Indian near future developments

[avatar]

India is actively engaged in hypersonic research and TAV tech ... take a look
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showthread.php?t=434074&page=6


and
http://picasaweb.google.com/khurana.shashank/SpaceExpoAtIAC2007

and

http://www.combustioninstitute-indiansection.com/pdf/SCRAMJET%20COMBUSTOR%20DEVELOPMENT.pdf


and interestingly


http://www.deccanherald.com/DeccanHerald.com/Content/Dec282007/national2007122843567.asp?section=updatenews

look at the last few pages

http://www.ias.ac.in/currsci/dec252007/1697.pdf

 

[avatar]

A possible configuration of ISRO's RLV

 

[avatar]

Right here' some stuff from
http://www.skyscrapercity.com/showtjavascript:void(0);hread.php?t=434074&page=6

 

[avatar]

More from the same

 

[blackstar]

India is actively engaged in hypersonic research and TAV tech ... take a look

A friend of mine who is currently writing a history of the Indian space program is unconvinced that these projects are actually "real." Certainly they are doing some research, but as anybody who has read Aviation Week knows, hypersonics is very tough. The US and Soviet Union never cracked that nut with all their resources. My friend thinks that this is primarily a technological fetish and that the Indians will eventually give up on it.

 

[flateric]

A.S.?

 

[avatar]

heh heh,

Blackstar,

I think you should check up on your Friend's antecedents a little bit..

if he is a non-indian then I would seriously doubt that his level of access will extend beyond the official archives. In India , like elsewhere , only a few select 'outsiders' ( favourite journos) are given any kind of access . That is precisely why some non-proliferation ayatollahs end up looking at the GSLV or PSLV as potential "ICBMs" :

of course if he is one of those favoured outsiders , i would seriously doubt that he would be mentioning anything of this sort to you , unless you are more 'in' than you are letting on here.The "technological fetish" as your friend terms it has led to the creation of some very sophisticated wind tunnels and CFD backed by ever increasing computing ability . i don't think its a fad . there is a worldwide hypersonic race going on , both for offense as well as countermeasures. Remember India has already developed sophisticated BMD capabilities, undergoing testing right now. Lot of people thought that was a pipe dream as well. Not anymore even Aviation week seems to have wisened up to Indian capabilities.

The first hypersonic kid of the block will be the Brahmos-2 , being co-developed with Russia. As we all know the Russians are well up in this field and had the dissolution of the USSR not intervened we would have seen more in their ORBAT. And by the way, as per a lot of accounts, The U.S and the USSR did crack that nut. dear old Aviation Week's current high priest has built a career swearing by it , if you know what I mean.


As far as this general theme of -
X & Y didn't do it , how can you (Z) with less money and less years of sophistication, well the Chandrayaan -I in its own way proves that to be a bit off landish.


Like they say . Time will tell, my friend . Time will tell.

 

[Michel Van]

a lot of pepole are surprise who fare India is in Space Flight

but they work since 1957 !
Dr. Vikram Sarabhai was the founding father of
the Indian space program after launch of Sputnik

1964 July 14 India first launch of Loki sounding rocket.
1970s they copy the Scout rocket and Build SLV
in same time they made joinventure with French CNES
for new type Diamant BC Rocket (to save Ariane Program,CNES chancels Diamant program)
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,4130.msg43706.html#msg43706

but the ISRO stay close contact with CNES since 1970s
in 1980s came ASLV and first IRBM Agni and SRM Prithvi
1990s PSLV & GSLV and GSLV-III in 2008 ?

last three rocket have a lot Ariane Rocket technology, provide by CNES
like Viking Engine and Ariane 4 liquid Booster
and allot Russian rocket technology buy by ISRO
like RD-56 Lh2/Lox engine

 

[avatar]

Michael, Michael


Could you say, provide a link for the following assertions-

last three rocket have a lot Ariane Rocket technology, provide by CNES Wink
like Viking Engine and Ariane 4 liquid Booster
and allot Russian rocket technology buy by ISRO
like RD-56 Lh2/Lox engine

By the way I have no beef with you . All space going technologies were originally developed by the nazis ;D , and whatever has come after that , are simply improved copies. But But , Himmler got all the Vimana tech from Hindu scriptures and so ultimately all modern tech originates in India via max mueller et al...



