Su-27M question

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lancer21

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I hope this is the right place to put this, basically i wonder if there is any information as to what radar the preseries Su-27M/Su-35 delivered in 2002 i believe, had in their noses, was it the slotted array N-011, or the phased array N-011M? Did they have the N-012 in the tail stinger?

Also, what engines they had, to me at least the whole AL-31 family info i can find online or in books (i do have Y. Gordon's Su-27 book) is totally confusing. All i can make out is that apparently the AL-37FU is the predecessor or the initial designation of the 117S (the compressor diameter seems to be the same), but i digress here though as now i'm wading into Su-37 territory.

So, did those preseries Su-27M/Su-35 use any uprated engines, or have any T-10M prototypes used/tested uprated engines of whatever designation (i know 710 tested the 117S, that doesn't count as it really has to do with the later Su-35S)?

Thank you.
 
Preseries using the slotted planar array N011. as far as i know. The Phased array Bars only used in Su-37 Demonstrator. N012 was apparently never in hardware stage.

cant help on the engine side tho. sorry.
 
all the Su-27m aircraft used the mechanical scan version of Bars except 711 and 712 which used the PESA bars (early version) found on the MKI these where notional Advanced versions for later production batches. The three production aircraft where based on 709. According to Paralay the Su-27m never got an updated engine though one was planned. Notably a lot of articles from the time indicate it did but I see no evidence it existed as many of the Su-30 delivered in the early 2000s could have seriously used it.

The engines on the Su-37 are somewhat of a mystery. Some online sources indicate it had experimental updated engines with a short service life. On the other hand others say it was basically a proto Al-31fu and Al-37 is a mistranslation. I’ve found very little evidence of it’s existence but I would be interested in know.

I love the Su-27m and welcome any information on it.
 
F-2 said:
all the Su-27m aircraft used the mechanical scan version of Bars except 711 and 712 which used the PESA bars (early version) found on the MKI these where notional Advanced versions for later production batches. The three production aircraft where based on 709. According to Paralay the Su-27m never got an updated engine though one was planned. Notably a lot of articles from the time indicate it did but I see no evidence it existed as many of the Su-30 delivered in the early 2000s could have seriously used it.

The engines on the Su-37 are somewhat of a mystery. Some online sources indicate it had experimental updated engines with a short service life. On the other hand others say it was basically a proto Al-31fu and Al-37 is a mistranslation. I’ve found very little evidence of it’s existence but I would be interested in know.

I love the Su-27m and welcome any information on it.
Click to expand...
The AL-31FU was the precursor of the AL-31FP used on the Su-30MKI and its knock-offs. It used hydraulic instead of fuel for nozzle actuation and its nozzles were moving vertically with no hinge for yaw.

The AL-35F and AL-37FU were paper tigers only. The AL-31FM did exist some sources suggest and it was possibly tested on the Su-27M, not necessarily, all examples.
 
Scorpion82 said:
F-2 said:
all the Su-27m aircraft used the mechanical scan version of Bars except 711 and 712 which used the PESA bars (early version) found on the MKI these where notional Advanced versions for later production batches. The three production aircraft where based on 709. According to Paralay the Su-27m never got an updated engine though one was planned. Notably a lot of articles from the time indicate it did but I see no evidence it existed as many of the Su-30 delivered in the early 2000s could have seriously used it.

The engines on the Su-37 are somewhat of a mystery. Some online sources indicate it had experimental updated engines with a short service life. On the other hand others say it was basically a proto Al-31fu and Al-37 is a mistranslation. I’ve found very little evidence of it’s existence but I would be interested in know.

I love the Su-27m and welcome any information on it.
Click to expand...
The AL-31FU was the precursor of the AL-31FP used on the Su-30MKI and its knock-offs. It used hydraulic instead of fuel for nozzle actuation and its nozzles were moving vertically with no hinge for yaw.

The AL-35F and AL-37FU were paper tigers only. The AL-31FM did exist some sources suggest and it was possibly tested on the Su-27M, not necessarily, all examples.
Click to expand...
That’s pretty interesting! Do you have any info on the Al-31fm they tested or the paper projects?
 
F-2 said:
Scorpion82 said:
F-2 said:
all the Su-27m aircraft used the mechanical scan version of Bars except 711 and 712 which used the PESA bars (early version) found on the MKI these where notional Advanced versions for later production batches. The three production aircraft where based on 709. According to Paralay the Su-27m never got an updated engine though one was planned. Notably a lot of articles from the time indicate it did but I see no evidence it existed as many of the Su-30 delivered in the early 2000s could have seriously used it.

The engines on the Su-37 are somewhat of a mystery. Some online sources indicate it had experimental updated engines with a short service life. On the other hand others say it was basically a proto Al-31fu and Al-37 is a mistranslation. I’ve found very little evidence of it’s existence but I would be interested in know.

I love the Su-27m and welcome any information on it.
Click to expand...
The AL-31FU was the precursor of the AL-31FP used on the Su-30MKI and its knock-offs. It used hydraulic instead of fuel for nozzle actuation and its nozzles were moving vertically with no hinge for yaw.

The AL-35F and AL-37FU were paper tigers only. The AL-31FM did exist some sources suggest and it was possibly tested on the Su-27M, not necessarily, all examples.
Click to expand...
That’s pretty interesting! Do you have any info on the Al-31fm they tested or the paper projects?
Click to expand...

Earlier it was said that the AL-31FM would feature single crystal turbine blades and a FADEC system. The stated static thrust was 8100 kg dry and 13300 kg with AB. I think these thrust ratings were projected, but not achieved. Later sources stated 7700 kg dry and 12800 kg AB.
 
Concerning the AL-35F it was proposed to provide a rating of 8500 kg dry and 14000 kg AB to power the Su-35.

The AL-37FU had the same dry rating and 14500 kg AB. It added the 2D TVC nozzle with +/-15° defflection in the pitch plane only.
 
Scorpion82 said:
Concerning the AL-35F it was proposed to provide a rating of 8500 kg dry and 14000 kg AB to power the Su-35.

The AL-37FU had the same dry rating and 14500 kg AB. It added the 2D TVC nozzle with +/-15° defflection in the pitch plane only.
Click to expand...
Stretching but do you know what improvements these engines entailed? Like what would the physical changes be?
 
It is worth mention regarding different Russian AL_31 series engine, that you have two different entity producing them in Russia.
Salut.ru and MPO Saturn.

In the end, the Russian Export Flanker to India all came from NPO Saturn.

I believe some of the other Engine mentioned above are products from Salut.ru
 
Salut produced the original AL-31F and developed the FM1 and FM2. The later was proposed as an alternative solution to the AL-41F1 as an interim powerplant for the PAKFA, but the SATURN design prevailed. The AL-31FM1 reportedly powered the Su-27SM3, Su-33SM and later Su-34s. It might be, but I'm not sure about this that early Su-34 productio aircraft and the earlier Su-27SM were reengined with it.
 

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