Saunders Roe Hovercraft Aircraft Carrier

[uk 75]

On page 241 of "The Decline of British Seapower" by Desmond Wettern, the
then Minister of Aviation (Julian Amery) told a Business Dinner on 9 September 1964
that the Government were considering building an ocean-going "hovership" for the
RN. His Ministry and the MOD would make preliminary studies for a displacement vessel
capable of operating with the fleet using conventional propulsion or as a hovercraft.
The next day, Edward Wheeldon, Managing Director of Westland announced that a
1000 ton hovership was being examined, but in the interim a design for a 200- 400 ton
90 Knot frigate was being considered, which could be operational by 1970.

No further mention is made in DBS but in "Rebuilding the Royal Navy" D K Brown, a former
Naval constructor, explains what happened, or rather what did not happen, next. He recalls
that the study for a hovercraft with frigate capability would have cost 35 million Pounds.
Instead Brown gave the RN a sketch of a Whitby class based 50 Knot frigate. The RN realised it did not
want this ship and Brown comments "however, it did kill off the hoverfrigate". He adds that hovercraft
have their place for the "right roles".

Despite this official rejection Vosper Thorneycroft were still offering a 500 ton ocean going escort
hovership, pictured carrying a Lynx and with an RAF Nimrod overflying. Unfortunately I do not have
the 1970s brochure with this pic.

The US looked at a bigger version of the same concept with its SES programme, only to come to the
same conclusion, many dollars later, as DK Brown!

 

[Mike Pryce]

This may be of interest:

from http://www.vosper.co.uk/images/newgallery/index.htm

 

[Grey Havoc]

What's life without a little fun? ;D

 

[SteveO]

The Royal Navy Hovership that might happen...

http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,9060.msg81378.html#msg81378

Nice video too http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=bkVJS501Y78

 

[RP1]

Getting back on-topic,

Jane's Surface Skimmers 1978 has a copy of the illustration of the 500-ton VT hovercraft escort. It appears to be a hovercraft in the conventional sense (no rigid sides), armed with a 76mm, twin Bofors ASW mortar, 2 SCGs, probably 30mm, a flightdeck and hangar for a single Lynx.

There is also a side view of a 3000 tonne craft, again with flexible side skirts, powered by 5 GT, speed >100 knots, range 2800nm (at the same time?!), with provision for 2 helicopters or V/STOL aircraft operating from a flight deck fwd.

- RP1

 

[Gridlock]

British Rail got a hovercraft but not the senior service :


(as for a 100kt carrier, you may as well skip the hull entirely and just do a WIG mothership?)

 

[Grey Havoc]

Slightly off-topic, via ThinkDefence:

Falkland Islands 1969

Description Unissued / Unused material -

Falkland Islands.

LS of plane flying overhead. VS of a Royal Navy SRN6 Hovercraft being backed out of a hanger by troops. Shots in cockpit of hovercraft
as it moves around the seas around the Falklands. Shots of penguins on beach with hovercraft in background. More shots of penguins
in large colony. Some of the penguins appear to be moulting. Shots of the penguins swimming in the waves on the shore. More shots
of penguins. Good shots of the hovercraft coming and going from the beach. More penguin shots. There appear to several different
species of penguin.

Material dates from 19/03/1969.


Tags Falkland Islands Royal Navy RN SRN6 hovercrafts penguins

 

[joncarrfarrelly]

SAR0/Westland design from 1960, 1,500 ton Nuclear powered hovercraft aircraft carrier.
The aircraft look like Scimitars.


source: From River To Sea: The Marine Heritage of Sam Saunders

 

[JFC Fuller]

Thats awesome. They definitely look like Scimitars. Also note the Type 984 3D radar mounted on the island. It also appears to have 4 Seacat launchers. I have to say though that the scale looks messed up. The radar in particular looks too small whilst the Island appears to be narrower than one o the Scimitar's fuselages!

