Unbuilt B-52s

[publiusr]

I wonder how many loyal wingman a B-52 could control as a flying server farm.

 

[A_Random_Guy]

Haven't read anything about parasite fighters, but IIRC the Falcon missile family was originally intended to be a bomber defensive missile in the tail. Not sure if that was for the B-36 or B-52, though.

It was looked at with the MX-904 (the predicessor to the Falcon) but the only sketch I've seen attributes it to the B-52. According to Boeing B-52 Stratofortress by Peter E. Davies, et al. there was a proposal at the very least to replace the tail gun with AIM-92 Stinger Missiles under a "Project Scorpion". I haven't been able to find reference to it outside of the book but if it is true I suspect it more than inspired some of the armament for Dale Brown's "Megafortress".

Edit: It's on Page 58

 

[Scott Kenny]

It was looked at with the MX-904 (the predicessor to the Falcon) but the only sketch I've seen attributes it to the B-52.

Thank you very much!

According to Boeing B-52 Stratofortress by Peter E. Davies, et al. there was a proposal at the very least to replace the tail gun with AIM-92 Stinger Missiles under a "Project Scorpion". I haven't been able to find reference to it outside of the book but if it is true I suspect it more than inspired some of the armament for Dale Brown's "Megafortress".

I always thought that Stingers were a bit lacking as a defensive missile, but I suppose ingesting a bunch of scrap metal fragments would ruin your day as a pilot.

 

[A_Random_Guy]

I always thought that Stingers were a bit lacking as a defensive missile, but I suppose ingesting a bunch of scrap metal fragments would ruin your day as a pilot.

Sorry, to clarify the system that Dale Brown describes has basically nothing to do with the actual proposal. The AIM-92 ATAS (Air-to-air Stinger) is a repackaged FIM-92 MANPADS and is used on aircraft like the AH-64 Apache and other helicopters. It’s an IR/EO guided system whereas the system Brown describes is a radio command guidance system somewhat like various Soviet/Russian systems such as the 95Ya6 and its derivatives used on the Pantsir.

There isn’t much information on how the Stinger missiles were to be mounted other than in place of the gun and it’s sparse on details on how it functioned other than the mention of its existence within the book. However, with the datalink that later Stingers got there’s many possibilities for how it could’ve been employed.

 

[MadRat]

I always thought that Stingers were a bit lacking as a defensive missile, but I suppose ingesting a bunch of scrap metal fragments would ruin your day as a pilot.

Pretty much a short ranged and slow missile. APKWS these days is quickly displacing the need for it against helicopters. But you still would have to point it at the target which isn't so handy at 660 mph. But now something like AIM-9X with LOAL technology, you no longer need to point at your target, and it has legs.

 

[A_Random_Guy]

The old ADR-8 pylons between the engine nacelles on each wing could probably accommodate a few air-to-air missiles similar to how RAF Nimrods mounted Sidewinders during the Falklands. Of course, with the new radars that are going to be installed why limit yourself to Sidewinders?

 

[MadRat]

Clearly AIM-120 would be better than AIM-9X, but probably is more dependenton tracking with sensors that have emissions whereas the later could realistically use passive means. The same could be done with ASMs. I doubt we will ever see a B-52 that has a row of caps on its back to do this. You would also need to integrate optical sensors around the frame for the WSO and I do not see that happening either.

 

[Scott Kenny]

The old ADR-8 pylons between the engine nacelles on each wing could probably accommodate a few air-to-air missiles similar to how RAF Nimrods mounted Sidewinders during the Falklands. Of course, with the new radars that are going to be installed why limit yourself to Sidewinders?

Because sidewinders need much less integration work. You can hang a sidewinder on almost anything, with little wiring needed to be added beyond the drop/release controls.

 

[hesham]

What was this ? # - Boeing magazine 1956.

 

[BlackBat242]

What was this ? # - Boeing magazine 1956.

As the text in the image says... a replaceable mission module to fit in the bomb bay that contains 2 mission specialists plus equipment.

Equipment fits proposed were either photo-recon (cameras etc) or EW system (jammers etc).

The idea was to allow the reversion to normal bombing configuration any dedicated recon (RB) B-52s, and to give electronics counter-measure protection and support to flights of 2-4 B-52s (instead of relying on smaller & shorter-ranged aircraft such as the EB-66 for such protection).

 

[Yellow Palace]

Equipment fits proposed were either photo-recon (cameras etc) or EW system (jammers etc).

I'm reading that ad as referring to electronic intelligence, rather than offensive electronic warfare... though I'm sure that both options were considered.

 

[Firefinder]

I'm reading that ad as referring to electronic intelligence, rather than offensive electronic warfare... though I'm sure that both options were considered.

And the Electronic Warfare was built from a certain point of view.

All modern B52s have beastly EWaR system to allow tgem to get close if not penetrate enemy Air Defense.

And even 1970s era EWAR geaf shattered 1960s let alone 50s era gear. With the 2010s gear be down right scary thanks to tge Buffs 8 engines making a metric F ton of power.

 

[SK2]

In early 2000s there were attempts to modify the B-52 as stand-off jammer (B-52 SOJ), but the program was being cancelled in 2007.

 

[Eagle2009]

What was this ? # - Boeing magazine 1956.

So this concept was 100% built and utilized by early RB-52Bs, which differed from the standard B-model by having this pod installed as well as having some changes to the tail turret/radar configuration. A total of 27 were built to this standard.

As built though, the pod was used for recon purposes vs actual electronic warfare.

RB-52s were apparently flown numerous times before the RC-135 family came into service which made this capability no longer necessary.

Attached is a page from B-52 Stratofortress in Detail & Scale Volume 07 detailing the concept.

 

[sferrin]

Clearly AIM-120 would be better than AIM-9X, but probably is more dependenton tracking with sensors that have emissions whereas the later could realistically use passive means. The same could be done with ASMs. I doubt we will ever see a B-52 that has a row of caps on its back to do this. You would also need to integrate optical sensors around the frame for the WSO and I do not see that happening either.

https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/north-american-b-70-valkyrie.16322/page-7#post-354522

 

[Scott Kenny]

Clearly AIM-120 would be better than AIM-9X, but probably is more dependenton tracking with sensors that have emissions whereas the later could realistically use passive means. The same could be done with ASMs. I doubt we will ever see a B-52 that has a row of caps on its back to do this. You would also need to integrate optical sensors around the frame for the WSO and I do not see that happening either.

I mean, the modern Missile Launch Detection or Missile Approach and Warning Systems are basically a set of UV+IR cameras with a 360x270deg or even spherical coverage of the aircraft... So I could see those getting installed on the airframes.

 

[MadRat]

I was thinking upward-slanted launchers with some sort of sealable portal. Give it the ability to ripple fire to match threats. You may expend them on any kind of threat, from SAM to fighter. In a low-threat environment it would give you limited Air Superiority.