André Starck Aircraft And Projects

Stargazer

Stargazer

ACCESS: USAP
Top Contributor
Joined
25 June 2009
Messages
14,266
Reaction score
4,644
One French aircraft I don't seem to find much about is the Starck AS35A, a very odd-looking twin-pusher with had its ailerons on the surfaces boxing in the wingtips.

Does anyone have any info on this most peculiar bird?
 

Attachments

  • AS35A.jpg
    AS35A.jpg
    275.7 KB · Views: 963
Are you sure, that it's the A.35 ? I would think, it's the A.37A, which was built in
several versions, at first with pusher props, as shown here, but modified, too, to
pulling props. Some photos and short descriptions can be found in Gaillards "Les
Avions Francais"
 

Attachments

  • AS-37.GIF
    AS-37.GIF
    70.4 KB · Views: 800
  • AS-37_pusher.GIF
    AS-37_pusher.GIF
    74 KB · Views: 725
Well the book I found it in refered to it as AS35A, but from the plans you've posted, it could very well be one and the same aircraft. I'm not quite sure about the wing tips, though, they don't look quite the same. I'd need photos of the AS.37 to be able to compare.
 
It is quite curious that the designer chose to put rudders on the wingtip endplates. There is very little moment arm to the c.g., and that might explain the additional, more conventional rudder in the back.
Pretty cool design, do post more info if you find some! :)
 
Here are the photos from Pierre Gaillards "Avions Francais 1965-90".
The endplates are set at an angle of about 35° against the horizontal,
so the rudders are used as ailerons, I think.
 

Attachments

  • AS-37_01.jpg
    AS-37_01.jpg
    23.8 KB · Views: 661
  • AS-37_02.jpg
    AS-37_02.jpg
    25.3 KB · Views: 655
In the French press I have seen the term "Nenadovich biplane" applied both to tandem-wing designs (Mignet, Delanne, etc.) and to aircraft with conventional tail surfaces but using two biplane wings in a staggered, box-wing configuration (Stark AS.27 and AS.37, for example). The key concept seems to be the slot effect between the two wings. Does anyone know any more about the origin of this terminology and, presumably, the aircraft designed or built by Mr. Nenadovich that inspired it?
 

Attachments

  • Avion%20Ancien%20Starck%20AS-37b.jpg
    Avion%20Ancien%20Starck%20AS-37b.jpg
    9.2 KB · Views: 1,146
Miroslave Nenadovitch was working at the Institut Aeronautique of St Cyr, close to Paris, in 1936.

Rush translation of the article (below) from Aviation magazine concerning the Starck AS-27 (date ?).
"Nenadovitch tested in wind-tunnel around 150 biplanes configurations. His configuration presented a lower Cx max and higher Cz max than an equivalent monoplane formula. His configuration did not stalled at high incidence angles. In fact the top of the polar was absolutely flat. The two planes parameters interacting as a big slot always open."


I don't think he designed an aircraft as such, out of his wind tunnel tests. But André Starck did designed and tested his AS-20 in 1942 retaining this formula, then he used it on his AS-27 and AS-37.

Extracts from:
http://www.engbrasil.eng.br/index_arquivos/art72.pdf
Aviation Magazine (Date ?)
Sport Aviation August 1976
 

Attachments

  • Starck AS-37.jpg
    Starck AS-37.jpg
    94.2 KB · Views: 374
  • Starck AS-27.jpg
    Starck AS-27.jpg
    118.7 KB · Views: 373
  • Nenadovitch2.jpg
    Nenadovitch2.jpg
    24.6 KB · Views: 310
  • Nenadovitch1.jpg
    Nenadovitch1.jpg
    35.6 KB · Views: 335
Some details concerning the first Nenadovich biplane type aircraft built by André Starck, the AS-20:
1st flight: Oct 23, 1942 (during the German occupation of France, hence the German markings)
Span: 5,84m; Lenght: 5,30m; Wing area: 8m2; EW: 226kg; TW: 373kg; Max speed: 240 km/h; Ceiling: 7500m; Engine: 1 x Régnier 4D2, 74hp.