On a "firmer note" , the space program actually started off as part of the DAE . the first rocket launched by India was a Nike Apache supplied by the united States . India has come a long way since then , being able to send a sizeable spacecraft built indigenously all the way to the moon on an indigenous rocket .


The GSLV III is scheduled for launch in the 2009-10 time frame. It will not use the Russian supplied cryogenic engines but instead use the indigenous version.


However a more cost effective launcher using semi-cryogenic engines that will be able to launch 10-20 tonnes into LEO is on the way as well.

 

[flateric]

HSTDV found at pakistanidefenceforum.com

 

[antigravite]

HSTDV is very well known.

The most extensive analytic article ever published on this project was published last year by Air et Cosmos, the French aerospace and defense weekly. This article is written in French and well quoted in the literature.

To the best of my knowledge, the 4 engine model shown above does not match anything published -- at least not in easy access publication.

Again, litterature available on HSTDV is extensive.
On the specific unknown model I refered to, nothing seems to be available. Thus my questions...

AntiGravite

 

[avatar]

Alright , here's a wind tunnel model of ISRO's RLV

http://www.nal.res.in/picts/ntaf221208.jpg

 

[Michel Van]

Michael, Michael


Could you say, provide a link for the following assertions-

last three rocket have a lot Ariane Rocket technology, provide by CNES Wink
like Viking Engine and Ariane 4 liquid Booster
and allot Russian rocket technology buy by ISRO
like RD-56 Lh2/Lox engine

upps i forgot again the sources ...

the RD-56 engine
http://www.astronautix.com/engines/rd56.htm#RD-56
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/SPACE/space-launchers-gslv.html#gslvmk1
only for study because:
http://www.space-travel.com/reports/Flight_Acceptance_Hot_Test_Of_Indigenous_Cryogenic_Engine_Successful_999.html

the use of Ariane hardware by ISRO (only in German language.)
http://www.bernd-leitenberger.de/indien.shtml
usefull link
http://www.bharat-rakshak.com/SPACE/index.html

 

[Archibald]

http://www.asindia.org/gnana.aspx

When ISRO embarked on the development of Liquid rocket engines, Shri. Gandhi was drawn to the main stream of liquid rocket development. He was deputed to SEP, France from 1976 to 79 for the acquisition of VIKING engine technology.

Voila!

 

[avatar]

yeah! yeah !

Viking input is pretty much there in Vikas tech ... but inputs only

 

[XP67_Moonbat]

Here's something I found Encylopedia Astronautica about a two-man capsule proposed by ISRO:

http://www.astronautix.com/craft/orbhicle.htm

And a pic to with it.

Moonbat

 

[hesham]

Hi,

http://upload.wikimedia.org/wikipedia/en/e/e7/AVATAR-1.JPG

 

[avatar]

http://indianspaceweb.blogspot.com/2009/12/world-exclusive-pictures-indias.html

 

[XP67_Moonbat]

A little something on Indian hypersonic research:

http://espace.library.uq.edu.au/eserv.php?pid=UQ:121518&dsID=Reddy_afmc_16_07.pdf

and launcher development:
www.ias.ac.in/currsci/dec252007/1697.pdf

 

[XP67_Moonbat]

Snapshot of a Powerpoint on how to do a moon landing, Indian style.

 

[blackstar]

Their crew and service module masses look like they are greater than NASA's Orion...

 

[XP67_Moonbat]

Yeah, I was thinking that they might need an upgrade in their launcher capability. More solid boosters or an advanced LH2 stage, perhaps?

 

[blackstar]

Yeah, I was thinking that they might need an upgrade in their launcher capability. More solid boosters or an advanced LH2 stage, perhaps?

They give lift-off weights of 3075 and 1690 tons for their two boosters. That provides a baseline comparison. A quick search I just did gives a Delta IV Heavy lift off weight of over 733 tons and launch weight for the Ares I is 805 tons. Saturn V is 3038 tons.

So, essentially they're proposing a Saturn V equivalent vehicle, and a second vehicle with a little more than half the mass. So they're talking about some really large rockets.

 

[XP67_Moonbat]

Well either their numbers are way off, or what I posted is a long-term projection of future launcher capability. Either way though, you're right. That's whole lotta rocket!

 

[blackstar]

Snapshot of a Powerpoint on how to do a moon landing, Indian style.

