British Post WWII AFV series 400: Centurion MBT and family

[JFC Fuller]

An interesting issue, to me at least, the 183mm gun mounted on the FV4005 used some sort of autoloader, such a feature does not seem to appear on the FV215...

 

[Abraham Gubler]

While technically not a FV 201 family vehicle the FV 3805 was developed to fill the gap of one of the universal tanks: the medium gun self propelled version. It was a Centurion tank with a casemate replacing the turret, reversed transmission and what looks like a short barrel version of the BL 5.5" Mk 3 medium gun firing over the engine deck. The Israelis also developed a SP gun Centurion called the M-72 that mounted a M-71 155mm ordnance in a new turret on a new upper hull. It had a hatch in the front glacis beside the driver's position.

 

[JFC Fuller]

There was also a 25 pounder version that looked virtually identical, at one point there was a desire to have the same configuration on the FV201 chassis.

 

[Abraham Gubler]

Centurion artillery variants proposed for the British Army included:

FV3801 Gun Tractor
FV3802 SP QF 25 Pounder (88mm)
FV3803 Command Post
FV3804 Gun Limber (Ammunition)
FV3805 SP BL 5.5” (140mm)
FV3806 SP BL 7.2” (183mm)
FV3807 SP 120mm anti tank
FV3808 SP “Medium”
FV3809 SP 155mm anti tank

Only the FV3802 and FV3805 were prototyped. The FV3805 was built in 1957 and apart from the configuration detailed above featured hydraulic brakes and steering. The driver was positioned above the level of the engine bay roof to the left of the ordnance and the vehicle's forward direction was to the rear of a Centurion tank. The barrel was much shorter than the BL 5.5” Mk 3 medium gun and was considered a ‘howitzer’. Crew was only four with driver, commander, gunner and a hard worked loader/operator.

The similar looking FV3802 was in fact quite different. It retained the original Centurion tank's driver position and transmission arrangement and had the QF 25 Pounder gun-howitzer point to the rear like in the Archer self propelled anti tank gun. The hull was cut in length and only two full twin wheel boogies per side with an additional single wheel arrangement. These guns were discontinued with NATO standardization on 105mm and 155mm calibers and the development of the Abbott gun. The FV3809 SP 155mm anti tank would have been a sight to behold…

 

[Nik]

Is that 'wheelbarrow' arrangement the limber ??

 

[Abraham Gubler]

Is that 'wheelbarrow' arrangement the limber ??

Its not a wheelbarrow its a trailer the vehicle travels with the gun pointing towards the rear. This trailer was the highly unpopular 'monowheel' fuel trailer issued to early mark Centurion tanks to make up for their short range.

 

[Grey Havoc]

Its not a wheelbarrow its a trailer the vehicle travels with the gun pointing towards the rear. This trailer was the highly unpopular 'monowheel' fuel trailer issued to early mark Centurion tanks to make up for their short range.

Didn't some flamethrower conversions also use that arrangement, or am I wrong?

 

[Thorvic]

Nope the Centurion Crocodile would have had the same trailer as used by the Churchills. The monotrailer was just a fuel tank to extend range, they eventually added the extra fuel tank onto the rear of the tank before later marks had the rear end redesigned to incorporate the fuel tank within the rear of the hull.

 

[CJGibson]

from a file I found in Kew a while back,

Centurion Crocodile was Blue Mercury.
Flamethrowing kit was Blue Perseus
Trailer for Blue Mercury (and other vehicles) was Red Hermes
Fuel for all this was called Red Vulcan and the mobile mixing plant for that was Red Bacchus, to be mounted on CT.25 or other vehicles.

Red Achilles was a flame-throwing kit for the CT.25 carrier

and finally...

Red Cyclops was the flamethrowing kit for FV.201.

Chris

 

[Old_ROF]

This has already been started.

Two places are here:- http://www.skomer.u-net.com/projects/colour.htm

and from wiki: http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_Rainbow_Codes

But I'm sure that there must be other codes that can be added, especially for land systems as the above seem to be mainly related to the Air side.

 

[CJGibson]

Please be advised that the Wiki page is basically a rip-off of the Skomer website and it has not been updated since 2003. Therefore it contains a number of items that are, shall we say, not based on the latest information.

The most up-to-date information on such codes are published in Air Britain's "Aeromilitaria". If you're not a member of Air Britain, you won't have seen these and if you're interested in "rainbow" codes and not a member of Air Britain, well, you should be.

Chris

 

[Tzoli]

Regarding the Centurion Tank: Does anybody know if there are any pictures or drawings about the Close Support version, I assume Centurion Mark IV was it's designation.

 

[Tzoli]

Nobody?

 

[ekrano]

are there any photos or drawings of the Centurion Crocodile ? Presume it was just the Churchill equipment fitted into a Cent turret (spigot instead of the Polsten) as it had no hull MG gunner ?

Doubt it was even tried but apparently there were plans to make a Centurion DD (Duplex-Drive) like the Sherman amphibian.

 

[Stranger_NN]

Centurion Crocodile

 

[Rickshaw]

Centurion Crocodile

Where was the flame gun on this vehicle? Was it mounted on the roof of the drivers compartment or did it replace the co-ax MG?

This webpage has pictures of the preserved prototype but it's not obvious where the flame gun was: http://preservedtanks.com/Types.aspx?TypeCategoryId=3450

 

[CostasTT]

Centurion Crocodile

Where was the flame gun on this vehicle? Was it mounted on the roof of the drivers compartment or did it replace the co-ax MG?

This webpage has pictures of the preserved prototype but it's not obvious where the flame gun was: http://preservedtanks.com/Types.aspx?TypeCategoryId=3450

It was on the glacis plate (upper front hull slope).

 

[Rickshaw]

Centurion Crocodile

Where was the flame gun on this vehicle? Was it mounted on the roof of the drivers compartment or did it replace the co-ax MG?

This webpage has pictures of the preserved prototype but it's not obvious where the flame gun was: http://preservedtanks.com/Types.aspx?TypeCategoryId=3450

It was on the glacis plate (upper front hull slope).

Any pictures/drawings?

 

[CostasTT]

Unfortunately, other than the ones in Stranger_NN's linked blog post, I wasn't able to find any in my references.

 

[moin1900]

Hi
CENTURION drawings 1955
http://www.network54.com/Forum/110741/thread/1381323170/last-1381708913/View+Thread
Heavy APC
Howitzers
Guided Missile Carrier with DART missile ?
Counter Mortar Radar Carrier