US Navy 6th Gen Fighter - F/A-XX

The Stingray does nothing but pass gas right now.

It's not a part of the strike package like CCAs are.

Again, who cares?

This is the Navy’s actual plan. They have been very clear about it. They have never operated large unmanned aircraft from a carrier before. They are about to learn how with the MQ-25.

Disagree with it or criticize it all you want, it’s still the plan. It is what they intend to do.
 
I think the USN is refocusing on sea control and would leave attacks against land targets largely to the USAF. The primary threat against its ships may be land based missiles, but there’s little chance of the air wing being able to reach the necessary ranges to engage that threat. Offensive anti surface operations are probably a better use of resources.
Important target sets
PRC's A2/AD network
Mobile/Stationary Anti Ship Missiles
PRC ISR Capability
Ports, especially PLAN and those embarking on Amphibs
PLAN SAGs and at some point CSGs

I think you are right. Peel away at the A2/AD bubble that the PLAN SAG's will establish east of Taiwan. The main long range strike asset that the USN will be able to employ will be long range cruise missiles which can contribute to strikes on the mainland. Use the CSG to establish our own A2/AD bubble to get assets and resupply to the PI, the Ryukyus and Japan.

At some point in the campaign the F/A-XX and F-35Cs will be able to participate in OCA mission but the Navy first has to establish the control of the sea lanes. I view the AIM-174B and LRASM as interim weapons. From a cost perspective it doesn't make sense to design F/A-XX to carry LRASM internally when smaller and lower cost weapons are on the horizon which will fill the niche between JDAM/SDB and JASSM/LRASM. Maybe a combat radius of 800 nm, with MQ-25 support, is enough for F/A-X to take on the SAGs? But that might not be the case in 10 or 15 years.
 
Again, who cares?

This is the Navy’s actual plan. They have been very clear about it. They have never operated large unmanned aircraft from a carrier before. They are about to learn how with the MQ-25.

Disagree with it or criticize it all you want, it’s still the plan. It is what they intend to do.
They're being VERY SLOW about adopting another unmanned aircraft into the fleet.

No RFPs out there right now. Nothing for "A flying spear carrier" like the USAF wants/has RIGHT NOW. Nothing for an ISR node to play TACIT BLUE and BACN, though the Stingray might be able to pick that job up via pods. Nothing for an EW platform (assuming one is still needed with an all-stealth Air Wing). Nothing for a striker to supplement the F-35C in the "hauling bombs" mission.

Assuming a decade from CCA RFP to IOC, there should probably be some RFIs floating around by now.
 
Important target sets
PRC's A2/AD network
Mobile/Stationary Anti Ship Missiles
PRC ISR Capability
Ports, especially PLAN and those embarking on Amphibs
PLAN SAGs and at some point CSGs

I think you are right. Peel away at the A2/AD bubble that the PLAN SAG's will establish east of Taiwan. The main long range strike asset that the USN will be able to employ will be long range cruise missiles which can contribute to strikes on the mainland. Use the CSG to establish our own A2/AD bubble to get assets and resupply to the PI, the Ryukyus and Japan.

At some point in the campaign the F/A-XX and F-35Cs will be able to participate in OCA mission but the Navy first has to establish the control of the sea lanes. I view the AIM-174B and LRASM as interim weapons. From a cost perspective it doesn't make sense to design F/A-XX to carry LRASM internally when smaller and lower cost weapons are on the horizon which will fill the niche between JDAM/SDB and JASSM/LRASM. Maybe a combat radius of 800 nm, with MQ-25 support, is enough for F/A-X to take on the SAGs? But that might not be the case in 10 or 15 years.

Yes, in most any imaginable sino-American conflict, there would be a vast number of surface targets within much easier reach than the mainland. Blockade units, landing units, AW screens, militia boats, coast guard, etc. it’s a target set where even individual hits can mission kill major vessels, where as an airbase or ballistic missile brigade not only needs a deep penetration of defended airspace but likely also a huge volley to be effective. It likely is not a realistic goal.

I agree the LRASM and SM-6 are likely quick fixes and FA-XX will not be built around them, but I could see the USN going for a 15’ bay as a means of accommodating any future weapon that can fit on a weapon elevator and I also could see them leaving enough depth for a pair of HALOs, assuming they are relatively compact. It was suggested that there might ultimately be sub launched HALO, which might mean something of roughly torpedo tube diameter. That would still be smaller than AGM-158.
 