So where is this snapshot from? Who gave the presentation and when?

 

[XP67_Moonbat]

Hey you go

http://www.hobbyspace.com/nucleus/index.php?itemid=17498

 

[blackstar]

That's amusing, thank you.

It's amusing because there is currently a theme (I hate using the word "meme") running through some New Space advocates that fuel depots are obviously superior to heavy lift launch vehicles, and that multiple launches of smaller vehicles are obviously superior to heavy lift launch vehicles. These people are such strong advocates of this idea that they see it everywhere, even when it is not there. Recently they twisted a NASA diagram about a possible Chinese lunar architecture into "proof" that the Chinese had rejected the heavy lift vehicle approach. But now the Chinese are apparently looking at the possibility of a heavy lift (Saturn V class) rocket, and the Indians have of course produced this assessment. The "obviously superior" multiple-launch/lunar depot approach doesn't seem to be so superior to the Indians, Chinese, or even NASA...

And if you look at that post and look at the comments, you'll see exactly that attitude--annoyance that the Indians are not smart enough to choose the fuel depot approach.

Of course, I'm also over-simplifying. The reality is that there are multiple ways to conduct a lunar mission, and it is hard to say that one way or another is superior without first looking at the assumptions that go into the design. But there's a certain attitude among New Space advocates that they are smarter than the people who actually develop the rockets.

 

[mz]

blackstar, that depends. If you don't even analyze multi-launch scenarios, or dismiss them for weird reasons like was done in ESAS that produced the Ares I and V, you have a hard time judging how good they are.

But none of this Indian or Chinese stuff will ever be built anyway.

It really seems a large portion of space planning is dreaming of copying what NASA does, since it has the most money. Witness ESA's Ariane V made for Hermes for example - though it's oversimplifying as well.

 

[antigravite]

Hypersonics in India is a bit confusing.

Just found this today and that might be of interest. Isro scramjet stuff.

A.

 

[Grey Havoc]

ORIGINAL CAPTION: After a flight of about 300 seconds, the vehicle touched down in the Bay of Bengal, approximately 320 km from Sriharikota. The vehicle was successfully tracked during its flight from the ground stations at Sriharikota," reads a statement released by ISRO.

India tests new scramjet rocket engine (Sputnik, via Spacedaily)​

 

[antigravite]

ORIGINAL CAPTION: After a flight of about 300 seconds, the vehicle touched down in the Bay of Bengal, approximately 320 km from Sriharikota. The vehicle was successfully tracked during its flight from the ground stations at Sriharikota," reads a statement released by ISRO.

India tests new scramjet rocket engine (Sputnik, via Spacedaily)​

Great news! But has to be careful with acronyms and images. I'm not quite sure this Russian source article actually refers to pictured HSTDV - a DRDO related project — although the illustrative, editing picture is. ISRO has its own scramjet research program, which has been flown tested over the last few years. Not surprising. HSTDV is mostly military-related, changed scopes and aims at developing enabling technologies for joint Indo-Russian (classified) hypersonic Brahmos-2 missile complying with MTCR.

So. What's the status of HSTDV?
A.

 

[antigravite]

Hi,

Dealing now with the couple of preceding posts.
This experimental scramjet flown-tested by ISRO was announced for a while; it is codenamed ATV-D02.

ISRO's Press communiqué is dated August 28, 2016 and available from here:

http://www.isro.gov.in/update/28-aug-2016/successful-flight-testing-of-isros-scramjet-engine-technology-demonstrator

Also see how media handled the story:

http://www.deccanchronicle.com/science/science/160816/new-gslv-launch-in-september.html

http://www.dailypioneer.com/columnists/edit/pocket-friendly-rockets.html

http://www.ndtv.com/india-news/isro-tests-new-rocket-engine-that-could-make-launches-10-times-cheaper-1451222?pfrom=home-lateststories

Watcha, Youtube now also has its share:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=4_pNfJ33gaY

So… enjoy,

A.

 

[Grey Havoc]

http://www.parabolicarc.com/2018/07/23/isro-signs-contracts-outsource-satellite-production/

 

[bobbymike]

India takes a step towards hypersonic capability | Shephard

India's latest test of its HAVA hypersonic vehicle takes the country a step further towards fielding a functional weapon system.

www.shephardmedia.com