If the whole USSR(1991) crosses back to June 22,1941…

Sigh... This was discussed numerous time on Russian main alternate history community, and made a plot of some (quite low-quality) alternate history novels.

Personally, despite being Russian, I don't exactly like the "popadantsy" genre (rus. "popadanets" - from "popast", unexpectedly found yourself in some place or situation you have no intention to enter. Used as slang term for fiction genre, in which peoples became transported to the past). Though I like some Western fiction of this type - like Eric Flint's "1632", and Taylor Anderson's "Destroyermen" (heh, one of the books even mention me in authors foreword ;) ), the majority of Russian fiction in such genre is hopeless. It basically boil down to "Mary Sue from our days became transported to glorious past, and immediately started to boss Tsar/Lenin/Stalin around, effortlessly defeating Germans, British and Americans for Mother Russia glory". Most of those books are of zero literature quality, main character is author's self-insert over-patriotic Mary Sue. Unfortunately, public quite like it, so they became... ubiquitous.
 
So a re-write of the John Birmingham series? A good read BTW. at least he gave Stalin one ship, to exploit, and one for the Japanese as well.
 
Fluff said:
So a re-write of the John Birmingham series? A good read BTW. at least he gave Stalin one ship, to exploit, and one for the Japanese as well.
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Please. John Birmingham is absolutely incompetent writer. His absurd ideas about USSR I could only classify as "utter lack of knowledge mixed with brain-deranging case of Russophobia". He really suggested that USSR in 1942 could make an armistice with Germany only because knowledge from future showed that USSR and USA would became opponents in the future. Not only this is psychologically impossible - the population, the military, the party would not agree on any kind of armistice without Germans completely retreating from USSR - but it also based on absurd premise that Stalin somehow did not anticipate USSR/US tensions after war. Newsflash to Birmingham; Stalin wasn't naive, and perfectly understood, that USSR and US most likely would not remain friends for long after war.
 
Dilandu said:
Fluff said:
So a re-write of the John Birmingham series? A good read BTW. at least he gave Stalin one ship, to exploit, and one for the Japanese as well.
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Please. John Birmingham is absolutely incompetent writer. His absurd ideas about USSR I could only classify as "utter lack of knowledge mixed with brain-deranging case of Russophobia". He really suggested that USSR in 1942 could make an armistice with Germany only because knowledge from future showed that USSR and USA would became opponents in the future. Not only this is psychologically impossible - the population, the military, the party would not agree on any kind of armistice without Germans completely retreating from USSR - but it also based on absurd premise that Stalin somehow did not anticipate USSR/US tensions after war. Newsflash to Birmingham; Stalin wasn't naive, and perfectly understood, that USSR and US most likely would not remain friends for long after war.
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He sure sold a lot of books……
 
You don't rate 'popadantsy' very high either, so adapting John Birmingham's crap plots to a crap genre shouldn't be too much of a worry, no?
If I start taking umbrage at the lack of quality of media aimed at the masses - daily repeats of Judge Judy? the Daily Fail? RT? - honestly, I wouldn't have time left to sleep, or breathe.

I must admit to not having read anything by John Birmingham, so, for now, I am deferring to your opinion of him. Until someone else offers another opinion.
 
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Arjen said:
If I start taking umbrage at the lack of quality of media for the masses - daily repeats of Judge Judy? the Daily Fail? RT? - honestly, it wouldn't have time left to sleep, or breathe.
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No fash, I'm just following doctor's advice.
 
One Russian amateur poet once wrote this satirical gem about "popadantsy", and I translated it on English as close as possible:

Vasily the time-traveler strolls through forest,
In distant past, in long-forgotten time,
His soul sang as victorious chorus,
And slender hands held firmly a flash drive.

His laptop filled with wonders of science,
Blueprints of A-bomb, cure from common cold,
And Mother Russia, with Vasya in alliance,
Would firmly held the crown of the world!

He brought all schemes of wonderful devices;
Tanks, planes, battleships of steel, or wood,
And also many useful advices –
Who should be shot (for sake of Greater Good!)

He went to Tsar; but Lenin would suit also;
But Stalin’s better, ‘cause he cool & smart
And German Reich’s would surely meet fiasco,
With Vasya’s help, it wouldn't get a start!

To whom exact? He simply doesn’t care
For every era the recipe is done,
Kalashnikov’s would stop the Napoleon!
And cannons make short work of Genghis Khan.

And all the Tsars, Genseks and Knyazs of Russia,
Would quickly fell in line with Vasya’s plans.
When great knowledge (stored on the laptop),
Would put ultimate power in their hands.

And Vasya could almost heard the fanfares;
From nobody he would be a superstar!
…He didn’t notice the Jurassic forest,
And Allosaurus cold unblinking eyes…

(c, written by Rysenok Den. Translated by me)
 
Dilandu said:
One Russian amateur poet once wrote this satirical gem about "popadantsy", and I translated it on English as close as possible:

Vasily the time-traveler strolls through forest,
In distant past, in long-forgotten time,
His soul sang as victorious chorus,
And slender hands held firmly a flash drive.

His laptop filled with wonders of science,
Blueprints of A-bomb, cure from common cold,
And Mother Russia, with Vasya in alliance,
Would firmly held the crown of the world!