 

[Jemiba]

Quite right, I think ! A rough measurement, with the length of the Scimitar a reference, the island
would be about 3 m wide. Well, ok, that may be enough for managing the ship and flight deck.
About the radar, I made a comparison with that on HMS Victorious and the 3D-antenna of the hover
carrier seems to be about 3/5 of it.

 

[Hood]

I've done some rescaling and the island comes out at 45 feet by 10 feet. But the Scimitar on the deck comes out at 60 feet as opposed to the actual 55 feet.
There is also a complete lack of any fire-control for the four Seacat launchers and having a 984 for three Scimitars seems unlikely and there is no associated target indication radar for example. More of a pure imaginative concept than a thought-out proposal.

 

[uk 75]

The late 50s early 60s were a feast for what if hoverships see this thread
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,14486.0.html

Similar artists impressions also showed atomic powered hoverliners and submarine aircraft carriers.

 

[Grey Havoc]

I've done some rescaling and the island comes out at 45 feet by 10 feet. But the Scimitar on the deck comes out at 60 feet as opposed to the actual 55 feet.
There is also a complete lack of any fire-control for the four Seacat launchers and having a 984 for three Scimitars seems unlikely and there is no associated target indication radar for example. More of a pure imaginative concept than a thought-out proposal.

I suspect it was intended more as a high speed aircraft ferry intended to be able to operate within a warzone and to be able to quickly bring replacement aircraft within easy flying distance of aircraft carriers that needed them, rather than as a small combat carrier in it's own right.

 

[Grey Havoc]

This may be of interest:

from http://www.vosper.co.uk/images/newgallery/index.htm

The link is now dead, unfortunately.

 

[Julio Garay Terrazas]

Pictures of SWATH carriers are pretty rare...

I have a very bad english... ¿Is this a SWATH carrier? Read the russian link please:
https://raigap.livejournal.com/792226.html

 

[Mike Pryce]

Pictures of SWATH carriers are pretty rare...

I have a very bad english... ¿Is this a SWATH carrier? Read the russian link please:
https://raigap.livejournal.com/792226.html

View attachment 631613

It's a hovercraft carrier, with Supermarine Scimitars, so late 50s/early 60s, UK design.

 

[TomS]

Well spotted. According to Google Translate, it's a 1960 Sanders-Roe design -- 1500 tons, 88 meters long.

 

[JFC Fuller]

It even comes complete with a Type 984 radar, that catapult run is very short though.

I love the techno-optimism, a nuclear-powered, aircraft-carrying hovercraft!

 

[Tzoli]

And on 1.500tons no less! Like putting a reactor in a Frigate!
By the what was/is the smallest vessel which ran/run on nuclear power? If my memory serves right even the Nuclear Icebreakers are heavier!

 

[TomS]

And on 1.500tons no less! Like putting a reactor in a Frigate!
By the what was/is the smallest vessel which ran/run on nuclear power? If my memory serves right even the Nuclear Icebreakers are heavier!

Probably NR-1, the US Navy's nuclear research deep submersible submarine, at ~400 tons.

 

[Grey Havoc]

It even comes complete with a Type 984 radar, that catapult run is very short though.

I love the techno-optimism, a nuclear powered aircraft carrying hovercraft!

I suspect it was intended more as a high speed aircraft ferry intended to be able to operate within a warzone and to be able to quickly bring replacement aircraft within easy flying distance of aircraft carriers that needed them, rather than as a small combat carrier in it's own right.

 

[TomS]

It even comes complete with a Type 984 radar, that catapult run is very short though.

I love the techno-optimism, a nuclear powered aircraft carrying hovercraft!

I suspect it was intended more as a high speed aircraft ferry intended to be able to operate within a warzone and to be able to quickly bring replacement aircraft within easy flying distance of aircraft carriers that needed them, rather than as a small combat carrier in it's own right.

If the info at the link is to be believed (not totally convinced but it seems to hang together) this was meant as an ASW platform and the actual aircraft would have been some form of STOVL ASW aircraft (possibly with catapult assist, which would explain the really short cat?)

