Seaplane Striking Force versus Ekranoplans

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Archibald

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Archibald said:
Just for the fun of it, could an earlier development of Ekranoplans give a new focus to the SSF and particularly the Sea Master ?
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Unlikely: the Seaplane Striking Force would be completely ineffective as a counter to squadron-strength ekranoplans. The logic of 'they have them, so we need them too' is fairly simple mirror imaging of a kind the US didn't really go in for. Moreover, the A-90 - or an equivalent - would likely be recognised as a transport fairly quickly.

If it were to enter squadron service, the likely response would be increased emphasis on fighters and AEW in areas threatened with landings, and more interest in rapid-reaction counter-landing forces.
 
Ah the Ekranoplan. Promised to be the next big revolution yet so far has been a complete evolutionary dead end in terms of high-speed ships. Even the hydrofoil has died and to some extent the SES too. The 60s-late 80s were heady days when surface-effect high speed vessels seemed to be the future.

I view the Ekranoplan as another product of the technologist USSR - in that a bunch of skilled engineers and academics refined the concept towards the nth degree without really asking "why is this needed" without the need to worry about costs. Of course it wasn't just design bureaus, many technical colleges and DOSAAF clubs tinkered with them too. In the West, beyond Lippisch, nobody really invested into the concept. Probably having a lot of flat land and snow contributed to the Soviet preoccupation with WIG. But certainly you can't divorce Ekranoplans from the hydrofoil, air cushion and (to a lesser extent) SES efforts they were making - all paths to high-speed marine travel were being followed.

'Loon' and 'Bora' to me are two sides of the same coin. Both were probably flawed solutions, especially when the Soviet's weren't short of large FACs with SSMs.
 
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Ah the Ekranoplan. Promised to be the next big revolution yet so far has been a complete evolutionary dead end in terms of high-speed ships. Even the hydrofoil has died and to some extent the SES too. The 60s-late 80s were heady days when surface-effect high speed vessels seemed to be the future.
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Why did they all failed ? No room for a niche between speed-limited boats and weight-limited flying machines ?

(the word "niche" often amuses me, as in french it means dog kennel / dog house, on top of its other meaning as "niche" . Maybe ground effect vehicles were just a dog of an idea, hence their failure to find a... niche)
 
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Hood said:
But certainly you can't divorce Ekranoplans from the hydrofoil, air cushion and (to a lesser extent) SES efforts they were making - all paths to high-speed marine travel were being followed.
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As it's turned out, of course, the secret to high speed marine travel is to fly. Water is a fundamentally poor medium in which to travel quickly.

There's a story, possibly anecdotal, of a shipping analyst in the early years of the 20th century plotting out the increasing speeds of ocean liners, and predicting that by the 1960s, people would regularly be crossing the Atlantic at 600 knots. The great mystery, to him, was how such a thing could be possible without the heat of friction melting the hull.
 
As it's turned out, of course, the secret to high speed marine travel is to fly. Water is a fundamentally poor medium in which to travel quickly.
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Ok, but Ekranoplans did flew fast (albeit a bit too low for comfort, accordingly).

The Orlyonok was able to fly at 3000 m, admittedly those turbofans in the nose should have been fuel hogs, defeating the very Ekranoplan purpose, adding weight, complexity, fuel burn, the whole enchillada.
 
The idea is not completely gone, the Russians are designing the GEV, which would be capable of antiship and surface-to surface missile attack. This could be used to soften resistance during an amphibious assault with ekronplans. A kind of sea-blitzkrieg (pics of GEV and conceptual Marine amphibious ekronplan).
 

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Avpro strikes again!

The wings of the GEV look odd for a WIG, I presume the high-aspect ratio wing is to provide more wingborne lift rather than relying on ground cushion effect?
 
en.wikipedia.org

Beriev Be-10 - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org en.wikipedia.org
Just a question in passing - any chance that one brings back a few Seamasters as a symmetrical answer ?
Four Be-10s were seen at Tsushino meeting, 1961; was a Seamaster revival ever considered, according to this ?
 

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