They're being VERY SLOW about adopting another unmanned aircraft into the fleet.

No RFPs out there right now. Nothing for "A flying spear carrier" like the USAF wants/has RIGHT NOW. Nothing for an ISR node to play TACIT BLUE and BACN, though the Stingray might be able to pick that job up via pods. Nothing for an EW platform (assuming one is still needed with an all-stealth Air Wing).

Again, that is their plan. To transition to the "Air Wing of the Future" that is FA-XX and unmanned aircraft.

Again:

They have never operated a large unmanned aircraft from a carrier and are not going to start issuing contracts for more unmanned carrier aircraft until they have actual experience with MQ-25.

Nothing for a striker to supplement the F-35C in the "hauling bombs" mission.

WTF?
That is... literally....the mission of the FA-XX.

Assuming a decade from CCA RFP to IOC, there should probably be some RFIs floating around by now.

No, there should not be. The Navy is participating in the Air Force CCA program and is learning how to operate unmanned aircraft from a carrier with MQ-25. The Navy has been very, very clear about all of this. If you do not like their plan or their pace, write your congressman.
 
Again, that is their plan. To transition to the "Air Wing of the Future" that is FA-XX and unmanned aircraft.

Again:

They have never operated a large unmanned aircraft from a carrier and are not going to start issuing contracts for more unmanned carrier aircraft until they have actual experience with MQ-25.
Yes, and at the rate they're going it'll be 2060 before they have the CCAs.



WTF?

That is... literally....the mission of the FA-XX.
I was talking about CCAs in that entire paragraph.




If you do not like their plan or their pace, write your congressman.
I may have to.
 
Yes, and at the rate they're going it'll be 2060 before they have the CCAs.

Let's look at some facts from the Navy's own statements:

Navy Aviation Vision 2030-2035

The CVW of the 2030s achieves a complementary mix of F-35C Lightning II, F/A-18E/F Block III Super Hornet, and next generation strike fighter (F/A-XX), with the F/A-18E/F Block III providing the backbone of the CVW through 2035. F/A-18E/F Block III with reduced signature, Infrared Search and Track (IRST) Block II, and increased computing, working in tandem with the capabilities provided by the F-35C and E-2D, will make the entire CSG more lethal and survivable.

The F-35C of 2030 and beyond will serve as an invaluable force multiplier for the CSG. The F-35C’s stealth and passive detection capabilities will allow the platform to gain critical intelligence and share throughout the CSG, significantly aiding the kill chain. Additionally, in the maritime domain, the Block IV F-35C will be the Navy’s strike platform of choice with Joint Standoff Weapon (JSOW) C1, Advanced Anti-Radiation Guided Missile Extended Range (AARGM ER) and Small Diameter Bomb (SDB) II incorporated. During Fighter Integration (FI) events with the F/A-18E/F Block III the F-35C will allow the F/A-18E/F Block III to be a more survivable and lethal platform leveraging the F-35C’s stealth and passive detection abilities to shape the overall air picture.

The F/A-XX is the strike fighter component within the Next Generation Air Dominance (NGAD) Family of Systems (FoS). It is planned to replace the F/A-18E/F Super Hornet in the 2030s. Its specific capabilities and technologies are under development, however analysis shows it must have longer range and greater speed, incorporate passive and active sensor technology, and possess the capability to employ the longer-range weapons programmed for the future. As the Super Hornets are retired from service, a combination of F-35C and F/A-XX will provide Navy tactical fighter aircraft capability and capacity within the CVW. The advanced carrier- based power projection capabilities resident in F/A- XX will maintain CVN relevance in advanced threat environments.


Along with organic tanking, the MQ-25 will pave the way for unmanned air vehicles on the carrier and manned and unmanned teaming (MUM-T) to extend strike range and enhance maneuverability. As unmanned tanking capacity delivers, the manned tanker requirement decreases, making additional service life and capacity available for strike fighter missions. Continued development of MUM-T will enable information sharing across a distributed force, increasing survivability, reducing risk to manned aircraft, and ensuring weapons capacity. Future unmanned air vehicles with survivable planforms, sensors, and robust autonomy will find, fix, identify, track, engage, and assess land, sea, and air targets. The NGAD FoS will include unmanned platforms with F/A-XX as the quarterback. These manned and unmanned aircraft plus attritable assets will be employed across domains to enable integrated kinetic and non-kinetic fires at tactically relevant ranges. As autonomy and ML efforts mature, the appropriate mix of F/A-XX, manned and unmanned platforms will be evaluated to ensure the most lethal and affordable CVW possible.


