Drawings / art work of USS Long Beach (CGN-9) as original frigate design?

[Pioneer]

I was reading about USS Long Beach (CGN-9).
It stated that she was first laid out to be a smaller frigate, but expanded to a cruiser hull due to the ship being slated for the Regulus nuclear cruise missile and later, 4 launching tubes for the Polaris SLBM!

Does anyone know if there are any drawings / artist works of her in her original frigate configuration?
Also is there any drawings / artist work of her with these four Polaris SLBM's?
Especially artist impressions of Long Beach firing these planned SLBM's

Thanks in advance!!
Pioneer

 

[Antonio]

You should take a look Friedman's "US Cruisers" pg 403 for info about the USS Long Beach origins. there are some scheme drawings but no contemporary artist work on it.

According to the book, the beginning of the CLGN study series (9-January-1956) was a 570 x 55 feet, 8,900 tons ship with two 5-in/54s forward and a Terrier aft. She also has quintuple antisurface-ship torpedo tubes amidships.

It seems the ship was classified a cruiser from the beginning. And the bigger selected design was not influenced by the possible instalation of Regulus and Polaris. The inclusion of that weapons would have meant an even bigger ship.

 

[Antonio]

I have only seen that info about she was first considered a frigate from the wikipedia. I haven't seen it from my books.
The USN refered to its DL category (Destroyer leaders http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_United_States_Navy_destroyer_leaders) also as frigates. (In analogy to the Saling era frigates)

The dimensions and weapons of the very first design for the future USS Long Beach were very similar to the DL category but it was classified as cruiser from the first moment.

Notes:

Ships in the DL class were reclassified to Destroyers or Cruisers in early 70's.

Destroyer Leader definiton: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Destroyer_leader

 

[Antonio]

from Friedman's book:

the ship was actually built with foundations for 8 Polaris launch tubes

This tubes should had been placed amidships I guess, the same location considered for the Regulus system. There are no drawings in the book showing neither the Regulus nor the Polaris.

But I have found this art work from Björn Landströms "The Ship: an illustrated history". You can see the Regulus instalation here.

 

[Pioneer]

Hay pometablava

Thanks for your help and great snippets of info
Been meaning to reply earlier, but I have been bush the good part of a week



Regards
Pioneer

 

[RyanC]

This might be related to the CGN-9 Early Designs. Don't know.

 

[RyanC]

This is definitely Long Beach with Reggie II.

 

[Howedar]

The latter is interesting in that it shows the huge block superstructure but only conventional rotating radars (seemingly SPS-39 and... it's hard to tell beyond that).

The former (which I christen "Bubble Beach") is just freaking bizarre. No visible search sets to speak of, other than a bloated SPS-10. The RAT amidships (and it is indeed the twin-ready-round RAT) is notable.

 

[Graham1973]

This might be related to the CGN-9 Early Designs. Don't know.

I once read that before they settled on the Long Beach, there were some earlier larger Nuclear Cruiser designs with what were described as four shaft power-plants, I've never been able to run down information on those proposals, but that might be related to those proposals.

Edit: I've been trying to remember where I saw the information above. The book that came to mind was "Conway's All the worlds Warships 1947-1982". I'm going to try and find a copy and confirm this.

 

[Arjen]

Although Long Beach is a substantial ship at over 14,000t, she stands in contrast to much larger nuclear cruisers proposed in the mid-1950s, with four-shaft plants more closely approaching traditional cruiser power.

Conway's All the World's Fighting Ships 1947-1995

 

[Graham1973]

Although Long Beach is a substantial ship at over 14,000t, she stands in contrast to much larger nuclear cruisers proposed in the mid-1950s, with four-shaft plants more closely approaching traditional cruiser power.

Conway's All the World's Fighting Ships 1947-1995

Thanks, I'd found that a copy of the 1947-82 version was in the State library but had no chance to check it out. Now, has anyone been able to find out anything about those earlier designs?

 

[Arjen]

You would need some early 'fifties editons of Jane's Fighting Ships, I once held a copy in my hands but I was out of cash at the time.

 

[Grey Havoc]

The former (which I christen "Bubble Beach") is just freaking bizarre. No visible search sets to speak of, other than a bloated SPS-10. The RAT amidships (and it is indeed the twin-ready-round RAT) is notable.