Photo source: LuftAchiv.de
3V drawing: ukn

Philippe
 

Attachments

  • starck_as20.jpeg
    starck_as20.jpeg
    29.4 KB · Views: 189
  • AS-20.JPG
    AS-20.JPG
    31.4 KB · Views: 214
With the exception of the AS.20 we are principally in the wrong section, as all others
are post-war types. But as the Nenadovich principal is older and there are pre-war
examples, too, I think, we could leave it here. About the AS.37 we had a thread here
http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,9070.msg81557.html#msg81557
Attached a drawing of the AS.27.
I once saw a small film of flight tests with the AS.20, in German colours, but couldn't
download it then. Will search again.
 

Attachments

  • Starck_AS-27.gif
    Starck_AS-27.gif
    41.6 KB · Views: 216
By the way,


nothing called AS.35,it was AS.37,and here is the AS.07 Stabiplan,I don't know
why they called it biplan (biplane),and what was the second drawing,it was a
sailplane,and not related to first one.


http://www.rexresearch.com/starck/starck.htm
 

Attachments

  • AS-37.jpg
    AS-37.jpg
    128.6 KB · Views: 179
  • AS-07 3-view.jpg
    AS-07 3-view.jpg
    39.5 KB · Views: 160
  • AS-07.jpg
    AS-07.jpg
    26.6 KB · Views: 744
Hi hesham, the first youve posted actually is the AS.90 "New Look", not the AS.07.
On the site you gave the link for, you'll find this link http://www.macla.fr/Projet%20%20Stark%20AS90.html
alongside the wrong labelled photo (actually, the link already has the correct name in it !)
And the real AS.07 actually is a kind of biplane ! ;)
 
from "aviation magazine"
 

Attachments

  • starck as 17.jpg
    starck as 17.jpg
    336.7 KB · Views: 177
  • starck as 20.jpg
    starck as 20.jpg
    566.5 KB · Views: 191
  • starck as 37.jpg
    starck as 37.jpg
    404.1 KB · Views: 188
aviation magazine
 

Attachments

  • as 70.jpg
    as 70.jpg
    575.5 KB · Views: 165
  • as 57.jpg
    as 57.jpg
    622.5 KB · Views: 164
  • as 37.jpg
    as 37.jpg
    287.4 KB · Views: 164
OK my dear Jemiba,


I speak generally,nothing called AS.35.


Great thanks to my dear Toura,and does any know AS.47 ?,I think it was not a project.
 
always "aviation magazine"
 

Attachments

  • sharck as 90.jpg
    sharck as 90.jpg
    605.1 KB · Views: 766
There were two more versions of the AS.37. The AS.37B with a Porsche engine, recognisable
by the cooling intakes, and the AS.37 MINI STOL, a more radical modification with a single pusher
prop behind the cockpit, necessitating a much lower rear fuselage.
 

Attachments

  • Starck_AS-37B.gif
    Starck_AS-37B.gif
    55.8 KB · Views: 657
  • Starck_AS-37B_Mini-STOL.gif
    Starck_AS-37B_Mini-STOL.gif
    58.5 KB · Views: 632
Retrofit said:
Some details concerning the first Nenadovich biplane type aircraft built by André Starck, the AS-20:
1st flight: Oct 23, 1942 (during the German occupation of France, hence the German markings)
Span: 5,84m; Lenght: 5,30m; Wing area: 8m2; EW: 226kg; TW: 373kg; Max speed: 240 km/h; Ceiling: 7500m; Engine: 1 x Régnier 4D2, 74hp.

Photo source: LuftAchiv.de
3V drawing: ukn

Philippe
Click to expand...


And from Aerophile magazine.
 

Attachments

  • AS-20 3.JPG
    AS-20 3.JPG
    70.1 KB · Views: 200
  • AS-20 2.JPG
    AS-20 2.JPG
    39.7 KB · Views: 507
  • AS-20.JPG
    AS-20.JPG
    73.7 KB · Views: 528
AS.37b (F-PYLM) and AS.57 (F-PEAY) are in storage in the reserve collection of Espace Air Passion at Angers-Marcé (q.v. http://www.musee-aviation-angers.fr/collections/avions-et-voilures-tournantes/).
 
Not qiute correct to post it here, as the design is from 1943, but as the AS.20 is mentioned here, too,
and a French project from that time probably wouldn't have taken to the air before the end of the war,
I'll post it here:
The AS.30, mentioned here http://www.secretprojects.co.uk/forum/index.php/topic,19129.msg187861.html#msg187861
by hesham, was a two-seat light a/c, similar to the earlier AS.20, but with a 90 hp Polymechanique engine, enclosed
cockpit and tricycle landing gear. Span was 6,90 m, loaded weight 562 kg and max. speed 225 km/h.
The short text isn't quite clear, if it purely remained a project, or if construction was started and maybe
even finished
(From The Aeroplane Spotter 23rd of September 1943)
 

Attachments

  • Starck_AS-30.jpg
    Starck_AS-30.jpg
    80.6 KB · Views: 173
Hi,

there is anther aircraft developed from AS.90 called Super New Look.