STATEMENT OF NICKOLAS H. GUERTIN ASSISTANT SECRETARY OF THE NAVY (RESEARCH, DEVELOPMENT AND ACQUISITION) AND LIEUTENANT GENERAL BRADFORD GERING DEPUTY COMMANDANT FOR AVIATION AND REAR ADMIRAL MICHAEL DONNELLY DIRECTOR AIR WARFARE BEFORE THE TACTICAL AIR AND LAND FORCES SUBCOMMITTEE OF THE HOUSE ARMED SERVICES COMMITTEE ON DEPARTMENT OF THE NAVY FISCAL YEAR 2025 BUDGET REQUEST FOR TACTICAL AVIATION APRIL 16, 2024

Next Generation Air Dominance (NGAD)
The NGAD FoS is comprised of crewed and uncrewed tactical platforms, advanced weapons, sensors and networks to attain and maintain air superiority. F/A-XX is the strike fighter component of the NGAD FoS and is the designated replacement for the F/A-18E/F. Design maturation efforts remain on track and the program is now considered to be in a source selection environment. The Navy released a request for proposal (RFP) for a follow-on development contract in December 2023 to Boeing, Northrop Grumman, and Lockheed Martin. F/A-XX is designed from the outset to incorporate crewed and uncrewed teaming. Included in the uncrewed tactical platforms for the NGAD FoS are the family of CCA’s. Navy and Marine CCA’s will augment current and next generation crewed platforms with multiple lower cost, complementary capabilities to increase combat effectiveness in highly contested environments.

Collaborative Combat Aircraft (CCA)
The Marine Corps is a signatory to the Tri-Service CCA Vision Alignment memo and continues to coordinate with the USN to develop its MAGTF UAS Expeditionary (MUX) Family of Systems. These efforts include accelerating prototyping and experimentation of uncrewed logistics and tactical aircraft, and a system control architecture for these platforms that is Joint, common, and interoperable. To date, the Marine Corps has completed two successful XQ-58 flights, which are informing the service requirements for an eventual MUX TACAIR CCA program of record. These efforts and additional operational analysis complement the work done to date supported by both prioritized Marine Corps funding and Rapid Development Experimentation and Research resources.

INTREPID TIGER II
The Marine Corps, through the INTREPID TIGER II program, is bringing advanced Electronic Warfare (EW) to all its aviation platforms, and is focused on crewed-uncrewed teaming to answer the MAGTF’s requirements for AEA. The Marine Corps has worked in conjunction with OSD to purchase the first two XQ-58 Valkyrie CCA platforms to test EW effects in partnership with F-35 and our Assault Support platforms.

DAF/USN Report To Congressional Committees, 2023, Title Withheld.

Approximately 60% of the AWOTF will be comprised of Autonomous and Remotely Crewed Systems (ARCS), to include CCA, employing AI as a force multiplier. Coupled with Manned/Unmanned-Teaming (MUM-T) to multiply the “team’s” combat capabilities, the CVW’s ability to project high-end combat power will increase exponentially. Synergistic effects of NGAD FoS and autonomous technologies will further enhance the relevancy of the CVW for decades to come.

....etc

Oh yeah, the FA-XX is not a strike fighter. And the Navy is not doing anything with CCAs. And it's going to take too long, etc. Oh and by the way the F/A-XX is a stealth F-111 pregnant with a weapons bay that can hold 2 of every weapon in the inventory.

Frankly, I am tired of posting facts that obviously contribute nothing to the conversation because they are ignored in favor of people attempting to dictate what they think the Navy should do, rather than discuss what the Navy is doing with this and related programs. There is no point in posting facts if they are going to be ignored.

If people want to see things like the Air Force and Navy CCA plans for manned-unmanned teaming that lay out both their plans, the Navy and Air Force analysis of alternatives for NGAD, or want to see photos and details of the AAI X-planes.....

Find them yourselves.
 
