SALMSON 9Z Water-Cooled radial Engine - Unique!

[xylstra]

I am trying to obtain the patent of the wholly unique WW1-era SALMSON 9Z water-cooled radial engine which employed a novel 'true-motion' geared crankshaft system made to patents assigned to the Swiss inventor's Canton and Unne. I am informed that this patent dates to 1909. Can anyone adept with the patent search system locate it and provide a link? Many thanks!

 

[kmccut]

A link to the patent appears in this article:

EarlyEnginesS

Additional information appears here:

Salmson 9Z

 

[Nicknick]

I think is the same as the later Nordberg radial Diesel engines used.

 

[Basil]

If there is interest in patents of true motion connecting rods patents for radial engines - I have gathered some (they are all from Curtiss Wright).

 

[Basil]

A link to the patent appears in this article:

EarlyEnginesS

Additional information appears here:

Salmson 9Z

kmccut,
slightly off topic - in your excellent book about the 42 cylinder Wright Tornado engine, you mention that a true motion connecting rod version was evaluated. Do you know which kind of true motion mechanism was considered?

 

[kmccut]

... the 42 cylinder Wright Tornado engine, you mention that a true motion connecting rod version was evaluated. Do you know which kind of true motion mechanism was considered?

Not precisely. However there was no shortage of candidates, including Roland Chilton's U.S. Patent No. 2,040,465 and Rudy Daub's U.S. Patent NO. 2,259,102.
As far as I know, the only true-motion connecting rod scheme to enter production was the Canton-Unne mechanism that Salmson used.

 

[Basil]

Not precisely. However there was no shortage of candidates, including Roland Chilton's U.S. Patent No. 2,040,465 and Rudy Daub's U.S. Patent NO. 2,259,102.
As far as I know, the only true-motion connecting rod scheme to enter production was the Canton-Unne mechanism that Salmson used.

Yes, the only aero engine. The Nordberg was also a true motion system.

 

[kmccut]

Yes, the only aero engine. The Nordberg was also a true motion system.

After I posted, it occurred to me that rotary engines with slipper connecting rods (Le Rhone) could be considered true-motion.

 

[Nicknick]

There is also the Adam Farewell and the Burlat engine (take a look in "ungewöhnliche Motoren" (unusual engines) by Stefan Ziema. An excellent book writen by a former Maybach/MTU embloyer.

Intrestingly, the Nordberg engines (mentioned in #3 #7) were built with two differrent systems, one with the Salmson gearing and others with a kind of Watt System between two oposed conrods.

 

[Basil]

There is also the Adam Farewell and the Burlat engine (take a look in "ungewöhnliche Motoren" (unusual engines) by Stefan Ziema. An excellent book writen by a former Maybach/MTU embloyer.

I have this book; thanks for the hint.

 

[F119Doctor]

After I posted, it occurred to me that rotary engines with slipper connecting rods (Le Rhone) could be considered true-motion.

I always thought it was interesting that the rotary engine pistons never had any significant reciprocating motion or loads, with the pistons just circling the crankshaft throw.

 

[xylstra]

I think is the same as the later Nordberg radial Diesel engines used.

No Nick, very different. The only similarity is the use of gears.

 

[xylstra]

If there is interest in patents of true motion connecting rods patents for radial engines - I have gathered some (they are all from Curtiss Wright).

It was Wilton Lundquist's special interest. He went on to invent the THIOKOL 'DynaStar' after retiring from C-W.

 

[xylstra]

After I posted, it occurred to me that rotary engines with slipper connecting rods (Le Rhone) could be considered true-motion.

Of course Kim but really only suited to the low power outputs of the day; just not robust enough for high-output engines. Ralph Sarich's orbital rotary engine may also be considered 'true-motion'.

 

[xylstra]

A link to the patent appears in this article:

EarlyEnginesS

Additional information appears here:

Salmson 9Z

Thanks Kim, answers my question; tried French and US patent databases, no luck. Looks like C-U were eying up the Brits! Hope things are going well by the way.

 

[Nicknick]

No Nick, very different. The only similarity is the use of gears.

Please explain why

 

[Nicknick]

I always thought it was interesting that the rotary engine pistons never had any significant reciprocating motion or loads, with the pistons just circling the crankshaft throw.

In fact, the Coreolis forces acting on the pistons made lubrication quite demanding on these engines (in combination with the centrifugal forces driving the oil out to the exhaust valves...)

 

[Basil]

It was Wilton Lundquist's special interest. He went on to invent the THIOKOL 'DynaStar' after retiring from C-W.

... not only Lundquist, there were several other engineers at CW, who are also mentioned as inventors for several true motion mechanisms. Btw, I did not find a single true motion patent at Pratt & Whitney ...

 

[publiusr]

A radial and water-cooled?

Proof that internal combustion engines can have schizophrenia...

 

[Temistocle]

Thanks Kim, answers my question; tried French and US patent databases, no luck. Looks like C-U were eying up the Brits! Hope things are going well by the way.

Hi Xlystra, maybe you can find something (as the pdf below) on the european Espacenet search engine, there are a lot of GB and FR patents from Canton and Unne:

Canton and Unne on Espacenet