Canadian 'Wolf' heavy armoured car from WWII . . .

[robunos]

I recently purchased a copy of the excellent 'The Otter Reconnaissance Car in Canadian Service' from Service Publications (www.servicepub.com), and, upon reading it, came across a reference to a 'Wolf' 8x8 heavy armoured car. This was unknown to me, so an Internet search was in order. All I could find was the attached text and images.

"The development of the Wolf arose
from an August 1940 proposal by the Dept. of
Munitions and Supply. DM&S was concerned
that Canada might lack the heavy—engineering
capacity required to produce tracked vehicles
and that rather than build tanks they should take
advantage of Canada‘ s automotive industry to
build "wheeled tanks" instead. Two designs were
commissioned From Ford, a 4x4 with two extra
floating wheels completed in late 1940 and
quickly consigned to oblivion by the Canadian
Army, which opted for the GM Fox 1. The other
was to be 8x6 (again with two extra floating
wheels - DM&S had engaged the services of an
exiled French Colonel, J. Martin-Prevel, who
claimed to have experience designing AFVs. The
Wolf grew into a 8X8 with eight-wheel steering.
As there was no firm requirement the project was
canceled in May 1942."

"Vehicle Data: Weight empty, 32,000 lbs (14,528
kgs). Length. 228 in (579l mm]. Width, unk.
Height. 96 in (24-33 rnm). Wheel base, 150 in
(3810 mm]. Drive, 8x8. Armor, .12 to 1.7 in (3
to 43.75 mm). NBC protection, individual. Ar-
mament: (1) 40mm (2-pounder). Elevation &
traverse. manual. Fire control, optical. Auxiliary
wpn, (1) .30 cal LMG. Capacity: Fuel, gasoline.
Crew. 5. Engine: (3) liquid-cooled. Mercury,
gasoline engines producing 283 hp (209 kw).
Location, rear. Transmission. Manual with 4-
forward and 1-reverse gear. Suspension .System:
Leaf spring. Wheels steerable, 8. Turning radius,
19 ft 6 in (5.9 m). No of wheels. 8. Tire size,
10.50x20. Genera! Data: lntercom, yes. Per-
formance: Speed. 45 mph (72 km/h). Range,
250 mi (402 kin). Usage: Only one Wolf was
completed. Manufacturer: Ford of Canada."

Does anyone know any more?

text from http://www.warwheels.net/images/WFVCanada2HAUGH.pdf

images from http://imgur.com/a/WySVO


cheers,
Robin.

 

[Rickshaw]

 

[Grey Havoc]

As there was no firm requirement the project was
canceled in May 1942."

Ironic in light of requirements which were soon to arise. I suspect that the cancellation was at least in part due to miscommunications & flawed assumptions regarding the then under development U.S. Army T22 (which would become the M8 Greyhound). Another bit of irony was that the T22 was a Ford Motor Company design.

 

[riggerrob]

As there was no firm requirement the project was
canceled in May 1942."

Ironic in light of requirements which were soon to arise. I suspect that the cancellation was at least in part due to miscommunications & flawed assumptions regarding the then under development U.S. Army T22 (which would become the M8 Greyhound). Another bit of irony was that the T22 was a Ford Motor Company design.

Yes, but the Canadian Army was also in the habit of sending trials vehicles to Britain - for Imperial approval - before starting production. This slow approval process stalled several promising Canadian vehicles and guns.

 

[riggerrob]

Steering all 8 wheels was overly-complex, considering how most modern 8 X 8 armoured cars only steer 4 wheels.

That sort of perfectionism almost killed the American Jeep project. Project engineers wanted all-wheel drive and all-wheel steering, but some one reminded them that universal joints were already in short supply.

 

[Grey Havoc]

Steering all 8 wheels was overly-complex, considering how most modern 8 X 8 armoured cars only steer 4 wheels.

Though that is present day corner cutting rather than a lack of need for the capability. And since Martin-Prevel and his team seem to have gotten the Wolf I's steering system working fine, it would have been very useful in a wide range of theaters and tactical environments.

 

[JohnR]

Could the turret take a larger gun - 6 pounder of 75mm US or UK?

 

[Grey Havoc]

Could the turret take a larger gun - 6 pounder of 75mm US or UK?

I wouldn't be surprised if being able to upgun to a 6 pounder had been designed in from the start.

 

[robunos]

Don't see why not, as it's a Ram turret, swap the Ram I for a 6 pdr armed Ram II turret, however I'm not sure if a Ram II could be upgunned to a 75mm . . .

cheers,
Robin.

 

[Yellow Palace]

Don't see why not, as it's a Ram turret, swap the Ram I for a 6 pdr armed Ram II turret, however I'm not sure if a Ram II could be upgunned to a 75mm . . .

The OQF 75mm was essentially a 6pdr bored out to take US 75mm ammunition and needed no modification to the vehicle apart from ammunition storage. Looking at the cartridges, I suspect this would be fairly straighforward, though that's a phrase that has often led engineers into trouble....

 

[robunos]

Don't see why not, as it's a Ram turret, swap the Ram I for a 6 pdr armed Ram II turret, however I'm not sure if a Ram II could be upgunned to a 75mm . . .

The OQF 75mm was essentially a 6pdr bored out to take US 75mm ammunition and needed no modification to the vehicle apart from ammunition storage. Looking at the cartridges, I suspect this would be fairly straighforward, though that's a phrase that has often led engineers into trouble....

I was aware of the relationship between the 6 pdr and 75mm, but was unsure if there was increased recoil force with the latter, that would need dealing with.

chers,
Robin.

 

[riggerrob]

Don't see why not, as it's a Ram turret, swap the Ram I for a 6 pdr armed Ram II turret, however I'm not sure if a Ram II could be upgunned to a 75mm . . .

The OQF 75mm was essentially a 6pdr bored out to take US 75mm ammunition and needed no modification to the vehicle apart from ammunition storage. Looking at the cartridges, I suspect this would be fairly straighforward, though that's a phrase that has often led engineers into trouble....

I was aware of the relationship between the 6 pdr and 75mm, but was unsure if there was increased recoil force with the latter, that would need dealing with.

chers,
Robin.

Post WW2 the Dutch Army installed 75 mm QF guns in Rams left behind by the Canadian Army. The Canadian Army never used Rams as gun-tanks in battle, but many served as Forward Artillery Spotters or Kangaroo APCs or “W” ammo carriers.