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The more I think about it, it probably does not make a lot of sense to size the bomb bay for long or wide weapons even as an attempt at future proofing. There are just too many compromises for an embarked aircraft. If possible it wove be nice if there was a single bay that could manage four AARGM-ERs in width and four mk84/BLU-137 in depth. If you could do that, then alternative payloads that are smaller in dimension include four mk83s with wing kits, four JSOW, 16 SDB-1/2, or four of whatever cheap cruise missile the USN ends up buying. That gives you a lot of options and potentially a lot of small glide bombs without a huge fuck all IWB, and the airframe can have four removable (or ideally jetisonable) external hard points for oversized stores or more BRUs for tandem or quad stores.
 
From the FY 25 USMC Aviation Plan:
140 F-35C in 6 active F-35C squadrons and 2 reserve F-35C squadrons.
280 F-35B in 12 active squadrons.
12 aircraft per squadron both variants.

The USN plans 273 F-35Cs as of December 2024.

Odd, because the wiki reference has that the other way around. The reference is https://media.defense.gov/2025/Feb/03/2003636520/-1/-1/0/2025_MARINECORPSAVIATIONPLAN.PDF
1. Your link comes up 404 for me.

2. It WAS the 2025 Marine Corps Aviation Plan I was quoting for the USMC numbers.

3. The USMC has two F-35B training squadrons and no F-35C training squadrons - there IS a planned 10-aircraft USMC detachment of F-35Cs to work with the USN's F-35C training squadrons.

Here - note the numbers (both aircraft and squadrons) in the yellow box and highlighted at the bottom right.
Also see note 2 at the bottom of the chart - there will be aircraft that are not in squadron inventories:

2025 USMC aviation plan.jpg
 
The more I think about it, it probably does not make a lot of sense to size the bomb bay for long or wide weapons even as an attempt at future proofing. There are just too many compromises for an embarked aircraft. If possible it wove be nice if there was a single bay that could manage four AARGM-ERs in width and four mk84/BLU-137 in depth. If you could do that, then alternative payloads that are smaller in dimension include four mk83s with wing kits, four JSOW, 16 SDB-1/2, or four of whatever cheap cruise missile the USN ends up buying. That gives you a lot of options and potentially a lot of small glide bombs without a huge fuck all IWB, and the airframe can have four removable (or ideally jetisonable) external hard points for oversized stores or more BRUs for tandem or quad stores.

I don't agree with this, but I'll concede that I am likely missing necessary context or making at least a few incorrect assumptions. Please correct me if so--I am more than happy to revise my opinions.

As it stands, I don't see the value added in developing an entirely new aircraft if it holds like 20 - 30% more small to medium munitions internally than the F-35C and has 25% further range than the Super Hornet. If you take the 25% increase in range claim at face value and assume combat radius scales similarly, you end up with a plane that has a range of at worst ~550 nmi (using Super Hornet scaling) or at best ~838 nmi (using F-35C scaling). Notably, the worst case range isn't even as high as the F-35C's publicly stated 670nmi. Furthermore, if F/A-XX can't hold standoff weapons like JASSM-ER or LRASM internally, then why not just use F-35C in beast mode? Given that the range targets have already been disclosed, the only way I see F/A-XX being worth the R&D is if the IWB(s) are enlarged for internal carriage of larger munitions that cannot fit in the F-35, and if the sensors / radars are significantly more powerful than the F-35's. I suspect the latter is possible, but the general feeling I've gotten with regards to F/A-XX is risk-aversion. This is reasonable given the JSF program's delays, but pursuing a less aggressive capability could leave the USN ill-equipped to fight a peer conflict.

For comparison, the PLAAF's overall strategy with regards to A2/AD and denying the US air superiority makes more sense to me. They've identified that USAF and USN CVW aircraft are generally dependent upon support assets like AEW and tankers, so they've developed a plethora of their own support assets like the KJ-600 and KJ-3000 to detect said aircraft from increasing distances, along with very-long-range AAMs like the PL-17 to engage from further away. Their recently unveiled J-36 and J-50 / J-XDS likely will be significantly stealthier than the J-20 and J-35 once they reach serial production, and both aircraft notably have large IWBs to allow for internal carriage of said AAMs and anti-ship missiles. Both will likely have significantly better electrical power generation than the J-20 and J-35, allowing them to divert more power to their radars or other sensors and thus increasing the probability that they can achieve first-look first-shot on US aircraft. Both will also likely have significantly larger combat radii than the J-20 (which already outranges US aircraft at ~1100 nmi), allowing them to fly further out, loiter longer, or stay closer to IADS and engage US aircraft from within the A2/AD bubble.