He brought all schemes of wonderful devices;
Tanks, planes, battleships of steel, or wood,
And also many useful advices –
Who should be shot (for sake of Greater Good!)

He went to Tsar; but Lenin would suit also;
But Stalin’s better, ‘cause he cool & smart
And German Reich’s would surely meet fiasco,
With Vasya’s help, it wouldn't get a start!

To whom exact? He simply doesn’t care
For every era the recipe is done,
Kalashnikov’s would stop the Napoleon!
And cannons make short work of Genghis Khan.

And all the Tsars, Genseks and Knyazs of Russia,
Would quickly fell in line with Vasya’s plans.
When great knowledge (stored on the laptop),
Would put ultimate power in their hands.

And Vasya could almost heard the fanfares;
From nobody he would be a superstar!
…He didn’t notice the Jurassic forest,
And Allosaurus cold unblinking eyes…

(c, written by Rysenok Den. Translated by me)
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Interesting Dilandu, I did not see you with a penchant for poetry but rather radio control, guidance, marine.Sincerely yours.Klem
 
Dilandu said:
klem said:
Interesting Dilandu, I did not see you with a penchant for poetry but rather radio control, guidance, marine.Sincerely yours.Klem
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Well, as I mentioned above - it is not mine. I merely translated it on English.
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Yes, I know, dear Dilandu, it was just to greet you.Amicably yours.Klem
 
Dilandu said:
Sigh... This was discussed numerous time on Russian main alternate history community, and made a plot of some (quite low-quality) alternate history novels.

Personally, despite being Russian, I don't exactly like the "popadantsy" genre (rus. "popadanets" - from "popast", unexpectedly found yourself in some place or situation you have no intention to enter. Used as slang term for fiction genre, in which peoples became transported to the past). Though I like some Western fiction of this type - like Eric Flint's "1632", and Taylor Anderson's "Destroyermen" (heh, one of the books even mention me in authors foreword ), the majority of Russian fiction in such genre is hopeless. It basically boil down to "Mary Sue from our days became transported to glorious past, and immediately started to boss Tsar/Lenin/Stalin around, effortlessly defeating Germans, British and Americans for Mother Russia glory". Most of those books are of zero literature quality, main character is author's self-insert over-patriotic Mary Sue. Unfortunately, public quite like it, so they became... ubiquitous.;)
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Hummm,my mean is that……the Gorbachev's USSR (with T-80U,R-36 and too many weapon) come back from December 24, 1991 to June 22,1941,and face the Nazi army.
 
You have left the realm of alternate history, and passed into fantasy. I do not think this is fit for this forum.
 
it is still fantasy, but most probably they need to realize in first 12-24h what happened. Then they will stop Wehrmacht maybe even without tactical nukes within 72h. Then they will burn Los Alamos and Oak Ridge with SS18 to stop US nuclear weapons development. And game over - USSR rule the world. Just take a look at “Man in High Castle”. Same story, different colours.
 
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Seems to me a good yarn can be written about time traveling chunks of a nation and/or its military. But to be *good* literature, the resulting time displacement should not be such that those traveling back have it easy. 1991 USSR in its entirety going back to WWII would, as noted, easily conquer the entire planet. But a single USSR army base? That would be interesting. A single US navy aircraft carrier going back to WWII makes things interesting. A few counties in West Virginia going back to 1632 is interesting. But sending an entire empire to a time when their planetary conquest would be assured? Bleah.

Some years ago I had the idea of a story where the planet got yoinked in two: one day there is a Mighty Flash and the US loses contact with the Old World, but retains it with South America. As the hours pass, the satellites overhead thin out. In the end, the half of the satellites that were over the eastern hemisphere have vanished. Long story short, when expeditions finally get over to Europe and Asia, it's found that while it is (handwave) 2021 back in the US, it's 832 AD on the other side of the planet.

At the same time, folks are going about their business in 2021 Europe when, mighty flash, boom, North and South America are in 832 AD. The story then splits in two, covering the succeeding generations. In the world where the Old World is "modern," it becomes a race between many nations to claim chunks of North and South America and the resources they hold, with the Russians snagging Alaska and Canada, China grabbing for the West coast, Britain and France going after the east coast of the former US and Canada, everybody and their brother racing to grab all the gold and oil and real estate, with wars becoming quite common, and a whole lot of Native Americans *really* surprised at the sudden influx of invaders with magic superpowers. On the other side of reality, the US, the sole real power in their world, makes some effort to restrain efforts to colonize the Old World, with limited success. You get missionaries attempting to spread modern Christianity throughout the old world, including attempts to roll back Islam, still young and sporty; people sneaking around Europe doing the archaeologist/anthropologist thing. Attempts at a Prime Directive fail instantly because the skies of the Old World are suddenly filled with satellites.

But this story of mine is still a good chunk of wish fulfillment, with the US suddenly no longer encumbered with old world nonsense, while the Old World is freed to be as bad as it ever was. Thus it was never written much further than summaries like this because... well, it's kinda crap.
 
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Of course I am guilty of my own daydream UK 75 world in which TSR2s sit on duty on Cyprus and in Singapore while BOAC flies both Concorde and Boeing 2707s to both places.
 

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