By the mid-1960s, the idea grew from this sketch to a 12,000-ton, 140-meter aircraft with 16 helicopters or STOVL aircraft. This version had immersed sidewalls (what we'd call an SES today) with conventional submerged propellers and a speed of 60 knots.

Both versions have that very distinctive Type 984 radar, which suggests something more than an aircraft ferry to me.

 

[Hood]

Don't we already have a thread about the Saunders Roe hovercraft carrier?
It's nothing to do with the subject of this thread though.

 

[stealthflanker]

And on 1.500tons no less! Like putting a reactor in a Frigate!

You can, by use of Gas cooled reactor a.k.a Nuclear Gas Turbine.

 

[Tzoli]

I assume this closed Nuclear Gas Turbine would not require the air intakes present on current Gas Turbine ships?

 

[stealthflanker]

Yes. The gas is re-cycled, so it wont need external air.

 

[riggerrob]

Are hovercraft vulnerable to sea-mines?
... land-mines?
How long would bad guys need to develop a new generation of anti-hovercraft-mines?

 

[riggerrob]

These catamarran,hovercraft, aircraft carriers mirror some earlier proposals for displacement hulled catamarran or trimarran escort carriers. The goal is to reduce hull rolling in heavy seas.
There have also been a few surface piercing catamarran proposals. Small waterline area hulls with the same objective of improving deck stability in rough seas. The question ermains: how light can you build an escort carrier before hangar volume or number of airframes suffers?

 

[Tzoli]

Hovercraft are basically safe from underwater mines, as for floating mines under a few centimeteres below the sea level I'm not so sure, for floating mines surely not, though that depends on the sensor of the mine. Actually are floating (on the water level) mines still used in this modern age?
Land mines, that is tricky as to my knowledge almost all anti tank mines are designed to detonate when a certain force was applied to them (or detect metal?) but for a Hovercraft whose only the cushion touches the soil not much. On the other hand the large force of downward oriented air might be able to unearth them if the vehicle to be float over them?
Weren't military hovercrafts when under developing were tasted for such occasions?

 

[TomS]

Sea mines come in so many varieties, it's hard to tell. Influence mines (acoustic, pressure, magnetic, etc.) are generally subsurface detonations, so true hovercraft should be pretty well insulated from the shock. Sidewall hovercraft (SES) would be potentially exposed, since they do have sidehulls and drivetrains in the water. Surface or shallow subsurface floating contact mines are definitely still a thing and could certainly threaten SES and skirted hovercraft.

 

[CNH]

Would it be vulnerable to a magnetic mine?

Mind you, there's no hint of this in Ray Wheeler's book.

 

[TomS]

Would it be vulnerable to a magnetic mine?

Mind you, there's no hint of this in Ray Wheeler's book.

See my comment about influence (including magnetic) mines above.

There was definitely interest in hovercraft for mine countermeasures by the Royal Navy and several others (the USN came close to buying a class of SES minehunters. Norway actually bought some.) Hovercrafts' apparent resistance to a lot of conventional influence sea mines was a factor. But there apparently were at least fears of dedicated anti-hovercraft mines with antenna triggers, to the extent that the National Hovercraft Trials Unit actually designed a team sweep to clear them (basically two hovercraft towing a chain between them).

Discussed in some detail here (from High Performance Marine Vessels by Liang Yun and Alan Bliault):

https://link.springer.com/content/pdf/bbm%3A978-1-4614-0869-7%2F1.pdf

 

[Grey Havoc]

Split and moved, but still yet, I haven't found that mentioned thread

Here's the thread you were looking for: https://www.secretprojects.co.uk/threads/the-royal-navy-hovership-that-never-was.13156/

Ah, yes, thank you, topics merged.

 

[jsport]

SAR0/Westland design from 1960, 1,500 ton Nuclear powered hovercraft aircraft carrier.
The aircraft look like Scimitars.


source: From River To Sea: The Marine Heritage of Sam Saunders

USSOCOM should be more interested in building some of these than an Amphibious C-130. A small Stealth VTOL transport launched from one of these would present a lot more air and sea options.