I am not trying to shill the PLAAF, but it should be clear how these combination of assets offer it a massive increase in capability from even 2 years ago. From what has been publicly revealed about F/A-XX, I cannot conclude the same with regards to the US Navy.
 
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I am not trying to shill the PLAAF, but it should be clear how these combination of assets offer it a massive increase in capability from even 2 years ago. From what has been publicly revealed about F/A-XX, I cannot conclude the same with regards to the US Navy.
Current US Carrier air wing(ideal):

F/a-18E/F - supposed to be all trick pony, but even as such is essentially inferior to F-35C in everything other than weapon integration speed. As a bug development/overgrowth, particularly struggles in range/payload metrics, always requiring lots of drop tanks to get...not even that far. So, for anything beyond horizon we usually need 3 drop tanks (and no IRST without central tank!), and just notionally qualify as supersonic aircraft.
It also works as a tanker aircraft - very, very thirsty one, rapidly burning through its own fuel. It's OK for refuelling something right after take off, but anything above it is meh.

Same problems are applicable to Growler - lots of pods, lots of drag, not that much time in the air.

F-35C(for now rather few) - great strike and OK fighter aircraft, limited by stealth/paylod contradictions. All big item stand off munitions other than AARGM currently don't fit in, and there is a reason they don't(bay built for chunky 2000 lbs - shorter than ideal for stand off PGMs).
They can fit outside, yes, but it'll kill stealth and, again, add lots of drag.

Overall, this airwing:
Struggles to reach safer stand off for carrier safety, even with available stand off PGMs;
Has good medium range bombing/1st day capability through F-35s, but against China this is flatly insufficient/dangerous.
Absolutely struggles with long range intercept(i.e. self defense); AIM-174 can do much, but ultimately F-18 is not a qualified missileer.

In effect, for all its relative modernity (much better than USAF), it's overall just weaker in capability checkist than US airwing from 1991.

Now, future:

1. MQ-25 massively improves refuelling, and, potentially, battlespace control. It is sometimes underappreciated, how much MQ-25 is better than Shornet at giving fuel at range; benefit is just very big.

2. F/A-XX gets 25% over that S.Hornet delivery capabilities. Doesn't sound massive?
For example, for hornet we're talking 3 fuel tanks and 2 2000lb class munitions.
For F/A-XX, we're likely talking full IWBs(4 units?), no drop tanks. And still 25% on top.

That's a lot, for practical purposes. Add on, say, JASSM-XR, and threat zone from which Carrier can strike is getting huge. It's much harder to find CSG in time(lets assume something can be done about persistent space). It's, again, everything inside - i.e. J-36ying strike packages in transit (and then shadowing them back to their source) is now at least not taking candy from a hornet; getting CSG found with other local ISR assets is getting much more complicated.
That's not to say it can't bomb - it can, with, say, 4 large weapon units compared to 2 in F-35c(internally), to the somewhat bigger combat radius. Not as good as subsonic A-6F, sure, but very close - yet supersonic and stealthy.
It's now much higher and longer flight paths for everything - for instance, AsBMs (for which every additional minute in flight is not just exposure to detection, but chance to simply miss! their threat footprint against jamming isn't magical, just by physical limitations on seeker working conditions).

3. While it isn't a plane designed around air superiority as its main function, it's a plane that carries same 4 big munitions inside, clean.
We also know that one of the reasons LM was taken out of competition was their unwilingness to add more powerful radar - so we can expect a powerful suit.
If AIM-174 fits inside(or USN develops a proper bay VLRAAM for NIFC-CA), it's an incredible boost to carrier wing. Then we add (2) - i.e. significant increase in range, at which carrier is effective, - conditions for CAP work improve massively. Then we add 1 - i.e. massive improvement in refuelling, for clean planes(i.e. they don't waste that they get). And those planes can intercept a lot - they can intercept ISR assets, even potentially hypersonics on their flight path.

Bigger plane with lots of fuel and big IWBs is a huge asset. Even before, when it was assumed (from navy quotes) that stealth levels will be moderate. After knowing that USAF F-47 comes from F/A-XX proposal - that in fact may not be the case (or moderate requirement doesn't mean it wasn't exeeded significantly by winning proposal).
 