For those members who are unfamilar with this weapon: http://www.designation-systems.net/dusrm/app4/rat.html

 

[moin1900]

Cruiser of Tommorow
"SALU" nuclear powered guided missile cruiser concept art.
ALL HANDS MAGAZINE
1956 JUNE Page 35
http://www.navy.mil/ah_online/department_arch1956.html

Long Beach with Polaris launcher concept art.
ALL Hands Magazine
1961 MAY PAGE 34
http://www.navy.mil/ah_online/department_arch1961.html

An artist's concept of a Laser Fleet Air Defense Weapon
https://research.archives.gov/id/6386999

 

[Tzoli]

I've once found the image showing that WW2 paint scheme of the Long Beach variant on the entire hull:
http://i1179.photobucket.com/albums/x390/navydavesof/iphone092_zps4a82a3a4.jpg

 

[Antonio]

If a bigger version is needed I can post the rest of the image I attached in 2009...the book is still on my bookshelf ;-)

 

[Tzoli]

That would be nice. The drawings clearly shows the final Long Beach with some differences like a Regulus II rather a Regulus I of the preliminaries or Polaris as envisoned for her when laid down, not to mention the octogonal Bridge which is only a feature of the preliminaries. I do like to know the last designs offered to the board before choosing which one to build!

 

[Antonio]

Here it is

 

[Tzoli]

Thank you!
Interesting, it seems to lack the second pair of Terrier Guidance radars and no storage space for the Regulus II? Apart from the missing SPS-32/33 radars it looks interesting in this WW2 camo scheme!

 

[Antonio]

Interesting, it seems to lack the second pair of Terrier Guidance radars and no storage space for the Regulus II? Apart from the missing SPS-32/33 radars it looks interesting in this WW2 camo scheme!

Edited in 1961, the text in the book is most divulgative than authoritative. Since he illustrated an intermediate configuration, I shouldn't take a 100% accuracy for granted. The camouflage is "wartime supposition" according to the author's own words. I think we should better take it with a grain of salt.

The Ship

This is the story of the ship - a journey of six thousand years on all the waters of the world. The Ship takes us from Queen Hatshepsut's...

www.goodreads.com

Björn Landström - Wikipedia

en.wikipedia.org

 

[TomS]

Cruiser of Tommorow
"SALU" nuclear powered guided missile cruiser concept art.
ALL HANDS MAGAZINE
1956 JUNE Page 35

http://www.navy.mil/ah_online/department_arch1956.html

New link for this (the photo in Post #6 is by far the best quality version I've seen of this):

https://media.defense.gov/2019/Apr/27/2002122174/-1/-1/1/ah195606.pdf

And a smidge more info here (slide 41):

https://lynceans.org/wp-content/uploads/2018/07/Marine-Nuclear-Power-1939-2018_Part-2B_USA_surface-ships.pdf

Concept for a nuclear-powered guided missile cruiser, designed to be equally effective against sea, air, land or underwater (SALU) targets. Funding was included in the Navy’s FY 1957 new construction program. Source: 58thedition of Jane’s Fighting Ships / US Navy All Hands magazine, June 1956, p. 35.

Slides 42 and 43 also have some "interesting" drawings of Long Beach from a London newspaper, clearly drawn by someone who had only heard a vague description. Love the inclusion of a Limbo mortar for the "ASW Weapon."

 

[Tzoli]

Is that a vertical loading system for the Regulus?

 

[TomS]

Is that a vertical loading system for the Regulus?

Pay it absolutely no mind. It's a fiction drawn by someone with no knowledge of the actual ship.

 

[Tzoli]

I know but it's interesting none the less how artists tried to figure out a new type of vessel's look.
Reminds me of how the USN thought of the Nelsons were to be battleship carriers with flight deck aft XD

 

[Colonial-Marine]

Here it isView attachment 644995

Looks a lot more pretty than the way the real ship turned out.

I've read that the Long Beach was the last cruiser to use a true cruiser hull. But what differences does that mean from say the later Virginia class CGNs which were based off the preceding frigate/destroyer leaders designs but still reasonably large ships at over 10,000 tons. Did Long Beach have belt armor?

 

[Tzoli]

I do not agree on the look but that is my opinion.
Normal armour? No. Armour around the Reactor housing? Likely.
As for the hull, Long Beach has a sleek long cruiser hull where the hull starts to arch towards the nose from the middle of the hull while the Virginia and other destroyer types starts this arch much closer to the nose say from the 3/4th or 3/5th of the hull

 

[Yellow Palace]

As for the hull, Long Beach has a sleek long cruiser hull where the hull starts to arch towards the nose from the middle of the hull while the Virginia and other destroyer types starts this arch much closer to the nose say from the 3/4th or 3/5th of the hull

What makes a 'cruiser' hull rather than a 'destroyer' hull isn't the sheerline, but the structural arrangement. Cruiser hulls were much more heavily built, generally with four-shaft rather than two-shaft powerplants; a cruiser also had significantly greater self-maintenance capability, larger stores, and improved crew amenities.