW). Another potential AMRAAM successor or JATM complement. Built by Raytheon, the LREW is reportedly a larger missile that can only be carried externally on fighters, and may be intended to shoot down adversary airborne warning systems, tankers, or bombers at great distances.
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I had thought LREW was more of an experiment/study and that funding was closed out? But in any case I think it extremely likely that there is some kind of program for a very long range missile optimized for multi engined targets.
 
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Josh_TN said:
I had thought LREWxwas more of an experiment/study and that funding was closed out? But in any case I think it extremely likely that is some kind of program for a very long range missile optimized for multi engined targets.
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Could be a game changer against any high value airborne assets (multi engine AEW&C, tankers, etc). I would assume it could reach pretty far if launched from the air :)
 
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4decaa said:
Could be a game changer against any high value airborne assets (multi engine AEW&C, tankers, etc). I would assume it could reach pretty far if launched from the air :)
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It could also be a game changer against high value surface targets now that SM-6 does anti-surface warfare too. Possibly even as a hypersonic missile interceptor or a SEAD weapon. It seems to be an everything missile, or a JGTHA (Joint Go The Hell Away) missile.
 
One can only hope the USN pursues it. A number of commentators have been calling for this since before the first picture was released in 2021. It makes so much sense capability wise you almost have to wonder why this was not completed years ago.
 
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Josh_TN said:
One can only hope the USN peruses it. A number of commentators have been calling for this since before the first picture was released in 2021. It makes so much sense capability wise you almost have to wonder why this was not completed years ago.
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That's easy, they have to work within budget caps at best and Continuing Resolutions when things get worse.
 
Moose said:
That's easy, they have to work within budget caps at best and Continuing Resolutions when things get worse.
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They can only build SM-6s so fast and they have nowhere what they need to fill Burke VLS cells.

As production ramps up and a comfortable inventory exists, we might see alternative uses of SM-6 gain traction.
 
What I'd like to see is for the airborne carriage of SM-6s extended to the F-15 and especially the F-16, if the F-16 is cleared to carry SM-6s then that opens up the possibility of a greatly enlarged market for the SM-6 (And its' derivatives) as large numbers of F-16s are flown by a LOT of foreign airforces. If Raytheon can then expand its SM production line greatly that should dramatically drop the unit-price of the SM-6.

Something else that could be done is to develop an air-launched version of the SM-6 where its' seeker assembly is replaced with the AGM-84's seeker (With any repackaging needed), a radio-altimeter (To enable sea-skimming mode) and the Harpoon's 500Lb warhead. This would make a good ant-ship/land-attack variant.
 
The USN can hardly build enough SM-6 for itself. AFAIK SM-6 has not been exported (maybe Japan?). More over this is more of a specialty item for high value, slow moving targets at long range. Even if the USAF has SM-6 or some other in house very long range AAM, it likely is limited to the F-15E fleet (or even more likely, a subset of the F-15E fleet).
 
Josh_TN said:
The USN can hardly build enough SM-6 for itself.
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Given that massive increase in use by the USN *(Shooting down Houthi and Iranian missiles targeting shipping in the Red Sea and Israel) I can see Raytheon not only having to increase production capacity in its' existing Standard missile production line but having to open a second-source production line.

TomS said:
I see DSCA cases for SK-6 sales to Japan and South Korea
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What about Australia?

*Also Ukraine's experience in the high-intensity Russo-Ukrainian war the current anti-air missile stocks are inadequate for such wars (It's increasingly likely that the PRC will attempt to invade Taiwan in the next few years and the USN will be pulled into it along the JSDF navy).
 
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Defense Updates has just put out a video about the recently spotted F/A-18F carrying an SM-6:


Newly surfaced photos reveal a U.S. Navy F/A-18E/F Super Hornet equipped with what looks like an air-launched variant of the highly versatile SM-6 missile. This combination of the Super Hornet and SM-6 was seen three years ago but has never been officially confirmed by the US Navy.This is an interesting development.
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In this video, Defense Updates analyzes why the F/A-18E/F Super Hornet armed with SM-6 missile boon for the US Navy?
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#defenseupdates #SM6 #usnavyhttps://www.youtube.com/hashtag/usnavy
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Chapters:
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00:11 INTRODUCTION
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01:35 SM-6 MISSILE
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03:43 F/A-18E/F SUPER HORNET
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05:25 US NAVY FACES THREAT
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07:19 ANALYSIS
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Based on available specifications data of boosterless Standard missile variants such as the RIM-66 Standard MR, AGM-78 STARM, AIM-97 Seekbat, and RGM-165 LASM, an air-launched boosterless variant of the RIM-174 ERAM / SM-6 could weight in the range of 600-kg / 1300-lb to 620-kg / 1370-lb and with a length of 4.47-m / 14-ft 8-in to 4.72-m / 15-ft 6-in.
 
I wonder if an air-launched version* of the SM-3 will be developed? It could be used as an ASAT taking over the role of the long retired ASM-135 ASAT.

*Without the Mk-72 booster attached.
 
NMaude said:
Given that massive increase in use by the USN *(Shooting down Houthi and Iranian missiles targeting shipping in the Red Sea and Israel) I can see Raytheon not only having to increase production capacity in its' existing Standard missile production line but having to open a second-source production line.

What about Australia?

*Also Ukraine's experience in the high-intensity Russo-Ukrainian war the current anti-air missile stocks are inadequate for such wars (It's increasingly likely that the PRC will attempt to invade Taiwan in the next few years and the USN will be pulled into it along the JSDF navy).
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Not until we see the money.
 

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