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From what has been publicly revealed about F/A-XX, I cannot conclude the same with regards to the US Navy.
Very little has been 'publicly' released in terms of performance attributes / specifications about the F/A-XX other than some general statements of intent and what potential priorities the Navy may be pursuing..They said it will have 25% more range during a press exchange. Some simply assumed it will be over a F/A-18 with internal fuel only. That's on them and their assumption and may have absolutely nothing to do with reality.

The Navy's objective range requirement for F-35C was 730 nmi (incidentally about 25% more than a Rhino with CL tank for some of the strike missions). Pretty safe to assume that F/A-XX will be required to achieve at least that and possibly more than that. The standard F/A-18 E/F configuration for the Navy includes a CL fuel tank..(so much so that they built an IRST into it).

F/A-XX was never going to be a 1,200 - 1,500 nmi strike fighter capable of carrying AIM-174 sized weapons internally. That would have been massive, expensive and complicated for a whole host of reasons to include the need to fly supersonic to support the entire F/A-18E/F mission set replacement. As others here have posted, once the Navy learns and integrates unmanned aircraft in the air wing something with that sort of performance can probably be developed (something like the X-47B ++) which is a far better capability than trying to pursue a 1,000 nmi + supersonic strike fighter and going bust because it ends up costing 3-4 times the F-35C or F/A-18 E/F. You seem to have a vision for FA-XX (like fitting AIM-174's internally being an important requirement) and when you can't seem to find validation of that you seem to think the Navy is off track..which might not be the case. When we learn more about F/A-XX, I'm sure we can more objectively evaluate how it enhances the carrier air wing in the Pacific. That when combined with other capabilities being brought forward for the 2030+ carrier air wing will help us understand what role the Navy intends the CVN's to play in that region (that may or may not gel with what we think the Navy ought to be doing with its carriers in the Pacific).

Both will also likely have significantly larger combat radii than the J-20 (which already outranges US aircraft at ~1100 nmi), allowing them to fly further out, loiter longer, or stay closer to IADS and engage US aircraft from within the A2/AD bubble.

I am not trying to shill the PLAAF,

I would love to do a deep dive on some of the specs and performance attributes. Where can I find something equivalent to the F-35 Selected Acq report for the J-20?
 
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I thought that the F-35 was marketed as the last manned fighter? Or am I missing something here dark sidius? It is really strange that they are now marketing the F/A-XX as the last manned naval fighter. :confused:
 
Frankly, I am tired of posting facts that obviously contribute nothing to the conversation because they are ignored in favor of people attempting to dictate what they think the Navy should do, rather than discuss what the Navy is doing with this and related programs. There is no point in posting facts if they are going to be ignored.

If people want to see things like the Air Force and Navy CCA plans for manned-unmanned teaming that lay out both their plans, the Navy and Air Force analysis of alternatives for NGAD, or want to see photos and details of the AAI X-planes.....

Find them yourselves.

Concerning the part I´ve put in bold, I´ve tried but without result and so I´m 'desperately' in need of some help.... ;)
Unless I did see them (e.g. on this forum and/or on a few corporate aerospace websites) and it are not 'photos' but rather 'images' ??
 
I thought that the F-35 was marketed as the last manned fighter? Or am I missing something here dark sidius? It is really strange that they are now marketing the F/A-XX as the last manned naval fighter. :confused:
Don't worry the life time of FA/XX will surely be like F-18 , 3 decades in this futur we will don't know what will replave the FA/XX
 
Concerning the part I´ve put in bold, I´ve tried but without result and so I´m 'desperately' in need of some help.... ;)
Unless I did see them (e.g. on this forum and/or on a few corporate aerospace websites) and it are not 'photos' but rather 'images' ??

Look harder.
 
Very little has been 'publicly' released in terms of performance attributes / specifications about the F/A-XX other than some general statements of intent and what potential priorities the Navy may be pursuing..They said it will have 25% more range during a press exchange. Some simply assumed it will be over a F/A-18 with internal fuel only. That's on them and their assumption and may have absolutely nothing to do with reality.

The Navy's objective range requirement for F-35C was 730 nmi (incidentally about 25% more than a Rhino with CL tank for some of the strike missions). Pretty safe to assume that F/A-XX will be required to achieve at least that and possibly more than that. The standard F/A-18 E/F configuration for the Navy includes a CL fuel tank..(so much so that they built an IRST into it).