Jane's All the World's Aircraft 1982-1983
 

Attachments

  • 1.png
    1.png
    123.8 KB · Views: 141
Here-under 2 profiles published in the two-issue "Avions Hors serie" magazine this year "Les avions francais aux couleurs allemandes durant la seconde guerre mondiale / French aircraft under German colors during WW2" by Philippe Ricco (Tremendous work and stunning color profiles. Highly recommended!)

Concerning the Starck 37 F-PYBQ built by Rudolf Nickel, this aircraft has been donated in December 2015 to the Musée Régional de l'Air d'Angers (www.musee-aviation-angers.fr) where it will be on display soon.
Also attached a photo of the Stark AS-70 n°2 F-PBGI (original photo: Jean Bretaud).
This 3 photos were published in the "Magazine du Musée Régional de l'Air" n° 126 -Spring 2016
 

Attachments

  • IMG_0011.jpg
    IMG_0011.jpg
    213.8 KB · Views: 134
  • IMG_0010.jpg
    IMG_0010.jpg
    123.7 KB · Views: 136
  • IMG_0010z.jpg
    IMG_0010z.jpg
    313.5 KB · Views: 161
  • IMG.jpg
    IMG.jpg
    302.7 KB · Views: 163
From Ailes Journal 12/1944,

the Starck AS.51.
 

Attachments

  • 1.png
    1.png
    642.1 KB · Views: 119
  • 2.png
    2.png
    539.6 KB · Views: 122

Attachments

  • starck 30 001.png
    starck 30 001.png
    1.8 MB · Views: 94
  • starck 30 006.png
    starck 30 006.png
    2.2 MB · Views: 91
  • starck 30 005.png
    starck 30 005.png
    1.7 MB · Views: 101
  • starck 30 004.png
    starck 30 004.png
    2 MB · Views: 105
  • starck 30 003.png
    starck 30 003.png
    1.9 MB · Views: 105
That's a Mignet (Pou du Ciel) layout, without a tailplane, so I would rather regard it as a tandem wing design,
whereas for the Starck designs, having a tailplane, I would lean to staggered biplane. But you can find both
designations for both types ...
 
IIRC, that's true for early Mignet Pou-du-Ciel aircraft only, as they had no elevator, but the front wing was moved instead,
leading in a number of cases to an unintentional dive, which couldn't be stopped by the "normal" reaction to pull the
stick. After wind tunnel testing corrections were made to the design, but the reputation already was blurred.
The Starck designs all had a conventional elevator and not a tiltable front wing, and so weren't affected by this unpleasant
phenomenon.
 
Jemiba said:
IIRC, that's true for early Mignet Pou-du-Ciel aircraft only, as they had no elevator, but the front wing was moved instead,
leading in a number of cases to an unintentional dive, which couldn't be stopped by the "normal" reaction to pull the
stick. After wind tunnel testing corrections were made to the design, but the reputation already was blurred.
The Starck designs all had a conventional elevator and not a tiltable front wing, and so weren't affected by this unpleasant
phenomenon.
Click to expand...
Do you have a picture of the modified plane
 
The cause of the sometimes fatal flaw was the interaction of the wings, when the stick was pushed forward
(lesser angle of attack of the forward wing) and speed built up. The rear wing, operating at a realatively higher
incidence then, would generate more lift, increasing the dive angle. And pulling the stick, the natural reaction,
just would increase dive angle further.... Perhaps not a big problem for an experienced pilot, but the main
argument for planes, like the Pou was, that it could be built and flown even by inexperienced people.
IIRC, It was the RAE, that discovered those problems, and gave recommendations for changes, one of them,
I think, increasing the longitudinal and vertical distance of the wings.
There once was a site especially about the Pou-Du-Ciel, with dozens of photos, showing examples of the original,
and modified layout, but I'm not sure, that those changes were very evident on photos.

But again, the Starck designs weren't affected by those problems !
 
Last edited:

Similar threads

Please donate to support the forum.

Back
Top Bottom