F/A-XX was never going to be a 1,200 - 1,500 nmi strike fighter capable of carrying AIM-174 sized weapons internally. That would have been massive, expensive and complicated for a whole host of reasons to include the need to fly supersonic to support the entire F/A-18E/F mission set replacement. As others here have posted, once the Navy learns and integrates unmanned aircraft in the air wing something with that sort of performance can probably be developed (something like the X-47B ++) which is a far better capability than trying to pursue a 1,000 nmi + supersonic strike fighter and going bust because it ends up costing 3-4 times the F-35C or F/A-18 E/F. You seem to have a vision for FA-XX (like fitting AIM-174's internally being an important requirement) and when you can't seem to find validation of that you seem to think the Navy is off track..which might not be the case. When we learn more about F/A-XX, I'm sure we can more objectively evaluate how it enhances the carrier air wing in the Pacific. That when combined with other capabilities being brought forward for the 2030+ carrier air wing will help us understand what role the Navy intends the CVN's to play in that region (that may or may not gel with what we think the Navy ought to be doing with its carriers in the Pacific).



I would love to do a deep dive on some of the specs and performance attributes. Where can I find something equivalent to the F-35 Selected Acq report for the J-20?
Yeah, fair point. Most of my analysis is speculatory, and it's also possible that there's a fair amount of potential misdirection stemming from press releases intentionally omitting important context. It's also very likely that the US military and PLA have different criteria for "6th gen", so both sides will produce very different airframes suited to their mission requirements.

I don't think there is a direct equivalent to the F-35 Selected Acquisition Report for the J-20, but there is an old-ish document out there that describes Chinese 5th-gen fighter requirements: https://thediplomat.com/wp-content/uploads/2022/02/thediplomat_2022-02-14-191931.pdf

More recently, a few documents regarding PLA 6th gen requirements have surfaced. I've attached an English-language translation as well as the original in case the formatting gets messed up.
 

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This is a paper, not a report laying out program performance, cost or demonstrated performance against KPI's across some areas. Anyhow, i assume there isn't anything like that.
Yeah, we have pretty much no hard data on said aircraft since the PLA is almost totally opaque with regards to actual performance.

Anyways, as to avoid derailing this thread further, I think it's best to wait until more news is released about F/A-XX before drawing more conclusions.
 
Picture the MDD/Northrop NATF-23 with no vertical tails and the canards angled slightly down and moved aft, kind of interesting???
 
Very helpful, thanks.
I´ll do an extra effort and will go outside to have a personal look at Kendall´s Aerospace Innovation Initiative X-planes, they´re probably parked here just around the corner at Brussels Airport.

I wish you the best of luck in your search.
 
Maybe the USN choice will be boring because they can't afford anything exotic, just a thought.

*Looks at the F-35C, Ford Carrier, Columbia, SSNX(;))*
 

Aviation Week claimed that it is the F/A-18 that the increase in range is 25% relative to.

"The Navy’s F/A-18 Super Hornet has a combat range of 1,275 nm when carrying two AIM-9s, which would place the F/A-XX’s comparative range at 1,594 nm."
 

That increased range is an essential attribute that we’re looking to field. So probably over 125 percent of the range that we’re seeing today to give us better flexibility, operational reach. It will, of course, have refuel ability. And all of our air wings, our tactics and what we are designing in the future considers organic refueling capability. So the F/A-XX will be able to leverage that,” he said.

For context, the Super Hornet has a combat range of 1,275 nautical miles “clean” while carrying two AIM-9 missiles, according to a fact sheet from Naval Air Systems Command.

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"The Navy’s F/A-18 Super Hornet has a combat range of 1,275 nm when carrying two AIM-9s, which would place the F/A-XX’s comparative range at 1,594 nm."
That's the news source making an assumption based off a stat sheet. The source didn't state what the "125%" was being compared to or what conditions. The rest of it is generic boilerplate.
 
The seventh generation fighters would be the first truly unmanned fighter generation for the USAF after the F-47 and F/A-XX.
 
The seventh generation fighters would be the first truly unmanned fighter generation for the USAF after the F-47 and F/A-XX.
Not to detract from the original content of this post, but will our traditional understanding of aircraft roles still exist at that time? I agree the next iteration will be unmanned but I wouldn't be so sure to call it a fighter at that point.
 

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